Koni Insert Info

[bonesmp5]

The stock rear strut has more than enough room for shaft travel at that hieght you are at -- yours looks just like mine and i dont hit the bump stop hardly ever. When i have the 17s on, every once in awhile i rub up towards the gas filler But we do need what you are asking for the front, no room up there on stock shocks

just my 2 cents

well i blew one of my rear struts two weeks ago, can it be rebuilt for a very low car?? shorten the tube?? i had the tokico blues on my car and they where sitting on the bump stops and the car was at least 1/2 higher than it is now, i had to go back to the stock p5 strut because it was about 3/4 shorter in the tube.. I need a short tube or just to change the insides so that it doesnt destory itself at the end of the shocks stroke..
the pic is last year, when the car rasied all the way up in the rear, and tokicos will not work with what you see..

 

[Jeff@Tri-Point]

hows this project going? I'm going to be putting Koni D/A Race inserts in my Protege.

 

[low_psi]

On hold until I can find a job Plus I need to buy new track tires and other misc parts... oh the addiction. ...must resist urge to max out credit card...

 

[Jeff@Tri-Point]

On hold until I can find a job Plus I need to buy new track tires and other misc parts... oh the addiction. ...must resist urge to max out credit card...

theres always getting another one... (poke)

About the Strut Inserts, they will be held in by a gland nut.

 

[low_psi]

At the bottom? I'm thinking about just using some hi-temp locktite to keep the top in place, there's only about .040" difference in diameter so it should work.

 

[Jeff@Tri-Point]

At the bottom? I'm thinking about just using some hi-temp locktite to keep the top in place, there's only about .040" difference in diameter so it should work.

Oh no, at the top. Basically use a tap and thread it and use a gland nut and volia. Atleast thats what I hope..

 

[dmitrik4]

that's a big tap. the gland nuts are available in a variety of thread pitches, which should make things easier.

 

[low_psi]

I don't think the gland nut idea is going to work. The OD of the insert is 1.71," the ID of the OEM strut body is ~1.75"(can't find my calipers). That leaves you with a nut that would have to be .020" thick.

What I'm gonna shoot for is reusing the top caps by reaming the hole out to fit the Koni shaft. The bolt through the bottom should handle all the forces with the top cap keeping the shaft from deflecting. Once the struts are trimmed down to fit the Konis, the caps may hit the Ground Control collars, so I'll deal with that if and when it happens.

 

[dmitrik4]

I'm a little unclear on the construction of the inserts...do they have a threaded hole in the bottom (like the cut-a-strut inserts do)? or are they designed for rebuildable struts, with no method of attachment to the existing tube?

 

[Jeff@Tri-Point]

I'm a little unclear on the construction of the inserts...do they have a threaded hole in the bottom (like the cut-a-strut inserts do)? or are they designed for rebuildable struts, with no method of attachment to the existing tube?

no, the way these race inserts were designed is to have a gland nut that holds all of it in. These are desgined to be a rebuild strut insert... Basically custom.

 

[Jeff@Tri-Point]

Okay, here we go. The ID of the Strut body ~45.5mm and the strut insert is 43.5mm.

The Gland Nuts that are available from Koni would be 48 x 1.5 or 48 x 1.0. So what you would need to do is fine something that is big enough to fit over the stock housing that has a 48mm ID and weld it on. Then you would make a spacer for the bottom so it doesnt rattle around. Volia, you are done.... I won't have my strut inserts until a little while.

 

[low_psi]

Yea, you're right about the gland nut. I was thinking the 8610s could be fastened from the bottom, but looking at the catalog again, it appears they only use a gland nut aswell.

Time to do more research.

 

[low_psi]

Just left a message with Koni. I'm going to see if they can find a bottom mounted 8610 series insert from another application that matches our stroke/length specs. I think a WRX insert will work.

Jeff, the DAs are too much work, just do a SA lol.

Attached is the master plan.

 

[Jeff@Tri-Point]

Just left a message with Koni. I'm going to see if they can find a bottom mounted 8610 series insert from another application that matches our stroke/length specs. I think a WRX insert will work.

Jeff, the DAs are too much work, just do a SA lol.

Attached is the master plan.

haha, DA's wont take that long... Hopefully. Can you measure what hte stroke length is and the min and max length of the strut? Front and rear?

 

[low_psi]

Using OEM P5 struts
Front:
Stroke-7.25" | MaxL-21.75" | MinL-14.5"

Rear:
Stroke- 8.5" | MaxL-26.5" | MinL-18.0"

I can't find the measurements from my car though. I'll retake them sometime this weekend when I can get my car in the garage.

 

[Jeff@Tri-Point]

Using OEM P5 struts
Front:
Stroke-7.25" | MaxL-21.75" | MinL-14.5"

Rear:
Stroke- 8.5" | MaxL-26.5" | MinL-18.0"

I can't find the measurements from my car though. I'll retake them sometime this weekend when I can get my car in the garage.

How was this measured? To the first pinch bolt?

 

[low_psi]

Length is from the bottom of the strut to the very top of the piston(threaded portion). Fully extended=MaxL, fully compressed(bottomed out)=MinL. Stroke is the difference. There is about 2" of the piston shaft that remains outside of the strut body when it bottoms out, just enough for the bumpstop.

 

[Jeff@Tri-Point]

Length is from the bottom of the strut to the very top of the piston(threaded portion). Fully extended=MaxL, fully compressed(bottomed out)=MinL. Stroke is the difference. There is about 2" of the piston shaft that remains outside of the strut body when it bottoms out, just enough for the bumpstop.

Converting to mm
Fronts
552mm Max L
368mm Min L

Rears
673mm Max L
457mm Min L

Well you should try calling on this..

For the Fronts

8641-1420 Sport - Toyota MR Spyder
522mm Max L
364mm Min L

8641-1475 Sport - Neon
630mm Max L
436mm Min L

I'm not 100% sure how these ones are measured... If its measured to the top of the threads or its measured right underneath the threads, either way the rears would be shorter in compressed length by 1" and the fronts would stay the same... let me look more into the fronts.

EDIT: Just measured the Neon strut inserts and the OD of the body is 44mm however theres a portion of the body that sticks out just a littler farther than 44mm but it should be under 45mm.

Bad News

The 8611-1258 Race are almost the same compressed length as stock ones... i might have to do something differently.

 

[low_psi]

Hopefully Koni is good on returning calls, we'll see. Thankfully you have the full Koni catalog though. Let me know if you have it in PDF format.

 

[low_psi]

Gonna stick with the 8610RACE series, Jeff. I don't think the Sport inserts are going to have enough dampening. I'm going to try to get a shock dyno from Tokico to compare with the Konis.

Making a threaded section for the gland nut is much less time consuming than trying to track down bottom mount inserts with the correct dimensions.

EDIT:

Koni called today, sweet, but after talking with Jeff last night I had already answered all my questions. Its good to know I can get ahold of them easily if I need to in the future.

I measured the stroke lengths of the struts on my car this weekend again, since I didn't write down the dimensions last time. I didn't want to mess with the endlink nuts so the sway bars stayed attached, which limited the droop, but I was able to measure how much stroke the car uses during driving. The Konis are well within range and the addition of a 10-20mm spacer under the rear inserts should allow the rears to droop a tad more(possibly curing my inside wheel lift issue before I change to a 450/350# spring set). Once I weld the threaded portion for the gland nut onto the top of the strut, I won't be able to remove the GC collar, but I don't plan on going back to Tokicos once I get the Konis anyways.

Jeff should have his DAs fairly soon, so he can be the first to find any issues