Grounding Cylinder Head Test Results (2024 CX-5 Turbo)

[SparkYellow]

I belong to the snake oil camp. While searching for grounding kits, the product reviews reveal positive feedback when installed on a wide range of vehicles. Nothing backed by scientific analysis though, just simple user observations.

 

[N7turbo]

While searching for grounding kits, the product reviews reveal positive feedback when installed on a wide range of vehicles. Nothing backed by scientific analysis though, just simple user observations.

Yeah and that is the problem. For example, the "alternative medicine" world is filled with snake oil and placebo. Little testing, regulation, or proof of claims. Fact is, if any of it worked, it would simply be called medicine. The "wellness" and "audiophile" industries are similarly full of grifters. The simple truth is that basic human perceptions are just not good enough to prove much of anything, and our brain is too apt to bias the results one way or another.

The car parts industry has had its share of snake oil as well. From turbo-boost capacitors to whirly birds in intakes, all kinds of things have been sold with claimed benefits.

 

[SparkYellow]

Yeah and that is the problem. For example, the "alternative medicine" world is filled with snake oil and placebo. Little testing, regulation, or proof of claims. Fact is, if any of it worked, it would simply be called medicine. The "wellness" and "audiophile" industries are similarly full of grifters. The simple truth is that basic human perceptions are just not good enough to prove much of anything, and our brain is too apt to bias the results one way or another.

The car parts industry has had its share of snake oil as well. From turbo-boost capacitors to whirly birds in intakes, all kinds of things have been sold with claimed benefits.

Absolutely! It's just that I prefer tinkering over reading or analyzing. Once I get the cables in, I will report back and see what adjustment, if any, is needed.

My parts shelf is filled with additives and snake oil, while other folks keep mostly *cough cough* beauty products in their cabinets.

 

[CrazyHippie]

Absolutely! It's just that I prefer tinkering over reading or analyzing. Once I get the cables in, I will report back and see what adjustment, if any, is needed.

My parts shelf is filled with additives and snake oil, while other folks keep mostly *cough cough* beauty products in their cabinets.

I ordered a 24-inch double ring 4-gauge wire. Once I install it and see how the length works, I'll order another. I like to tinker too, and I have a proven history of subscribing to snake oil - I got the covid vaccine.

 

[N7turbo]

@AL Cx5 you misunderstood the post. It was not an attack. It was a call on others that if they are going to try this, to please not just post things like "I think I can feel a difference". Posts like that will not prove anything.

Yes dyno results would be ideal. But these cars do not behave well on dynos, and secondly, most people won't have access to one or want to pay the fee, even if we could use one without torque management and transmission behavior issues. So we must be open to other methods, which I outlined.

The scientific method works because it calls on others to corroborate results to rule out erroneous tests. If you are confident that this works, you would welcome this, and you wouldn't feel attacked. I hope you didn't, because that was not the intention.

 

[AL Cx5]

@AL Cx5 you misunderstood the post. It was not an attack. It was a call on others that if they are going to try this, to please not just post things like "I think I can feel a difference". Posts like that will not prove anything.

Yes dyno results would be ideal. But these cars do not behave well on dynos, and secondly, most people won't have access to one or want to pay the fee, even if we could use one without torque management and transmission behavior issues. So we must be open to other methods, which I outlined.

The scientific method works because it calls on others to corroborate results to rule out erroneous tests. If you are confident that this works, you would welcome this, and you wouldn't feel attacked. I hope you didn't, because that was not the intention.

My apologies.

I have found measuring engine load over a set course on CC, same speed, same day. I use Torque Pro app and email a CVS file to my computer. I pick the same point on the list for each test and graph them on a spreadsheet. Engine load vs. time.

I found with grounds the engine ran the course at a lower engine load than without grounds. Thus the engine was making more power or running more efferently.

One could pick fuel other PIDs. I found engine load a good overall test method.

I used this test method to modify my 5.9 Cummins for better FE. I tested each modification this way. Some mods were duds and others surprised me that the factory design was better than mine! LOL After doing this test method to prove mods we move FE from 18 to 30 MPH over a controlled test route TWO times. Note that it was a stunt to get the best FE. Driving, speed and geography were picked to optimize results. Real world is around 26 MPG over 1200 mile trip.

Cheers

 

[jadmt]

I did not read N7turbo's response as an attack. I read it as if people try it please post some real results....I have no way to post dyno numbers but will post if I get mpg improvement or even seat of the pants improvement.. hopefully others will too...

 

[SparkYellow]

Got three wires now, two from the cylinder head (using existing holes) and one from the 5th bolt on the throttle body. Read somewhere else about folks grounding from the coil packs, but the bolts on my coil packs seem to be fasteners only... Further reading indicates that there are different cables (one spade end) for coil pack connectors.

Would like to get two more in there.

I understand that bare metal offers the best conductivity. I wonder if the factory grounding brackets are "less" painted than the chassis/exterior. It could be just a layer of primer. I painted some NA rims before and the metallic primer is like this greyish white.

Had no idea what the two holes on the back of the engine are for. Hooks and chains to remove the engine?

 

[AL Cx5]

Got three wires now, two from the cylinder head (using existing holes) and one from the 5th bolt on the throttle body. Read somewhere else about folks grounding from the coil packs, but the bolts on my coil packs seem to be fasteners only... Further reading indicates that there are different cables (one spade end) for coil pack connectors.

Would like to get two more in there.

I understand that bare metal offers the best conductivity. I wonder if the factory grounding brackets are "less" painted than the chassis/exterior. It could be just a layer of primer. I painted some NA rims before and the metallic primer is like this greyish white.

Had no idea what the two holes on the back of the engine are for. Hooks and chains to remove the engine?

Nice install!

Those should be good ground connections. If you own or have access to a clamp on amp meter it will confirm your install. This is a handy item to have around the house...

https://www.amazon.com (commissions earned)

I clamp the meter around an installed ground, start the car, turn on the headlights, HVAC fan on high and read the meter. If it's around 1 amp, then that's not the right connection point.

On a NA your Butt Dyno will give will tell a small difference. Like 8 HP, like a CAI but better. Turbos make so much low end torque it's more difficult to feel 8 HP gains. I had log before and after runs on "my" test course on CC. Then mess around graphing the results. More like a labor of love.

Here is an example of a steady state test using % engine load. Less engine load to move the car over the same stretch of road at the same speed = better efficiency or more power.

At point 3, this is when the car has to pull hard to go up a steep hill at 50 MPH. You can see how the grounded car, red line, engine load didn't increase nearly as much as without grounds.

In hind sight, it would have been more dramatic if I had run my tests from 750 RPM to 2000 RPM at partial throttle. To do this is more difficult. Looking at the WOT dyno graph of a Gen 3 Hemi, it make most of power at low RPM. So in stop and go traffic, a grounded car will either be more peppy or more FE. It ALL depends on the operator.

This is NOT a home run modification. More like a single. It has a payback in 1 to 2 tanks of fuel and keep saving mile after mile, year after year. I put these on and forget about them. If it save the owner about $200 per year, that's almost a nice dinner for two.

On below dyno graph the top line is the grounded engine at WOT. I made most of the gains at a low and mid range RPM. We ran this test many times and got the same results. We rented different chassis dynos to see if it was how this make and model calculated HP. Same results on other dynos. Interesting, HP or FE gains is about the same across the board on all makes and models, 8 to 9 HP.

Average HP needs to be ignored because the dyno operator didn't go to WOT the same on each test nor end the test at the same rpm. He could have only shown from 3000 to 5,500 RPM.

From 3,000 to 5,500 RPM shows how a nice increase from just from some cables! It would have been interesting if the test had started a 2000 RPM. Problem with going to WOT on a dyno at low RPM it puts a tremendous strain on the engine. My guess, at 2000 RPM the gain is more than 9 HP.

Top two "flat" graphs are torque, the other graphs are HP.

 

[SparkYellow]

@AL Cx5 you misunderstood the post. It was not an attack. It was a call on others that if they are going to try this, to please not just post things like "I think I can feel a difference". Posts like that will not prove anything.

The alleged benefits and ease of installation convinced me to try. If you were my neighbor, I would have installed the wires for you already. Time is what I have. I assembled two wood models in two days like an addict. That's an expensive hobby because the models I want to build are priced over $40 each. May need to start knitting.

My feedback will be like what AL got from his wife, daughter, friends, and customers. I might not even feel any difference, the mpg is already high and I always downshift to get out of harm's way.

Dyno was $65 (group special) when I attended a MINI track event 10+ years ago. It confirmed that my DIY intake did not impact performance either way. K&N offers Dyno results on their Typhoon/SRI kits because they sell these at $200+.

The grounding wires are less than $30 per kit. I came across a few big names (Big3, HKS, and one more) across several car forums, I will check if they offer Dyno results on their kits. Casual users like myself can only offer butt Dyno, we can't prove anything.

Edit: Big3 is not a brand, it is a kit that replaces three main factory ground wires.

 

[N7turbo]

If you were my neighbor, I would have installed the wires for you already.

Thanks, but not so fast! We need to record data before so we can compare to after. Dragy will probably be the most accessible, Mazdaedit second since the dyno will be an issue. But that is a nice gesture

 

[SparkYellow]

Nice install!

Those should be good ground connections. If you own or have access to a clamp on amp meter it will confirm your install. This is a handy item to have around the house...

https://www.amazon.com (commissions earned)

I clamp the meter around an installed ground, start the car, turn on the headlights, HVAC fan on high and read the meter. If it's around 1 amp, then that's not the right connection point.

On a NA your Butt Dyno will give will tell a small difference. Like 8 HP, like a CAI but better. Turbos make so much low end torque it's more difficult to feel 8 HP gains. I had log before and after runs on "my" test course on CC. Then mess around graphing the results. More like a labor of love.

Here is an example of a steady state test using % engine load. Less engine load to move the car over the same stretch of road at the same speed = better efficiency or more power.

At point 3, this is when the car has to pull hard to go up a steep hill at 50 MPH. You can see how the grounded car, red line, engine load didn't increase nearly as much as without grounds.

In hind sight, it would have been more dramatic if I had run my tests from 750 RPM to 2000 RPM at partial throttle. To do this is more difficult. Looking at the WOT dyno graph of a Gen 3 Hemi, it make most of power at low RPM. So in stop and go traffic, a grounded car will either be more peppy or more FE. It ALL depends on the operator.

This is NOT a home run modification. More like a single. It has a payback in 1 to 2 tanks of fuel and keep saving mile after mile, year after year. I put these on and forget about them. If it save the owner about $200 per year, that's almost a nice dinner for two.

View attachment 380197

On below dyno graph the top line is the grounded engine at WOT. I made most of the gains at a low and mid range RPM. We ran this test many times and got the same results. We rented different chassis dynos to see if it was how this make and model calculated HP. Same results on other dynos. Interesting, HP or FE gains is about the same across the board on all makes and models, 8 to 9 HP.

Average HP needs to be ignored because the dyno operator didn't go to WOT the same on each test nor end the test at the same rpm. He could have only shown from 3000 to 5,500 RPM.

From 3,000 to 5,500 RPM shows how a nice increase from just from some cables! It would have been interesting if the test had started a 2000 RPM. Problem with going to WOT on a dyno at low RPM it puts a tremendous strain on the engine. My guess, at 2000 RPM the gain is more than 9 HP.

Top two "flat" graphs are torque, the other graphs are HP.

View attachment 380198

Thank you! With the clamp on meter, is 1 amp too low? A better connection point would read higher? Can I use this one with probes? Got it when I had electrical problems in May.

When I monitored engine load in the past, the value was constantly changing. I recall that between the options of actual and calculated engine loads, only the latter returns a value. Are there any other values that I can check via OBD/app?

I need time to digest the info after the engine load.

 

[AL Cx5]

Thank you! With the clamp on meter, is 1 amp too low? A better connection point would read higher? Can I use this one with probes? Got it when I had electrical problems in May.

When I monitored engine load in the past, the value was constantly changing. I recall that between the options of actual and calculated engine loads, only the latter returns a value. Are there any other values that I can check via OBD/app?

I need time to digest the info after the engine load.

Yes, above 1 amp with the mentioned items turned on. I'll measure our CX 5 today and post. It's been 22 months since I checked it.

Yes engine load is constantly changing. My method:
Driving and logging on CC, same speed, same road, then load the data in a spreadsheet. Graph each run and compare. Tedious but I found this to provide reliable results.

Since my car responded favorly we can jump out and say that yours will too. Providing the connections are in the correct place.

I wouldn't stress too much on the exact spot on the engine. Generally on the engine cylinder head, on the throttle body and top of the transmission.

 

[AL Cx5]

Well my amp meter results were interesting to say the least!

Right head 5 to 6 amps
Left head 7 to 8 amps
Throttle body ZERO

I didn't remove the air intake to measure the transmission. I will check it sometime in the future.

So Mazda did a fine job grounding the TB. Good for them!! I'll do a few more tests on theTB ground in the next few days. For now, let's skip the TB ground.

This is the left side ground.

and the throttle body ground.

 

[RedBaron]

Right head 5 to 6 amps
Left head 7 to 8 amps

Something must be wrong here. After all the engine block *IS* already grounded (even if not perfectly). I cannot believe there are 5+amps flowing through these grounds.