Xede Installed on my Speed6 yesterday

[Captain KRM P5]

So basically, this should not be attempted by anyone other than a professional and even then it is difficult?

Where the directions really that bad for this product?

It sounds like anyone who orders this will have to call XEDE directly multiple times just to get the thing installed. Even then it sounds like there are problems.

at this point we have our set of directions made up from our experiences and notes having worked on the product. the install is not bad once the right information is in front of you. once it is installed right there should not be any cause for problems.

Ken,
Do you plan to do installs/tuning at your Libertyville,IL shop?

I am intersted in 1/4 mile times. I would say low 13's and trap of 104.

yes we will do installs and tuning on all of our products and then some at Libertyville

i'll throw out a guess and say 13.4 in the quarter mile if jason knows how to drive j/k

as for dynoing close to 260whp with just intake and exhaust, frankly thats not realistic. the exhaust on this particular car retains all stock downpipe restrictions (read: catalysts) so its not a true TBE in that sense. like jason said, horsepower gains don't go 'mod + mod + mod = power'. horsepower gains are a proportionally cumulative affair.

 

[Captain KRM P5]

thats with the stock turbo right? if it is Im very impressed. what is the boost set up at, and what are his mods?

boost spikes initially to 22psi and holds at about 17/18 psi throughout the powerband. the car has a CP-E intake and the exhaust is a "down pipe back" system, so the car retains all emissions gear.

 

[MUSOM]

Please take no offense to this, because it is nothing more than my opinion. However, anyone educated in the sciences will tell you that you have, hypothetically speaking, gained nothing if you have not compared the present to a controlled mechanism (base dyno). 268 whp is just fine and dandy, but when you have no idea if you were making 210 or 240 prior, then how do you know what you have gained? Another thing, I would consider 268 a disappointment. XEDE has great control over A/F ratio and controlling the turbo, which are obvious on the dyno. The overall gains are much more impressive that the peak gains. However, CPE (with the same DYNOJET) was showing a peak of 247 whp with the downpipe ONLY and a 30 whp gain from 4k rpm and upward. Add in the CAI, and your turboback exhaust and (again, only from my point of view) there should be no reason why you shouldn't have a base dyno of 250-260 whp (including possible negative variables) So, as you quoted you "felt like XEDE added another 40whp" but according to my calculations, you getting no more than 10-15 whp gains?

On a more personal note, I will be installing the CPE EMS as well as the FMIC within the next week or so (praying). I currently have CPE CAI, downpipe, and catback exhaust system. If I had to guess, I would say I would dyno anywhere from 250-265 whp currently. And I then expect to be much closer to 300whp with FMIC and EMS. [According to CPE, I should be around 245 with the downpipe ONLY, and I have CAI and exhaust system. I can't imagine being less than 250.] So I am planning on doing a MODIFIED BASE DYNO with my current mods, and then will be doing a post FMIC/EMS + tune dyno. Let's just hope that I'm not dissapointed. Good luck with those track times. I still couldn't touch you there. I can't launch worth a d***. (wrc)

 

[jcgemt2003]

Your way wrong for thinking that your getting 300whp from all that....bolt-ons dont add up cummulativly...theres no way in hell that your getting 25whp from and exhaust and 15 from a cai.....then another 25whp from a downpipe. If you knew what you were talking about then you would know that is impossible. Dyno numbers can be altered with "corrections". I have a 3inch downpipe and custom 3" exhuast with a cpe cai....believe me theres no way in hell that you can gain that much horsepower from that kinda stuff...IMPOSSIBLE...go dyno your car on a dynojet and you will see that those numbers that are being posted for boltons are incorrect and they are trying to sell products...Horsepower sells.....I know there was a big gain because I can feel it and we tested the car from a roll on another speed6 and I whipped his ass. I gain nothing from posting my dyno numbers for you guys...Im not selling the product...I was there when it was dynoed and I know what my car did before...I will show you guys my timeslip from the track when I go on saturday...my best time before boltons 14.0.....after boltons 13.8....my best time now....just wait youll see.

 

[jcgemt2003]

If you really believe that mod+mod+mod=horsepower...your so wrong you should be commited...cai 15whp+ downpipe25whp+catback25whp..so you should be puttin down like 280 at the wheel....Tell you what...go race a 2006 mustang gt from a 40mph role and after he smokes you youll know what Im talking about. They weigh just about the same as the speed6 and put down about 270hp to the wheels.....HE'LL SMOKE YOU...i had the same mods you did and I couldnt even hang.

 

[Gandalf]

It depends on what dyno you used. If you used a mustang dyno your numbers are gonna be higher than that of the dyno-jet...on a mustang dyno i would be much higher....I doubt you have any were near that with a turbo back and cai....the numbers that they posted to sell you those boltons are not accurate....before tuning I could barely tell the difference in power with bolt ons.....in reality I probably made another 15whp with cai and turboback...and I was only running 13.8 in the 1/4mile. Your not gonna get a cummulative gain on bolt ons. 25whp(exhuast)+15whp(cai)doesnt equall 40whp gain...not from boltons my man.....more like 15whp... so in reallity your nowhere near 270wmp right now...maybe 235 at the very most...if you were that high you would be running 13.6 or better in the 1/4mile. Ill prove it this weekend when I go to the track and beat the crap out of my best time! I have nothing to gain from Bullshitting you guys....I make no money of this product...YOU WILL FEEL A BIG GAIN....!

Thats all fine and dandy, but I dynoed 236 whp on a dynojet completely stock. So I seriously doubt with a turbo-back and CAI I would still only dyno 235. Like you said if I gained 15 whp from both (and I think thats an ultra conservative number since someone gained 30whp on a MS3 with just a RP) then I would still be dynoing 250-255 whp. Only 10-15 off your mark.

The point of my post was not to contest your numbers, I am sure they are valid. It was to contest the gains - since we have no clue what you made before. If your baseline was 210 and with the tune you put down 265, everyone would be amazed (and wanting to buy). Now if your baseline was 250. . . well not as impressive. See what I mean?

Track is a great way to measure - sometimes. The track has a lot of variables, and unless you run at the same track every time - in the same exact weather - with the same exact track conditions - with the same exact weight and perfect launch everytime, its going to be hard to tell whether you gained 15 or 30 whp.

 

[MUSOM]

I never said that boltons were cummulative and I know they are not. I'm assuming a 215-220 base dyno. CPE reports about 25-30 from downpipe, 20 or so from exhaust, and 10 or so from CAI. 215-220 + 25-30 + 20 + 10 = 270-280 whp if cummulative. I said "i can't imagine being less than 250". Once again, i'm sure you have much mroe experience than me, but those are my assumptions only. I will be doing an dyno soon, and we'll see just how well my car performs with current mods vs current mods + FMIC and EMS. I don't have a stock dyno at all. Wish I would have now, but that's too late now. I have played around with an 06 GT and from 5 mph or so roll on, it was completely even, to my surprise. I had no idea the new GT's were that powerful, considering I have smoked older models on more than one occasion, *on a legal track*.

Also, my car seems to be getting more boost than others are reporting, and I think it might have something to do with seeming a little quicker. I'm reporting a steady 14 psi at 1 and 2, and at 18 peaks in 3 and 4 with a steady 16-17. Others have reported 2-3 psi less at each gear. This may have something to do with the turbo spooling up a little quicker via my mods. I'm unsure. I can't wait to dyno. Again, take no offense to what I've said, only opinion. I can only hope I'm right with my numbers. I'll be sure to post vids, pics, and dynos as soon as they are installed and tuned.

 

[MUSOM]

Looka like GANDALF and I are on the same page. I can't wait to dyno mine to get a good measure of some results!!!!!!(braindead

Thats all fine and dandy, but I dynoed 236 whp on a dynojet completely stock. So I seriously doubt with a turbo-back and CAI I would still only dyno 235. Like you said if I gained 15 whp from both (and I think thats an ultra conservative number since someone gained 30whp on a MS3 with just a RP) then I would still be dynoing 250-255 whp. Only 10-15 off your mark.

The point of my post was not to contest your numbers, I am sure they are valid. It was to contest the gains - since we have no clue what you made before. If your baseline was 210 and with the tune you put down 265, everyone would be amazed (and wanting to buy). Now if your baseline was 250. . . well not as impressive. See what I mean?

Track is a great way to measure - sometimes. The track has a lot of variables, and unless you run at the same track every time - in the same exact weather - with the same exact track conditions - with the same exact weight and perfect launch everytime, its going to be hard to tell whether you gained 15 or 30 whp.

 

[jdub260]

Remember all let's keep this civil and post your results. Time slips and dyno sheets speak for themselves. It would be great to have before and after's but if all you got is an after than so be it. I say a little information is better than none at all.

For the record I ran a 13.86 on a Gtech with no modifications other than a CAI.

 

[Speed6 Guy]

Show me the slip. LOL


Just kidding

 

[david097]

Musom, im guessing the reason you are seeing higher boost level's is because of the downpipe and catback, 4drhtrd saw I believe he said 2 psi higher just from opening his cutout.

 

[MUSOM]

david097, That's my assumption too. I may have gained 1-2 psi jump with the downpipe and exhaust. I hope to gain 1-2 from the FMIC too. That would be a happy day. I think I'll set my boost at 16-17 in 1,2 (hopefully with an 18-19 peak) and at 18 from 3-6. I don't think that is unreasonable, considering the turbo shouldn't be working any harder because of the 2-3 psi stock TMIC pressure drop it currently has. We'll see what the dyno has to say.

 

[david097]

sounds like a good plan musom

 

[StephanieT]

Good luck getting a hold of Shiv. I was lucky when I got in contact with him..

Shiv is not providing support for this application, nor was it ever implied that he would. Whomever retails the unit is, ie. Mazda Parts Online or myself. When we took over the Mazda Sales of the Xede, part of the deal was we provide ALL the support - past, present and future. And if necessary, we go thru him. The only reason I say something is because I have heard this alot lately. People are blaming him for something he is not guilty of.

As for Exhausts, the MOST we have ever gained with an exhaust was 19 rwhp. 3" Dual, straight back. Even then we were shocked and did not believe it. It is very rare for an exhaust to pick up over 20 hp. And even then, to get the maximum benefit the car should be tuned for that bolt on. Horse power #'s and psi #'s are good an all, HOWEVER, if you do not have an efficient system, the motor will not last as long and mileage will be bad. If you can make more power at the same psi, consider that awesome results. The average stock MazdaSpeed vehicle will have really bad efficiency #'s (below 7.0)

I am curious to know what the efficiency #'s are for everyone's vehicle. Call me crazy, but I would love to see a thread on everyone's efficiency number instead of horsepower. To calculate it:
psi + 14.7 (atmospheric pressure) = A
horsepower / A = Efficiency
If efficiency is Below 8.0 - car needs help
8.0 to 8.5 = good, average
8.5 to 9.0 = really good
9.0 or higher = Excellent!!!

For example: My Miata runs 243 rwhp @ 12 psi.
12 + 14.7 = 26.7
243 / 26.7 = 9.101

The stock MS6: 210 hp @ 14 psi = 7.317
Stephanie

 

[jcgemt2003]

Ok...Im not selling the thing all Im saying is that with the xede on my car there is a vast difference in power....3rd gear and up pull much harder than before....If I had to do it again I would, it was definatly worth it to me...Everyone was itchn to know what it would do on the speed6 and now you have someone who was brave enough to do have it installed and all I can get is well we dont know for sure what it really did.Well guess what...I DO KNOW FOR SURE..and this thing pulls like a ***** ape. If you dont want to believe me then oh well...your loss.

 

[jcgemt2003]

Shiv is not providing support for this application, nor was it ever implied that he would. Whomever retails the unit is, ie. Mazda Parts Online or myself. When we took over the Mazda Sales of the Xede, part of the deal was we provide ALL the support - past, present and future. And if necessary, we go thru him. The only reason I say something is because I have heard this alot lately. People are blaming him for something he is not guilty of.

As for Exhausts, the MOST we have ever gained with an exhaust was 19 rwhp. 3" Dual, straight back. Even then we were shocked and did not believe it. It is very rare for an exhaust to pick up over 20 hp. And even then, to get the maximum benefit the car should be tuned for that bolt on. Horse power #'s and psi #'s are good an all, HOWEVER, if you do not have an efficient system, the motor will not last as long and mileage will be bad. If you can make more power at the same psi, consider that awesome results. The average stock MazdaSpeed vehicle will have really bad efficiency #'s (below 7.0)

I am curious to know what the efficiency #'s are for everyone's vehicle. Call me crazy, but I would love to see a thread on everyone's efficiency number instead of horsepower. To calculate it:
psi + 14.7 (atmospheric pressure) = A
horsepower / A = Efficiency
If efficiency is Below 8.0 - car needs help
8.0 to 8.5 = good, average
8.5 to 9.0 = really good
9.0 or higher = Excellent!!!

For example: My Miata runs 243 rwhp @ 12 psi.
12 + 14.7 = 26.7
243 / 26.7 = 9.101

The stock MS6: 210 hp @ 14 psi = 7.317
Stephanie

YEAH...what she said!

 

[MUSOM]

I think you're underestimating a stock MS6 whp. I've seen consistent 220's from stock. So that would make the stock MS6 (220 whp and 14psi) make a 7.67 "efficiency". No where close to below 7.0 (like you quoted).

emt is running a 8.17 "efficiency". And anything under 8.0 you said the "car needs help". Just doesn't add up to me. (screwy)

 

[Captain KRM P5]

Please take no offense to this, because it is nothing more than my opinion. However, anyone educated in the sciences will tell you that you have, hypothetically speaking, gained nothing if you have not compared the present to a controlled mechanism (base dyno). 268 whp is just fine and dandy, but when you have no idea if you were making 210 or 240 prior, then how do you know what you have gained? Another thing, I would consider 268 a disappointment. XEDE has great control over A/F ratio and controlling the turbo, which are obvious on the dyno. The overall gains are much more impressive that the peak gains. However, CPE (with the same DYNOJET) was showing a peak of 247 whp with the downpipe ONLY and a 30 whp gain from 4k rpm and upward. Add in the CAI, and your turboback exhaust and (again, only from my point of view) there should be no reason why you shouldn't have a base dyno of 250-260 whp (including possible negative variables) So, as you quoted you "felt like XEDE added another 40whp" but according to my calculations, you getting no more than 10-15 whp gains?

On a more personal note, I will be installing the CPE EMS as well as the FMIC within the next week or so (praying). I currently have CPE CAI, downpipe, and catback exhaust system. If I had to guess, I would say I would dyno anywhere from 250-265 whp currently. And I then expect to be much closer to 300whp with FMIC and EMS. [According to CPE, I should be around 245 with the downpipe ONLY, and I have CAI and exhaust system. I can't imagine being less than 250.] So I am planning on doing a MODIFIED BASE DYNO with my current mods, and then will be doing a post FMIC/EMS + tune dyno. Let's just hope that I'm not dissapointed. Good luck with those track times. I still couldn't touch you there. I can't launch worth a d***. (wrc)

i simply don't think you will dyno 265whp with the mods you currently have, sorry. 250 might be plausible.

once again, just for reference's sake, its not a true turboback exhaust on this vehicle. the most restrictive elements of the factory exhaust system are still in place. the car performed almost no differently after the exhaust was put on the car. honestly i would like to see him remove the factory cats and downpipe so we can see some true gains from his exhaust.

time prohibited us from tearing jason's car apart and going back to stock. plus quite honestly, this dyno was meant also to disprove the erroneous notion that the XEDE does not work and the erroneous notion that it cannot control fuel. it does both of these things and does it very well. i have been asked whether or not we tried adding fuel and the answer is yes we have, and yes it works.

also, and this is my opinion mind you, we've seen enough stock dynos on dynojets with a variety of correction factors, climates, altitudes to know what most ms6s will be hitting with the few exceptions to the mean. we know the car hits between 210 and 220 for most vehicles. i have personally dynoed one stock at 205whp in ice cold weather no less. you don't see people clamoring for protege or msp baselines any more because with the rare exceptions we know where the car hits. so even accounting for the rare freak vehicle you will have or dyno variance, worst case scenario is that the XEDE is capable of adding 35 to 40 hp and best case scenario is that the XEDE can add up to 55 hp and alot more torque - with what amounts to very little work in the process. for just wiring something in and doing very little actual mapping to the unit on a stock turbo, the results are impressive in either the best case or the worst case scenarios. i don't see how its a disappointment unless you have unrealistic expectations of what a piggyback EMS should do for a car from just plug and play. there are $2500 AEM systems that don't perform this good out of the box on much more powerful cars no less.

all that said, yes i too would like to see a baseline run. i am sure once i have a base line run it still won't silence a portion of those out there. its simply the nature of things when it comes to posting dynos. i am sure this car could go run something ridiculous at the track which would validate the dynos even more so and there will be those who will still cry foul. for example, should we be able to run consistent 13.4 or 13.5 times at the track, mathematically speaking that would show a good 60 to 70hp gain from whence last the car ran.

this may surprise a few people, but i honestly thought the car was going to dyno alot lower than what it did. time willing and if jason or another customer is willing, we'll happily do baseline runs to satisfy people.

 

[vert]

or another customer is willing, we'll happily do baseline runs to satisfy people.

At which shop are you talking about? My MS6 just has a CAI and I would be more than willing to go back to stock and do a base run, then install the Xede and do another dyno run.

 

[jcgemt2003]

At which shop are you talking about? My MS6 just has a CAI and I would be more than willing to go back to stock and do a base run, then install the Xede and do another dyno run.

The shop in libertyville,Il....that would be great....Ill call Ken and let him know....maybe that will quite some of these haters up.(fuoops)