Which manifold? (56K warn)

[FSDET]

people who boost above 10-11psi usually end up with bum engine. When and if they rebuild they usually go with a bigger turbo so this manifold would be obsolete to them. I agree though that it'll make more power the higher you rev it up but don't these T25's start fighting their own efficiency at like 14-16psi?? reply is in red.

GT28rs bolts on to this manifold. gt28rs is capable of 300-350whp. there are VERY few ppl who would wanna build MSPs that are over 350whp, so i dont think this mani would ever be obsolete

 

[Mental Addiction]

You also have the GT2871 which is good for 400hp.You could also hybrid your turbo to make more than that.So the manifold being obsolete is by far the dumbiest thing I have heard in a long time.

 

[FSDET]

beau how does the gt2871 compare to the gt28rs ?

 

[Mental Addiction]

beau how does the gt2871 compare to the gt28rs ?

They are almost the same.

GT28RS
Turbine
-Wheel: 53.85mm w/ 76 trim
-Housing: .64 or .86 ar

Compressor
-Wheel: 60mm w/ 62 trim
-Housing: .60 ar


GT2871
Turbine
-Wheel: 53.85mm w/ 76 trim
-Housing: .86 ar


Compressor
-Wheel: 71mm w/ 56 or 48 trim
-Housing: .60 ar

They use the same compressor cover(machined inside just alittle bigger for the bigger wheel),center section,turbine side,etc.
The only difference is the size of the compressor wheel.If they are sitting side by side, you couldn't tell them apart.

 

[spacemonkey]

on stock motor and stock PSI I would say rusty old callaway for daily driven reliability and gas milage.

For performance MAM tubular manifold. But I heard equal length manifolds crack under daily use....dont know if thats true or not.

Whether its relevant question or not....ummmmm. I know they came out with a sexy manifold but damn.

 

[RyanJayG]

on stock motor and stock PSI I would say rusty old callaway for daily driven reliability and gas milage.

For performance MAM tubular manifold. But I heard equal length manifolds crack under daily use....dont know if thats true or not.

Whether its relevant question or not....ummmmm. I know they came out with a sexy manifold but damn.

Cast iron can crack too, and it certainly wont give you getter gas mileage than the MAM manifold. its a restriction, where Beau's manifold opens up the mid-range (where more driving occurs) giving more HP and TQ.

the manifolds that you've heard of that crack (this is no secret) typically aren't as thick as this manifold is.

I have no problem with Matty posing that question, but the major flaw in it is that he only cared about peek HP gains. Infact, MANY people have this problem when looking at mods. I've seen mods (not for our cars, mind you) that produce virtually 0 peek hp, but make rediculously hugh gains down low and in the middle. is it not worth its $500 (or whatever) price tag?

everyone needs to use their own judgement, so posing the question is one thing, but then trying to answer it for everyone, making up their mind for them then that is a loaded question, meant to be or not. ofcourse a vendor isn't going to like that.

 

[Brian MP5T]

There is an extra 10 Hp+ in just swapping the stock mani, that alone should be all the info you need

 

[Super Matty P]

I have no problem with Matty posing that question, but the major flaw in it is that he only cared about peek HP gains.

because thats all that was posted in the dyno video I saw. It's hard for me to use other infomration that I don't know is there. I do undertsand what yuou're saying though. I believe the same thing. My supercharger may not make more PEAK power than a similar turbo kit but I bet it'll have a nice area under the torque curve.

 

[Super Matty P]

There is an extra 10 Hp+ in just swapping the stock mani, that alone should be all the info you need

you should also mention how much that 10hp costs. I guess I'm the only one on this side of the discussion. I just don't see 10whp being worth $900 (boom03) . I hope beau sells a ton of them though. I have nothing against him.

 

[jurgs01]

Look at 505's dyno at stock boost (6psi). The MAM manifold made a smooth curve all the way. The stock manifold looks like a bumpy mountain. Reason I state this is because poor flow and swirling air could easily cause this. I am at stock boost until I replace the rods and P/P my IM and head. I will jump to a GT28rs after that.

For those who want a close to stock dyno with the turbo I might get one for you. If I get my wheels from AutoRND before the MAM dyno day I will definately go. Otherwise, I would be driving down there on studded snow tires (not an option).

I would definately recommend replacing the manifold, S-pipe, and turbo at the same time. It's a somewhat time-consuming install and would love to do all of those at the same time. Oh well.

The price of the manifold is in part due to the price of stainless. Go and try to buy some SS bolts at a local hardware store if you don't believe me. This manifold will look good in ten years.

Again, any questions feel free to PM me.

 

[RyanJayG]

I really wish the dyno operator would of done a better job. but on the 6psi run(s) he used mph instead of RPM in the horizontal graph. and in the 12psi run(s) he got on the car at different RPM'S affecting the low rpm numbers.

if we only had the actualy winPEP data I could fix the mph thing, but Rich doesn't have it.

hopefully we will be able to get some good controlled numbers at the MAM dyno day on the 12th though.

 

[Super Matty P]

The price of the manifold is in part due to the price of stainless. Go and try to buy some SS bolts at a local hardware store if you don't believe me.

I buy stainless steel bolts all the time. I don't buy them from local hardware stores. Prices are too high. I buy from online vendors and people without the high overhead of a "brick and mortar" type shop. Just fyi I can buy 3/8" 3-5" stainless bolts (allen head) for about $20 per 50. I don't consider this real expensive. Stainless steel tubing has gone up a good bit though. I know what you mean.

 

[505zoom]

I really wish the dyno operator would of done a better job. but on the 6psi run(s) he used mph instead of RPM in the horizontal graph. and in the 12psi run(s) he got on the car at different RPM'S affecting the low rpm numbers.

if we only had the actualy winPEP data I could fix the mph thing, but Rich doesn't have it.

hopefully we will be able to get some good controlled numbers at the MAM dyno day on the 12th though.

I answered this in the other thread, but the reason that the 6psi run is in MPH is because the car was so rich at 6psi that it had a little bit of misfiring. This messed up the RPM reading, and the line became a broken up mess when the runs were displayed in power/rpm. We used power/MPH because it was the only way to get a solid line.

I do agree about the 12psi runs though, he got on it a little later the second day... not much I or anyone can do about that one now.

 

[RyanJayG]

I knew there was a reason for the mph... but I forgot... w00ps

 

[Brian MP5T]

you should also mention how much that 10hp costs. I guess I'm the only one on this side of the discussion. I just don't see 10whp being worth $900 (boom03) . I hope beau sells a ton of them though. I have nothing against him.

Last time I looked I was up $20,000 US, so what's $900.00 for a sweet piece...

 

[505zoom]

Last time I looked I was up $20,000 US, so what's $900.00 for a sweet piece...

(mswerd)

 

[jurgs01]

The things I look for when I buy a part are quality, gains, reliability, longevity, and appearance (yes, this is important too). I am not the type of modder who gets the awesome hp/$ numbers like Blkzoomzoom, but that's not what I want. There is a cheaper manifold out made out of cast for those wanting that hiboost, and you can always p/p the stock one (though that won't change a design for flow that I'm not a fan of). This is a third option for people who want an overall awesome, reliable and lasting car. I will never hit 400whp, but I want to hit 300whp somewhat reliably and think I will. I am just trying to remove every possible restriction to flow before I do the easy part and up the boost.

 

[Super Matty P]

Last time I looked I was up $20,000 US, so what's $900.00 for a sweet piece...

wow, $20K on a $10K car.... (hand)

 

[tonkabui]

p.s. for those who think I'm bashing I'd ask the exact same question if Wagner, Hiboost, SPD anyone released this. In fact I've asked the same question about the Wagner cams. This is an un-biased question.

if this were really the case, i don't thing anyone would have a problem.

http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=82551&highlight=hiboost+manifold

not one peep outta you matty, and that's for a $350 manifold and NO DYNO results. i'm not bashing on juan's products, just pointing out the obvious. and as for your asking about wagner cams, i couldn't find anything. the only thing you ever said in a wagner cam thread was that the aem tuned NA p5's saw a significant gain. the reason why i even searched was because you seem to like to question MAM's cost to performance factor and i have yet to see you say otherwise about anyone else's products.

edit:

here's the thread on pclub of the wagner cams:

http://www.protegeclub.com/showthread.php?t=38041

again, never questioning its price to performance factor.

 

[tonkabui]

wow, $20K on a $10K car.... (hand)

i guess some people just won't take advantage of another person for $5000 in R&D and material costs.