XelderX's BG FSP Build

At 120hp/110ft/lbs(?)

So....How long until you get the Mfactory unit? ;)

Gavin

Slightly more than that. Probably closer to 130hp/125tq on the 2.0L right now. Tuning the cam gears and running 103 octane w/ more timing should be able to get me to 140whp.

I'm not sure I can wait on the MFactory diff. I need the car back together before Blytheville and the release date for it is still unknown. I sent a sponsorship proposal to MFactory and I would love to work with them, but I cannot wait. I want to believe that they will take an honest look at my proposal, but they don't seem very motivated. I do understand though. I don't have long list of accomplishments yet with the car and it's really hard to sell "potential". If they can't promise that a diff can be in my hands by the middle of May I'll have to go elsewhere.
 
How much will the 1.8 make?



Iain

I would say CSP Miata power minus around 10-15hp since I can't get use the better Miata head. I do get less drivetrain loss being FWD though. The 1.8L is rated 5hp less than the 2.0L from the factory. In Street Prepared trim it's probably a wash between the two. Any chance I can get a look at the new clarifichange? I want to make sure my new mounts are kosher.
 
The clarification is not quite done yet, but the simple answer is "use stock mounts." The end result _has_ to be able to utilize stock mounts. You can fabricate replacements out of whatever you want, but the fancy mounts must be able to be replaced by a stock mount. You can use any Protege mount, combination of Protege mounts, but they all have to be the exact same shape as Protege mounts - length, bolt spacing, angles, reach.

Can't make an adapter. If you can't bolt the motor in with stock Protege mounts, the motor does not legally fit in the car. The clarification wording will be in the next fastrack, but that's the sneak-peek.



Iain
 
I'm working on lining up a new clutch/flywheel combo in the next few days. The good thing about the 1.8L 1st Gens is that you can use Miata clutches and flywheels. There are 5.5" twin disc clutches available for Miatas. Hmmmm.....
 

I had blown out my original diff a couple of years into owning the car. I was running it in H-Stock and was doing alot of ProSolos. The wheel hop due to the soft factory motor mounts and the drag race starts did it in. Since then I was much more carefull to avoid wheel hop when launching, got the stiffest motor mounts I could find, and have not had a problem. In HS- I ran 225 Hooisers, now in FSP, been running 275's for the past two years.
I currently have the OPM diff on my car (F-series tranny) and have really liked it. Justin's driven my car a few times and may be able to compare how mine works compared to the MS one.
The OPM is a good deal in that its half the price of the Quaiffe. They may even have some "in stock". If not, it just takes a couple of weeks for them to turn the stock diff into a LSD.
 
Can you have that diff welded? It looks like it'd be possible as long as it's squared properly. FWIW, it can be swapped into the 1st gen g-series box.
 
The OMP locks up noticeably quicker than the MSP diff. That has caused me to hit a cone or two in your car, Jason. Right now I'm hoping the MFactory helical gets released in time for me to use it. I don't mind spending the extra money for the Quaife, but if I decide to go that route I won't be able to make Blytheville due to funds. I'm not sure how I feel about using the OMP. I'm worried that I'll just keep wondering how much better the MFactory or Quaife could have been. I think this might be one of those times I just need to be patient and get the best thing I can honestly afford.

Can you have that diff welded? It looks like it'd be possible as long as it's squared properly. FWIW, it can be swapped into the 1st gen g-series box.

I'm not sure i could ever trust it enough to use it again or sell it. It would probably only be about half as strong again as a MSP diff that wasn't broken and welded...basically it woulnd't be much better than it was before. i'll probably just snag an open diff from someone and sell my transmission to help buy the big Q.
 
FWIW, when we were doing FSP VWs (and DSP prior to F), the Quaife was the _only_ viable option. Lots of people tried other stuff, and all who eventually caved and put a Quaife in A) went faster and B) wished they'd done it sooner.

Since then, a lot more options that seem a lot more viable have appeared, but if I were to do a FWD strut car again, I'd go straight to the "big Q." They are spendy, no two ways about it, but the best I've seen for anything else is "as good as...." - there might be other good options out there, but Quaifes don't seem to break, and they _do_ seem to work.

Dated info, admittedly, but IIRC, a Quaife for the VW was ~$1200 or so - how much are they for the Mazda? How much are the other options?



Iain
 
Inspector24 is also running an OPM diff. For his transmission (G-type) it was Quaife @$1300 or Phantom Slip. The OPM was an excellent alternative.

The road racers love the OPM and other clutch diffs because there is always some percentage of drive to either wheel when you bump a curb and go two wheels up. Helical gear diffs tend to revert to open diffs if one wheel goes up and then you have no forward drive. That said, there shouldnt be a reason for a FWD car to have a front wheel go off the surface in autocross.

One thing I have noticed though is that clutch diffs and helical gear diffs feel differently. The clutch diff (SM civic with a Kazz) felt very agressive. The steering feels heavier but with little kickback. There is a ton of corner entry turn in off throttle. Im guessing since the diff is always loading both tires so some extent, when you turn in there is a bit of drag on the inside tire. Its kind of like "diff braking" for the inside wheel. That seems to tuck the nose in faster in the corner. On the other side, getting out of the corner I had some on throttle corner exit push (probably again because the inside wheel is loaded). Given time I probably could have driven around all of that. Although I dont know how aggressive the owner of the car set up the plates in the Kazz, I imagine all clutch diffs will have some traits like this. It Felt really nice though.

The torsen is a lot more smooth/seamless. The steering is a lot lighter. Ive heard that some torsens, on uneven surfaces, can "hunt" for traction sending torque to one wheel and then the other quickly. A lot of torsens now come with preload shims to mitigate this issue I think. I havent felt this with the diff I have (Guru motorsports out of Oz) and they preload their diffs. Off throttle turn in isnt as aggressive as the clutch diff but on throttle corner exit is better. Get on the gas as fast as you can and the nose grabs and pulls you out of the corner. Seems as long as theres a little power going to the torsen its great. Off throttle.....not so great(mental note....more LF braking). Again, just takes a while to get used to the differences.

xelderx said:
There are 5.5" twin disc clutches available for Miatas. Hmmmm.....
When I had to reshim the diff bearings in my car I looked at upgrading my clutch as well("since its out....."). I was surprised at how fast I got that done considering I had to build it from scratch(no flywheel options in 116t size).

I was thinking about the 5.5"ers too, but my car isnt 1900lbs of CSP weight. I had concerns about how durable and manageable that size would be for a heavier vehicle. I worked with Quartermaster and I went with the 7.25" twin disk with the rally clutches(a bit thicker so they will be able to be slipped a bit more/wear longer). Your cars weight is between mine and the CSP miatas, you may be able to get away with the 5.5". If not the 7.25" is a viable option. Yeah, Its heavier than the 5.5"....but depending on how its set up (I used a 3lb "flywheel") the whole assembly can weigh the same (or less) than a 5.5" with aluminum flywheel. Oh, and it was cheaper to boot ;)

Either way...get one! It transforms the motor like you wouldnt believe.

Gavin (loves his GURU torsen and his <14lb clutch assembly...even though he stalls @ 3 times getting to the start line :s )
 
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Dated info, admittedly, but IIRC, a Quaife for the VW was ~$1200 or so - how much are they for the Mazda? How much are the other options?



Iain

Similar price give or take a hundred. The MFactory helical is still in production, but should sell for half the Q. There is a group buy for the 1st release run of them for less that $700 ea.
 
Torsen is the trade name. Think its a registered trademark of Zexel(???). Kind like "band-aid", "vaseline", "q-tip", etc, have become the de-facto name for a particular product.

Gavin
 
I still have my open diff if you can't find one locally. Also thanks for reminding me of the ticking time bomb I have in my transmission... (MSP not welded)
 
I still have my open diff if you can't find one locally. Also thanks for reminding me of the ticking time bomb I have in my transmission... (MSP not welded)

Hey thanks. I picked up another transmission from Boswell with an open diff in it. Looks like I'll have a good stock manual trans for sale in a few days.
 
I talked with Mazdaspeed Motorsports today. They can't do anything for me with the broken LSD. I guess I've had it too long. I did ask about a few other items that I'll probably pick up this week.

It's also time to introduce the car to the 21st Century. '94 Protege meet carbon fiber.

carbon.jpg
 
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