You could in theory make circuitry which can alter the signal... but you'd have to get a lot of crap figured out... you'd have to convert a 36 pulse signal into a 4 pulse signal as appropriate. Is there a difference in any of the sweeps or not? I would think one would have to be different to indicate TDC.twilightprotege said:
Crank Pulley
- Thread starter twilightprotege
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twilightprotege
Member
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- 2001 323 Astina SP20 (P5)
man that's good info! thanks for your help! looks like 400 series SS is the go. and if it doesnt work, we'll just amplify the signal. but i'm sure it'll be fine. the difference in magnatism between SS and carbon steel is pretty minimal really.
ofcourse i'll let everyone know how it all goes.
ofcourse i'll let everyone know how it all goes.
Mad Hatter
Member
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- 02 Axiom, 02 MP5
TurfBurn said:well I'm working on scoping the CAS right now. Interesting little device and rather simplistic. The key will be what the ECU actually does.
What I can tell you is that ith a magnetic stainless that I have near at hand here just letting the magnet pull the steel against the sensor will generate a 100 ohm change in the sensor. Just sitting here the sensor has a 560 ohm resistance. The moment the steel moves to hit the sensor it jumps over 600. Then immediately returns to 560. Now the issue becomes how I can accurately test this to prove what you need... the problem lies in the profile of the tooth has to remain the same and that the speed has to be held constant. Well those are two things that are near impossible for me to do at this point...
Which leads me to the critical point. Digital circuitry like would be interpreting the signal from the CAS only cares about one thing... crossing voltage. If the circuitry detects a 1 as being at 5V (a standard logic voltage) then if you get a 6 volt peak it could care less it's still a one. In fact you may be getting a 12V peak and it only needs a 5V peak. So you likely don't need to be concerned at all about the magnetic ability of the metal. If it is magnetic it will work. And if it doesn't... you can add a very simple amplifier that will cost you about 2 or 3 dollars and that will correct your signal. Hell I'll build it for you for free if you pay for the shipping
Also of note... I noticed that it would actually further generate a negative return in resistance in some cases that would result in an increased appearance of the signal.. in simple terms.. the faster something moves the not only does the signal level get bigger... but the 0 side of it gets even more 0 like.
Also, it doesn't matter which wire you hook up to what. So feel free to swap the red and green wires as you so please for fun and just because.... the car will never know the diff! (the third wire.. the black one is the shielding).
Lastly, in your particular case... if you need to amplify the signal further... or want to ensure that it works, simply have the sweeps of the pulley that you showed made steeper... a bigger drop off the lip. That will generate a greater pulse.
And... for the geeks in the crowd... I find it interesting that two different wave forms are being used... the american sensor plate will generate a sloped square wave... the aussie version shown before will generate a triangle wave. But the important fact is that it does help narrow it down that more likely than not both vehicles are using trailing edge triggering on the sensor... Playing with it more for just a second.. the resistance (and thus the voltage drop across the sensor) goes up as the metal comes in, and drop when it is pulled away. This is inverted to what the CPU would see... it would "read" a voltage from the sensor and thus if the voltage is being dropped across the sensor it would see a lower value at the input. So flip it around and the moral of the story is that as the metal comes in the computer sees a LOWER voltage, and then as the metal tooth moves away you see a HIGHER voltage. Then, looking at the aussie plate you are moving the voltage DOWN slowly by moving the metal in more slowly (by having the ramp up to the point) and then are having the sharp drop off which will generate an INCREASE in voltage.. MEANING, that the ECU is looking for positive pulses.. so VERY much amplifiable.. and positive trigger based... (assuming a voltage based source.. if it is current sourced which is unlikely, then it would be the reverse of all of the above)
So anyway... don't worry about the magnetic capability.. if it is magnetic enough to stick to a magnet you'll be fine.. just don't use aluminum.
Longest reply evar.
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- MP5T / 944
(boom03)Mad Hatter said:
Umm, I'm sure it's not the longest, but it is a real great answer to the question.
REP POINTS FOR TURF! (kiss)
Mad Hatter
Member
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- 02 Axiom, 02 MP5
I was only joking
Mad Hatter
Member
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- 02 Axiom, 02 MP5
Ok, the pulley is on, and there were no problems installing it. No noticable gains as it was pretty icey out(not that I would have anyways). Thanks for the hand(and heated garage) Turf!
Mad Hatter
Member
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- 02 Axiom, 02 MP5
TurfBurn said:
I can't believe your home already, glad you made it safely!
so... there's no discernable problems with an aluminum crank pulley, right? the thing twilight is concerned about is really a non-issue? i tried reading through the long post that turf put up, but i got lost somewhere after the third line. i forgot to take my meds.
edit*: i just saw that part where turf says not to use aluminum. what about all the UD pulleys that ARE made of aluminum? people seem to be running them with little to no problems.
edit*: i just saw that part where turf says not to use aluminum. what about all the UD pulleys that ARE made of aluminum? people seem to be running them with little to no problems.
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twilightprotege
Member
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- 2001 323 Astina SP20 (P5)
the pulley part of the udp is aluminium, but it still has a steel backing plate and this is what the crank sensor reads
Oh and as kind of an introduction to the NA forum.
I'm Andrew from Davis CA. I'm tuning for FSP class in autocross. I'm in the SF division which is the most difficult in the US so I got a lot of work ahead of me. Of course from the sig you can all see that I have a lot behind me to. I'm not going after any kind of goal like a quarter mile time or anything. I'm going for overall balance and tune. That being said, my next logical mod will be a quaife differential. Even at these power levels I'm getting a serious lack of traction. The super had spring rates definitely don't help that either, so I'm fairly certain the LSD should tie it all together. Then it's on to build power with possibly the MPI tuner.
I'm Andrew from Davis CA. I'm tuning for FSP class in autocross. I'm in the SF division which is the most difficult in the US so I got a lot of work ahead of me. Of course from the sig you can all see that I have a lot behind me to. I'm not going after any kind of goal like a quarter mile time or anything. I'm going for overall balance and tune. That being said, my next logical mod will be a quaife differential. Even at these power levels I'm getting a serious lack of traction. The super had spring rates definitely don't help that either, so I'm fairly certain the LSD should tie it all together. Then it's on to build power with possibly the MPI tuner.
twilightprotege
Member
- :
- 2001 323 Astina SP20 (P5)
syd - havent even received it yet. it's been lost by usps 
good thing for insurance
good thing for insuranceI've got a V6 KL-ZE crank sensor plate from a friend to scan in tomorrow and then do a new lightweight design for it in CAD. This is the 6 pointed plate that Twilight posted up earlier. After I've scanned it and cross checked my measurements with verneer calipers I can then start cutting out weight on the new plate design while trying to keep it strong enough...
This is the first crank plate for the aussie cars I will have designed. I am very unimpressed with the qaulity of the MBXmotorsports' crank plate, it has irregular consistancy and a scratch on it one side! Twilight has been looking at places that can laser machine cut the crank plate straight off the CAD design, so it should be a high quality and very well balanced unit that's ready to screw straight up to the crank pulley...
By the way, this particular prototype unit should work on the US KL-ZE V6's too.
Chicaboo.
This is the first crank plate for the aussie cars I will have designed. I am very unimpressed with the qaulity of the MBXmotorsports' crank plate, it has irregular consistancy and a scratch on it one side! Twilight has been looking at places that can laser machine cut the crank plate straight off the CAD design, so it should be a high quality and very well balanced unit that's ready to screw straight up to the crank pulley...
By the way, this particular prototype unit should work on the US KL-ZE V6's too.
Chicaboo.
Hit me up man via pm... I can get stuff laser cut for ridiculously cheap prices because of the relationship I have for parts. We can see if it is cheaper for you guys to get them from me and ship in to Australia for you or not. But if it is an option I will do it for you guys!
Later,
Steve
NSN Motorsports
Later,
Steve
NSN Motorsports
Thanks Steve, you're a champ!
Twilight and I will need some good help when it comes to cutting the pulley. As usual we are the first to try this on our cars, the firstest and stupidestest...
I will give you a PM in the next week or so, I was too busy this week to scan the existing pulley to the CAD for it.
Take it easy,
Chicaboo.
Twilight and I will need some good help when it comes to cutting the pulley. As usual we are the first to try this on our cars, the firstest and stupidestest...
I will give you a PM in the next week or so, I was too busy this week to scan the existing pulley to the CAD for it.
Take it easy,
Chicaboo.
