lol NVM LAUNCH CONTROL, HELP ME WIT FFS!!!! lol i understand how lc works and have managed to use it but am not sure how ffs works. and trust, the car launches hard ehough at 3200 to leave stnags in the dust.
Cobb AP Discussion Thread
- Thread starter djdanny5000
- Start date
lol NVM LAUNCH CONTROL, HELP ME WIT FFS!!!! lol i understand how lc works and have managed to use it but am not sure how ffs works. and trust, the car launches hard ehough at 3200 to leave stnags in the dust.
6000 is too high on FFS. Try somewhere around 5000. I even dropped my normal rev limiter to 6600.
so how does it work though. FFS will not run untill i break the FFS rev limiter??? or what happens. does it drop back down to the limiter no matter where i shift at? thats what i am wondering. does it hold revs or what. thats what i wanna know.
Speedsicks
Member
- :
- 2007 MS6
Dude you're going to give yourself a heart attack. While driving above your LC vehicle speed limit, when you have the gas pedal to the floor, and push the clutch in, your RPMs drop to whatever you set your FFS rev limiter to. I don't know the answer to your question about whether or not you have to pass that limit for it to engage because it's not really relevant. I'm willing to guess that if you are below that marker, with the pedal to the floor, and push the clutch in, it will probably rise to your FFS rev limiter. But it is irrelevant. The purpose of it is so that when you are going WOT, about to redline, you leave the pedal down, push in the clutch and it cuts fuel to the engine so you don't need to lift off the gas.
Quik 6, I've read on some other forums that if your FFS is set below a few hundred RPM's under your shift point, it's pretty much pointless. So 6000 might not be a bad idea. Mine is set at 5100, and I've never shifted slow enough where it actually made it back down to the FFS rev limit. But it's nice not having to lift off the gas.
Its less harsh on the drivetrain the closer you set it to where the next gear falls. I believe when you shift at redline the next gears goes in around 5 grand. So setting it at 6k the clutch has to take 1k rpms more abuse. I have had mine set at 4900 for a while. Shifts pretty smooth. Just bumped it up to 5200 to see how it feels and if it gives any more burst of accelleration.
- :
- 2007 Mazdaspeed 6 Sport
You guys are all really pretty close on this FFS thing. It's good to see folks talking with one another. I'm just going to comment a little more on what a couple of you have stated.
Essentially, there are three conditions for FFS to engage. First, you must have the clutch pressed down (you're basically in neutral by doing this). Second, the accelerator pedal must be pressed all the way down. Third, the vehicle must be over the launch control vehicle speed. If you meet these three conditions, the engine will rev up to and just over (100-200 revs) the FFS rev limiter.
Meeting those same conditions, but being under the launch control vehicle speed will rev you to your LC rev limiter.
It is important to note that both the LC and FFS rev limiters will not maintain an exact rev level. Instead, you will see the tachometer bounce from your set level to about 200 revs above. By doing this, it guarantees that your launch or shift will at least be on par with your setting.
To set these rev limiters up, some users have datalogged a full pull on their car (gears 1-4) to find the most advantageous points they should shift. Ideally, you would want your FFS rev limiter set to a point just a couple hundred revs above where you will enter that gear from the previous gear during WOT. Mazda actually did a very nice job with the gearing on this car. It feels like the gears are too short, until you're WOT.
For example, shifting from first to second: let's say that at 5800 revs in first you are travelling 22mph. At 4900 revs in second you are also travelling 22mph. It would be safe to assume that when you shift from 5800 revs in first to second that you will be entering second at 4900 revs. By making this assumption, you can now feel confident setting your FFS rev limiter to 5100-5200.
The reason you want your FFS rev limiter to be slightly higher than the rev level of the gear you're entering is because when you engage the clutch there is some energy loss. The clutch will drag the revs on the engine down the more it engages. It is also significantly easier to slow an engine (and turbo) down than it is to accelerate them. You will likely also be making just a bit more boost with those higher revs. This will help really throw you into that next gear.
And that's Flat-Foot Shifting in a nutshell!
Essentially, there are three conditions for FFS to engage. First, you must have the clutch pressed down (you're basically in neutral by doing this). Second, the accelerator pedal must be pressed all the way down. Third, the vehicle must be over the launch control vehicle speed. If you meet these three conditions, the engine will rev up to and just over (100-200 revs) the FFS rev limiter.
Meeting those same conditions, but being under the launch control vehicle speed will rev you to your LC rev limiter.
It is important to note that both the LC and FFS rev limiters will not maintain an exact rev level. Instead, you will see the tachometer bounce from your set level to about 200 revs above. By doing this, it guarantees that your launch or shift will at least be on par with your setting.
To set these rev limiters up, some users have datalogged a full pull on their car (gears 1-4) to find the most advantageous points they should shift. Ideally, you would want your FFS rev limiter set to a point just a couple hundred revs above where you will enter that gear from the previous gear during WOT. Mazda actually did a very nice job with the gearing on this car. It feels like the gears are too short, until you're WOT.
For example, shifting from first to second: let's say that at 5800 revs in first you are travelling 22mph. At 4900 revs in second you are also travelling 22mph. It would be safe to assume that when you shift from 5800 revs in first to second that you will be entering second at 4900 revs. By making this assumption, you can now feel confident setting your FFS rev limiter to 5100-5200.
The reason you want your FFS rev limiter to be slightly higher than the rev level of the gear you're entering is because when you engage the clutch there is some energy loss. The clutch will drag the revs on the engine down the more it engages. It is also significantly easier to slow an engine (and turbo) down than it is to accelerate them. You will likely also be making just a bit more boost with those higher revs. This will help really throw you into that next gear.
And that's Flat-Foot Shifting in a nutshell!
Last edited:
- :
- 2011 Mustang GT
Chris, that's a great explanation of how that system works. Nice job.
- :
- 2007 Mazdaspeed 6 Sport
Thanks! My brain works surprisingly well at 7:45 AM.
- :
- 2011 Mustang GT
Wish I could say the same about mine. Yesterday wasn't a good day and I'm paying for it now.
In other news, I'm seeing less knock, but my LTFTs without a flash are still really high. Keep in mind it's only got about 80 miles on it since I reinstalled the inlet and BPV, but it's getting better.
SMOKEYS36SHOP
Member
- :
- 2007 Mazdaspeed 6
ok just got my cobb ap...installed the stage2 93 tmic map...going out for a drive so i will post logs later i guess...i was going to install the stage2 93 mscai and tip but noticed it said cobb turbo inlet pipe so i didnt install it. i noticed also the tmic map said i get up to 19lbs of boost tapering off to 17 or 18...is that ok or should i change the map to just a stage2 93 mscai map?
- :
- 2011 Mustang GT
The maps with the inlet pipes are all identical, they don't specify a specific inlet over another.
SMOKEYS36SHOP
Member
- :
- 2007 Mazdaspeed 6
ok steve here is my experience...tmic map was spiking kr to 7.8 and the highest was 8.5...so after 10 miles i changed it to the more conserved map mscai and tip...and its a lot better..i only spiked to 3.5 once on my 30 mile trip and stayed around 0.0 and every now and then got 0.3 and 0.7 which is great..only time i noticed the 3.5 was when i let off the gas and my blow off valve fluttered a few times which happened once.
- :
- 2011 Mustang GT
See my thread about PT knock and what I think you should try. If the car isn't pulling fuel and cutting the acceleration, then don't let off the gas. It seems like the car is learning if you force it to.
- :
- 2007 Mazdaspeed 6 Sport
You should also note the recommendation to use Denso ITV22's (1 step colder) to help alleviate and prevent some amount of knock.
SMOKEYS36SHOP
Member
- :
- 2007 Mazdaspeed 6
well i have step 2 colder plugs blendercloud. and i was seeing very high knocks with the tmic map....so i changed it to the map im on now which is the Stage2+TIHMSCAI 93 v102
SMOKEYS36SHOP
Member
- :
- 2007 Mazdaspeed 6
the only thing i found odd was when my hybrid bov would flutter i would see higher kr numbers...idk why tho
lol, you just need to let your car know your the baussss.....
When i enabled launch control and ffs i seem to be noticing the revs hold way longer then they used to. which setting affects that? stage 1 + sf 91 map.
- :
- 2007 Mazdaspeed 6 Sport
I would change to the Stage2 93 MSCAI map. If after 50-60 miles you are still seeing knock over 1.5, dial it back and use the Stage2 91 MSCAI map.
Quick question guys. I know the self pro tuner software is now available for free DL allowing you to self tune your car. Ive been looking around for a tuning shop to make a custom map for me but most of them don't have the software yet. Im just curious as to how I would be able to mess with my own parameters but if I take it to a shop they cant . . .
I assume any time you get tuned using the cobb AP you obviosly need to own an AP correct??
Seems like common sense but im a bit confused right now. Thanks guys.
I assume any time you get tuned using the cobb AP you obviosly need to own an AP correct??
Seems like common sense but im a bit confused right now. Thanks guys.
