Question about suspension upgrades

[ZooMazda24]

Previously I put H&R springs (lower) and sway bars on my 2012 Miata and there was no mention from the dealer of needing to do anything with the shocks/struts, so I did not give the shocks another thought. It was a great change, the car looked much better and the handling was a big bump up from stock, which surprised me.
Based on that experience, I am contemplating putting springs/sway bars on my new CX-5.

I am wondering again about the 'springs only' upgrade.
I never thought of this before but doesn't the shock/strut get compressed and its function compromised?
I would think that the springs and shock/struts should be paired somewhat carefully. Am I off the mark?
Talk amongst yourselves...

 

[N7turbo]

Yes, you lose shock travel.

But in my experience, the CX-5 has stiff dampers from the factory and can handle lowering springs without damaging anything. It's just ride quality that is compromised with the reduced travel and higher spring rates.

I plan on doing coilovers in an effort to improve ride quality, but they need to be specced carefully. I'm especially sensitive to it because of my wheel and tire setup, which reveal everything about the road. If I were still on stock wheels and tires, I might not bother.

 

[ZooMazda24]

I plan on doing coilovers in an effort to improve ride quality, but they need to be specced carefully. I'm especially sensitive to it because of my wheel and tire setup, which reveal everything about the road. If I were still on stock wheels and tires, I might not bother.

Please keep us updated on the items you choose. Thanks

 

[AL Cx5]

I went with BC Racing BR coilovers, Megan Racing sway bars, Prothane sway bar bushings, Specialty Products adjustable rear lower control arm and front camber bolts, adjustable end links. Wheels are Enkie 19 x 9 48mm, spun forged and Continental TrueContact tires.

Right after the above install we bought a tune for the ECU. I made several bolt on mods as well. FE is excellent. Throttle response is right now. Trans shifts quicker and smoother that stock.

Mild lowered, 1.5" front and 2" rear.

Yes it's a firmer ride. I have the shocks only 7 clicks firmer out of 20. The coilovers, stiffer sway bars and urethane bushings all contribute to a firmer than stock ride. It aligns within factory specs. It is next to impossible to have better handling without firming up the ride.

We like the slightly firmer than stock ride. Handling is superior. It tracks on the interstate effortlessly.

BC Racing gave us great support after the sale. I didn't like several items and they shipped me new parts at their expense until I was happy. I kept the other parts. I have a collection of springs and dampers left. I got very good and changing parts. LOL

We took a short trip with 5 adults and it handled great. I even passed a car on a two lane so smoothly the rear passengers didn't notice.

We have about 10,500 miles on the suspension and wheels. My wife loves "her" CX 5...

 

[N7turbo]

It is next to impossible to have better handling without firming up the ride.

This is definitely true. Don't believe anyone who does these kinds of mods and says "it rides like stock".

 

[bTwix]

I plan on doing coilovers in an effort to improve ride quality, but they need to be specced carefully. I'm especially sensitive to it because of my wheel and tire setup, which reveal everything about the road. If I were still on stock wheels and tires, I might not bother.

@N7turbo Also interested in the coilovers you spec and your full suspension build. My 2019 2.5T is currently running eibach pro kit springs (mild drop) with factory dampers, raijin 18" wheels with crossclimate 2 tires.

Planning a suspension upgrade / 40k refresh to tighten things up without losing much ride comfort: spoon collars, rsb, rear camber arms, coilovers and fresh strut/shock mounts. Considering autoexe for the coilovers & rsb but curious if anyone here has used autoexe suspension? B6 dampers are another choice but sounded a bit too firm.

 

[N7turbo]

I looked long and hard at the spoon rigid collars. I get the theory. I watched an install video on an R-34 in Japan. I've seen some people say it makes a big difference, and others who say it doesn't. I'm also aware it may make alignment harder, and they may be hard/impossible to remove. I put them on the back burner, but not ruling them out.

As for AutoEXE, I don't think those are available for the turbo AWD spec, so I skipped them. The primary ones in my crosshairs are custom from Ceika.

 

[ScottSt]

One thing to consider when you just do lowering springs is the bumpstops and how to trim them. This gets ignored far too often and you are taking an element of the suspension that is *engineered* very carefully and the tuners are telling you to "cut off x". they can help with stance, and also make the car feel like it handles better, but when you are pushing hard and getting to the suspension travel limits the "transition into" the bumpstops can be abrupt, spooky and potentially dangerous.

You can go down a rabbit hole and buy custom bumpstops. The Miata tuning world is *deep* on this topic. Would take a decent amount of trial and error but it's possible.

If you can find a well engineered coil-over, they will have the bumpstops engineered into them as part of the system.

 

[AL Cx5]

One thing to consider when you just do lowering springs is the bumpstops and how to trim them. This gets ignored far too often and you are taking an element of the suspension that is *engineered* very carefully and the tuners are telling you to "cut off x". they can help with stance, and also make the car feel like it handles better, but when you are pushing hard and getting to the suspension travel limits the "transition into" the bumpstops can be abrupt, spooky and potentially dangerous.

You can go down a rabbit hole and buy custom bumpstops. The Miata tuning world is *deep* on this topic. Would take a decent amount of trial and error but it's possible.

If you can find a well engineered coil-over, they will have the bumpstops engineered into them as part of the system.

Excellent advise and warning concerning bumpstops!

As mentioned, we took a day trip with 5 adults. We drove city, interstate and country roads that trip. I never felt the car bottom out or doing anything any different than with 2 people.

I've been down the lowering springs route on another platform. They looked cool and were harsh. I went back to stock springs.

At some point, a lowered car changes the suspension geometry. The CV joints are never straight. The control arms are not in the ideal position and so forth. This will wear parts faster.

I have coilovers and moderately lowered.

 

[bTwix]

Dug through the various threads and really appreciate the deep dives from @AL Cx5 @CX_MCHNE @N7turbo and @sm1ke which really helped narrow things down for my 2019 CX-5 2.5T suspension refresh.

Phase 1:
- Swaybars: Hardrace 7028 & 7691 - looks the same as Megan Racing?
- Adjustable sway bar end links front/rear for zero preload: MaXeedingRods (link) vs. Corksport
- Sway bar bushings: Prothane (red) / JB Racing - with silicone grease with 90 zerk fittings
- Rear camber: LYKT adj. upper control arm or SPC adjustable lower control arm or Megan upper
- Spoon collars: front (50261-GJ2-000), rear (50300-GJ2-000) - have to drop the subframe anyways

Phase 2:
- Coilovers: Ceika Type M1 vs BC Racing BR - leaning towards Ceika (report)
- Front camber bolts: SPC bolts weren't needed for my current Eibach pro kit 30mm drop

Wheels are Enkie Raijin 18 x 8 45mm and CrossClimate2 tires.

@AL Cx5 - any longer term update on the MaXeedingRods adjustable end links? any issues?

@N7turbo - how are the LYKT adj. upper control arms working out? looks like a few months after install you confirmed the LYKT control arms work well and look OEM. any issues since?

Anyone else (report) with the Ceika Type M1 installed? Looking for balanced ride & performance.

 

[AL Cx5]

Dug through the various threads and really appreciate the deep dives from @AL Cx5 @CX_MCHNE @N7turbo and @sm1ke which really helped narrow things down for my 2019 CX-5 2.5T suspension refresh.

Phase 1:
- Swaybars: Hardrace 7028 & 7691 - looks the same as Megan Racing?
- Adjustable sway bar end links front/rear for zero preload: MaXeedingRods (link) vs. Corksport
- Sway bar bushings: Prothane (red) / JB Racing - with silicone grease with 90 zerk fittings
- Rear camber: LYKT adj. upper control arm or SPC adjustable lower control arm or Megan upper
- Spoon collars: front (50261-GJ2-000), rear (50300-GJ2-000) - have to drop the subframe anyways

Phase 2:
- Coilovers: Ceika Type M1 vs BC Racing BR - leaning towards Ceika (report)
- Front camber bolts: SPC bolts weren't needed for my current Eibach pro kit 30mm drop

Wheels are Enkie Raijin 18 x 8 45mm and CrossClimate2 tires.

@AL Cx5 - any longer term update on the MaXeedingRods adjustable end links? any issues?

@N7turbo - how are the LYKT adj. upper control arms working out? any issues?

Anyone else (report) with the Ceika Type M1 installed? Looking for balanced ride & performance.

GREAT list of parts. This should make it easier for other folks in the future!

We were between the Raijin and GTCO2 wheels. My wife voted for the GRCO2.

My MaXeedRods are working fine after 11,000 miles. Same goes for the Prothane urethan sway bar bushings and SPC adjustable lower control arm. Same thing with the BC Racing coilovers.

The cost of camber bolts out weighs paying to get a second alignment if it doesn't come in to factory specs. My front was out of spec.

I see you are looking at upper control arms for the rear. The adjustable lower control arm is much easier to install and adjust. I'm glad you are not buying on price. For me it was worth the extra cost.

I don't see the advantage of spoon collars. Sort of pricey for veg benefits.

 

[bTwix]

The cost of camber bolts out weighs paying to get a second alignment if it doesn't come in to factory specs. My front was out of spec.

I see you are looking at upper control arms for the rear. The adjustable lower control arm is much easier to install and adjust. I'm glad you are not buying on price. For me it was worth the extra cost.

I don't see the advantage of spoon collars. Sort of pricey for veg benefits.

Agree on the front camber bolts. Took them with me for original alignment. Better to have them on hand and can easily return them after.

re: Upper control arms, my wheels are 45mm and looking to have them stick out a tiny bit more. Sounds like the lower control arms bring the bottom of the wheel closer to the body to correct negative camber. I might regret this since upper arms requires dropping the subframe.

re: spoon collars - generally agree, but they came highly recommended by several folks so going to give them try.

 

[N7turbo]

- Adjustable sway bar end links front/rear for zero preload: MaXeedingRods (link) vs. Corksport

Neither of these are the correct length for a 2" drop.

I have been under this car for longer than I care to admit dialing in the adjustable end links for the Corksport lowering springs (2" front and rear). I have a post somewhere with the correct lengths, and what to do to keep them from coming loose.

 

[N7turbo]

@N7turbo - how are the LYKT adj. upper control arms working out? looks like a few months after install you confirmed the LYKT control arms work well and look OEM. any issues since?

No issues that I can tell. The only hassle is the wheels have to come off to adjust them, but they may all be that way.

Agree on the front camber bolts. Took them with me for original alignment. Better to have them on hand and can easily return them after.

I skipped them and am ok with -1° up front. It will help when turning and it isn't excessive, in my opinion.

re: Upper control arms, my wheels are 45mm and looking to have them stick out a tiny bit more. Sounds like the lower control arms bring the bottom of the wheel closer to the body to correct negative camber. I might regret this since upper arms requires dropping the subframe.

When I corrected my rear camber, it flushed out my wheels better than I had expected. It brought the top of the wheel out 3-5mm. You may think you need 5mm spacers...you don't once you zero the rear camber.

 

[AL Cx5]

Agree on the front camber bolts. Took them with me for original alignment. Better to have them on hand and can easily return them after.

re: Upper control arms, my wheels are 45mm and looking to have them stick out a tiny bit more. Sounds like the lower control arms bring the bottom of the wheel closer to the body to correct negative camber. I might regret this since upper arms requires dropping the subframe.

re: spoon collars - generally agree, but they came highly recommended by several folks so going to give them try.

As the car is lowered the top of the tire goes towards the car and the bottom of the tire goes away, called negative camber.

I installed my camber bolts on the top bolt of the front struts and put them in the neutral position. I told the shop I had camber bolts installed IF they were needed. My alignment sheet showed 2 degrees of negative front camber. It came back spot on and no charge for making an extra adjustment. IF the shop has to install the bolts, expect a charge for the extra labor to remove the wheels and install. This is a Penny wise, dollar foolish deal....

It makes no difference which device you use to fix neg camber. In the end the wheel will be in the neutral OEM position, in alignment spec. Top control arm pushes out and the lower pulls the tire in to the spec position. If you want a tuner look or autocross, run neg camber and BUY stock in your fav tire company.

FE will suffer too. Dragging the inner tread along the road eats up FE. On the forums where guys work on FE, alignment is spot on for the above reason. Our Turbo is getting 25 city and 32 to 33 highway. If you have negative camber, FE will SUFFER.

Braking is also effected, not as much tread on the pavement. Same with traction.....

I know this pic is an extreme example but you get my drift.

 

[bTwix]

Neither of these are the correct length for a 2" drop.

I have been under this car for longer than I care to admit dialing in the adjustable end links for the Corksport lowering springs (2" front and rear). I have a post somewhere with the correct lengths, and what to do to keep them from coming loose.

The final zero-preload sway bar link lengths with the Corksport 2" lowering springs are:

Front: ~342mm
Rear: ~125mm (set to 122 for better thread engagement--I wanted at least two full turns on the threads)

If someone is looking for a cheaper option, these might work. I can't vouch for them, but the lengths and studs are correct. As it sits I have the Super Pros maxed out, so a little more length would be nice.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/ (commissions earned)

• Adjustable Adapter Lengths: 135-175mm, 205-245mm, 255-295mm

So @N7turbo are you saying for a 2" Corksport drop:

• front links: want 342mm so MaXpeedingrods 255-295mm is 47mm too short?
• rear links: want 125mm so MaXpeedingrods 135-175mm is 10mm too long?

If my drop is 1" or 3" (instead of 2") what should the target length of the links be?

 

[AL Cx5]

https://www.amazon.com/dp/ (commissions earned)

• Adjustable Adapter Lengths: 135-175mm, 205-245mm, 255-295mm

So @N7turbo are you saying for a 2" Corksport drop:

• front links: want 342mm so MaXpeedingrods 255-295mm is 47mm too short?
• rear links: want 125mm so MaXpeedingrods 135-175mm is 10mm too long?

If my drop is 1" or 3" (instead of 2") what should the target length of the links be?

I dropped my ride 1.5" front and 2" rear. The rear sits a little higher than the front, so I lowered it .5" more than the front. Fully loaded it works like this.

We came up with 1.5" lower front so it will clear MOST parking lot stops....so far. The look is not in your face, "I'm lowered"! Rather it has a little attitude. But each to their own. It's funny, women pick up on something is different about the car. I see a couple walking by the car and the woman does a double take. The guy just walks straight ahead. Not my intension...

My MaX links work on my setup. I'm not promoting or telling anyone how to do anything.

It's been over a year since I was modding this car. I can't help you with the correct end links.

Even thou some of us have blazed the trail, be prepared to adjust and tune the suspension a few times to get it where you like it. It's new enough that it's not a one and done deal.

 

[N7turbo]

When these cars are lowered, the front links have to get longer, and the rear, shorter.

The best you can do to estimate what length you will need is to add or subtract from my results.

Here is what I have:

Front (just barely long enough for a 2" drop)
Rear (these become just long enough when dropping 2" and could probably handle 3")

If I were doing it again for my 2" drop I would get a set that's slightly longer so I don't have to run minimum thread engagement (2 turns). Haven't had issues though since I put threadlocker on them, but they are maxed out. Here's an alternative:

I found these after I had already installed my set. If you're okay with green, they should be perfect if you can find a distributor.

Tein Adjustable Sway Bar Link Rods

I would get the M10-290 for up to 2" and the M10-335 for a 2-3" drop. For the rear, you want the M10-120 for 2". If lowering more than 2", you'll want the M10-100.

Don't forget to add washers and blue threadlocker.

 

[N7turbo]

By the way, I discovered these just now. Anyone wishing to try them will be the guinea pig

I am going to ask them a series of questions to get more info.