Hondata RSX

[leungwingkei]

I think the K20C and the F20C are quite different. The F20C in the S2000 is an older Honda engine with an iron block as opposed to the aluminum block of the K20C, making it a better canadiate for FI applications.

The Honda F series engine was also employed in Accord Euro-R, a Type R Accord for sale in Europe and Asia.

The K series are more technologically advanced in that they incorporate VVT with VTEC (for both the intake and exhaust cam in the RSX-S, only intake cam in the RSX), making the i-VTEC. It helps smooth out the power band with both cam phasing by the VVT and the cam profile shifting of the VTEC.

The F series on the other hand has DOHC VTEC, in which there is not VVT. In orders, the switchover to the big lobes during high rpms is more appearant.

 

[leungwingkei]

For the RSX-S' prices in Canada which is around 34K CAN. I think the TSX is much better value for an additional 2K.

 

[APEXiTypeS]

Hondata lowered the VTEC for one reason. To make the powerband as smooth as possible. I don't know who told you that you need aftermarket cams to lower you VTEC, but thats complete bs. After THOUSANDS of hours on the dyno, they figured that 5200rpm was the BEST rpm for the switchover to occur. Lets not forget, they didn't just "lower the VTEC", they did all the fine tuning needed to make it work.

 

[toucci]

the RSX is my realistic dream car partly because of hondata

I just love the high revving smooth engine and slick 6 speed! someone slap me!

 

[Notorious]

*slap*


there you go bro!

 

[APEXiTypeS]

Ill post a couple videos for you boys tomorrow. Give you an idea of what a very minor bolt on rsx runs like (mine).

 

[jaje]

the rsx uses variable cam timing and not VVT (that is a toyota term for plain variable valve timing)...here is how the normal vtec system works and why most other mfgrs supposed variable valve timing systems cannot produce as much power(http://www.edmunds.com/news/innovations/articles/43849/article.html)

it is the ability of an ecu to tune the engine throughout the powerband (timing via 3 stage intake manifolds, timing via cam phasing - low lift to high lift, and cam timing)...the ability for an engine to give decent low end torque and yet still give a high amount of torque at high rpms (7k+) which is amplified by gearing makes the wild hp #s and makes a rather small engine extremely powerful

 

[Kooldino]

That's stupid. I would like to see the dyno results of that. The cam profile switches over at a certain RPM for a reason. The cam profiles when VTEC is "engaged" work well at high RPMs. Switch over sooner and you will lose torque.

That's what I'm thinking.

 

[charles]

That's what I'm thinking.

Well it was my ASSUMPTION that from the factory the engagement of the secondary lobes is timed so that it maximizes power. But that's just an ASSUMPTION, I should be more careful with my words. I don't know Hondas that well.

 

[LinuxRacr]

Let's not forget, as mention above, that along with the lowered Vtec switchover came retuning for it via the Hondata.

 

[APEXiTypeS]

Well it was my ASSUMPTION that from the factory the engagement of the secondary lobes is timed so that it maximizes power. But that's just an ASSUMPTION, I should be more careful with my words. I don't know Hondas that well.

Thank you LinuxRacr for actually reading what I wrote. The rpm at which VTEC engages is NOT optimized for the most performance from factory. Honda cares a great deal about every car being a lev. If honda wanted it to, they could have had a 250hp n/a 2.0L rsx.....If they wanted.

FYI: There are Honda engineers working with Hondata.

 

[Stealth5]

is s2k an lev?

 

[APEXiTypeS]

yes

 

[APEXiTypeS]

so is the nsx

 

[TigrMsP]

It would be hard to say what mods would it take for a MSP to take a "Hondata type-S." It depends on what other mods the RSX has. Basically you install an intake, then tune, install Header, tune, install exhaust, tune. etc. etc...

A buddy of mine has a type-S, and the basic bolt-ons add up to 50 whp. It's a quick car.

 

[APEXiTypeS]

You don't tune for every mod. The Hondata ecu is tuned for a cai and thats it. If you install an exhaust, or other small things there is no need to tune it. If you install a race header, then you need an APEXi sacf to tune the air fuel. There are seperate tunes for type r cams and manifold, and also for the "toda kit" the "hytech kit" and some other kits too. My point is, once you have your ecu tuned, that it....No more sending it out to cali. Unless of course you do cams.

 

[Black Majik MSP]

Here are all of his videos of the RSX: http://www.msprotege.com/vbb225/showthread.php?threadid=42780

 

[big_ben]

I think the K20C and the F20C are quite different. The F20C in the S2000 is an older Honda engine with an iron block as opposed to the aluminum block of the K20C, making it a better canadiate for FI applications.

The Honda F series engine was also employed in Accord Euro-R, a Type R Accord for sale in Europe and Asia.

The K series are more technologically advanced in that they incorporate VVT with VTEC (for both the intake and exhaust cam in the RSX-S, only intake cam in the RSX), making the i-VTEC. It helps smooth out the power band with both cam phasing by the VVT and the cam profile shifting of the VTEC.

The F series on the other hand has DOHC VTEC, in which there is not VVT. In orders, the switchover to the big lobes during high rpms is more appearant.

The S2000 has an aluminum block. I think they both use the same block, but I'm not sure. The main difference is the head. The K20C uses the iVTEC system, the F20C doesn't. The F20C has 11:1 compression ratio, I don't know what the K20C has.
The F20C is about a year older than the K20C. And the block isn't used in any other Honda car, ie. euro Accord Type R etc. So that's just not true. The Accord uses a V6, not a 4cyl. You can get an Accord with a 4cyl, but it would be very weak.

As for lowering the rpm engagement of VTEC, the reason is what APEXiTypeS stated. Honda programs more for economy than for power. But the VTEC shouldn't be lowered that much or you will lose too much torque and hp in the lower rpm ranges. The S2000 engages VTEC around 6200rpm, most people lower theirs with the Vafc to around 5800rpm. Not much of a difference, but it makes a big difference on a track. Road course that is, not a drag racing car.

The RSX is very fast with the Hondata ECU and other mods. But I'm with APEXiTypeS, it will run what a stock S2000 runs, low 14's to very high 13's. (if you call that fast) I don't. I consider 12's fast. The RSX with a Hondata ECU and intake and header will beat S2000's all day long in a drag race. But put the two on a track, and the RSX still doesn't stand a chance against the S2000. You have to remember that the S2000 is a purpose built road race car. The car was specifically built to dominate on a track. And it does.

is s2k an lev?

The S2000's catalytic converter is actually very different than other cat. converters. The one in the S2000 is very high flowing, it uses a metal core rather than the normal "honeycomb" core that others use. In fact, replacing the cat. converter on an S2000 gains absolutely zero horsepower. The only gains are sound, it gets louder.

 

[big_ben]

I almost forgot. The K20C has tons of enginer mods for it now. The reason so many companies are making parts for it is that it is the new "civic". I'm not saying that in a derogatory way though. There are so many RSX's out there, so all the companies are going where the money is. The RSX probably outnumbers S2000 by a factor of 5 to 1. So why put so much effort into designing mods for the F20C when so many more people are buying K20C's. It's all about the money. And I don't blame them, I'd do the same if I was in that business.

But I've still got RWD.

 

[Glhboy]

My friend here in Indy has the Hondata on his 2002 RSX-S. I have not ridden in it since he got it though. Before he had it we both think that my Spec-V and his RSX-S were pretty even....not anymore! His car hauls from what I can tell now.