ANOTHER Broken motor mount........ Its my turn

[M3_Zoom]

I'm not surprised the tech just told you "its strong enough" when you asked him what grade is was he probably has no idea what grade it is. I am going to the dealership tonight to buy a bolt. Tomorrow morning I am put it in the hardness tester here at work and then we'll know once and for all what grade it is. (There is a strong correlation betwen the strength of steel and its hardness)

If it's not at least a metric 10.9 / American grade 8 you vendors know what you need to do.

Nice! If we can get an upgraded bolt and a solid mount vice this two piece shearing deal the headache will hopefully be gone. VENDORS PLEASE TAKE NOTE! I might just contact a few of these urethane companies and see what it would take. I would purchase an extra side OEM mount to send in, if they are willing to make us a nice urethane one. At this point I would settle for a solid rubber OEM style mount and upgraded bolt for that matter.

 

[hunterbrandon]

Ok ive been getting a clunking noise coming from the drivers side of my car in first and second gear. took it to the dealer and they said its "normal" and they couldnt find anything wrong with the car. but from what im reading it sounds like it might be the mount...should i be worried???

 

[M3_Zoom]

Ok ive been getting a clunking noise coming from the drivers side of my car in first and second gear. took it to the dealer and they said its "normal" and they couldnt find anything wrong with the car. but from what im reading it sounds like it might be the mount...should i be worried???

Remove your battery box and check out the bolt. A few pages back I typed up some quick generic instructions. Also look at your rear mount. If the rear mount bolt breaks the engine will not drop, but you will receive a knocking noise when you shift front the mount clanking around.

 

[hunterbrandon]

thanks but i just dont understand why the dealer would not check these..

 

[M3_Zoom]

thanks but i just dont understand why the dealer would not check these..

We'll the rear one takes five minutes to check. If you do find that the rear bolt broke and the mount is clanking around, well I guess you might want to call the dealer and talk to someone higher in the chain if they claim they looked at everything.

 

[bigtuna]

This is obviously up to you, but just to clarify: there has not been a case yet (that I am aware of) where the engine actually falls to the ground. The mount breaks, everything sort of sinks/breaks, but the engine never comes out of the car. I've also heard many people be worried that this is going to happen when travelling high speeds on the highway, but that also hasn't happened yet. Everyone that I recall had theirs break at a relatively low rate of speed. Not saying this makes it ok or that it is nothing to worry about, just wanted to get the facts out there.

If you really are excited about getting the car, my advice is go for it. This is a relatively rare occurence, and the thing is a joy to drive. I agree that it is ridiculous that it's even an issue. What's worse is that apparently they have what they consider to be an easy fix for it, yet there is no recall or TSB yet. Good luck with whatever you decide.

BTW, love the screenname. The Office FTW!

justa4banger, thanks for the update!! Hope you get your car back soon in better than new condition.

This will be my last post on this forum.

First of all I'd like to say that I hope that everything turns out for you guys and that Mazda will start to admit that there is a problem with the mounts. Secondly, I love the car and had a very hard time calling the dealership this morning and telling them that I was no longer interested in the MS3. They were a little short with me, especially since I had already put a deposit down. They basically said if I'm not happy, then I'm not a Mazda customer. I told them about the threads I have seen online and even sent them the links. He said he doesn't have time to read "blog gossip" and suggested I didn't waste my time either. I reiterated that the reason I am not buying the car is because I couldn't live with knowing the motor mount could experience a catastrophic failure. At that point they didn't want to talk to me anymore. But at least they know the problem cost them a sale. I walked into a Subaru dealership today and offered them 4k under MSRP for a new Black STI. They countered with 3k under and we settled on 3500 under MSRP. Its $6500 more than the MS3. But I think I'm going to enjoy it more just because of the piece of mind. Again, I wish you guys the best of luck. I'm sure things will work out with your cars. Today I drove by a Mazda 3 and got a knot in my stomach. I really liked that car. Piece guys, and stick to your guns.

 

[justa4banger]

OK Well i got the car back yesterday. Car drives fine and sounds normal, kind of like nothing happened.

Total bill of broken parts was only about 800.00 at warranty cost. Labor i have no idea, 2 days ,but there was alot of waiting time for the tech reps and parts.
Now i need to call mazda directly and see what their plan of action is since this is an obvious problem.
Now keep in mind, my dealer did an excellent job of taking care of me. I won't type all the details BUT if you are in the NORTH DALLAS area by all means take the time to get up to Eldorado. Tell them i sent you. Talk with Brody at the servie desk he will do whats right.

IN other news i got an Email today from NHSTA concerning my problem with the MS3. He wanted to know info like did i loose control, problems cause by this mount etc.................. I wrote him back and added some photos. I'll report back on what they have to say.

So total tally was 4 days of no driving the MS3, 2 hrs of sitting on my ass waiting for the tow truck, and big smiles the ENTIRE TIME. Honestly gents i know that alot of you are concerned and what not, but to me i just found it hilarious that this happened to me. I'm not mad, i do believe there needs to be a fix, but its just funny to me. When i break the next bolt i'll write another thread (drinks)

 

[justa4banger]

Oh big tuna, Sorry to hear you opted out of the MS3, but hey i still would buy the car again. so this should tell you, even for a little heart ache the car is WORTH EVERY PENNY.

MS3 to an STI huh, no comparison there, enjoy the STI, and the higher payments.........

Wanna race my little SVO? Its only a 2.3 D

 

[TorqSpeed5252]

Went to the dealer yesterday to buy the bolts. They had to order em so I won't have them until Monday. Ill test em tuesday mornging and post the results in a new thread in this area. Later

 

[bigtuna]

Oh big tuna, Sorry to hear you opted out of the MS3, but hey i still would buy the car again. so this should tell you, even for a little heart ache the car is WORTH EVERY PENNY.

MS3 to an STI huh, no comparison there, enjoy the STI, and the higher payments.........

Wanna race my little SVO? Its only a 2.3 D

Actually, I paid cash. So I only experience one higher pmt

The insurance will be higher pmts though.

What do you have some hopped up SVO you wanna kick my butt with? Maybe I'll race you in 3 years when I start modifying the STI. right now I'll just settle for this as an occational commuter car and weekend warrior.

good luck.

 

[justa4banger]

CHeck my sig............ the SVO has a few go fast parts. Best pass so far (1/8th mile) is a 8.13 at 85.5. good enough for a mid to low 12. Its nothing crazy , but it holds it own against my V8 buddies.

Hell i pulled a slightly modded 04 Cobra up to 125mph, then he went around me like i threw an anchor out. It was funny though. from 50mph i pulled a car and stayed there till 125. the owner of the cobra was shocked as well as I.
Not shabby for a poor ole 2.3

 

[RonTonkinMazda]

CHeck my sig............ the SVO has a few go fast parts. Best pass so far (1/8th mile) is a 8.13 at 85.5. good enough for a mid to low 12. Its nothing crazy , but it holds it own against my V8 buddies.

Hell i pulled a slightly modded 04 Cobra up to 125mph, then he went around me like i threw an anchor out. It was funny though. from 50mph i pulled a car and stayed there till 125. the owner of the cobra was shocked as well as I.
Not shabby for a poor ole 2.3

i was in the military with a guy that lived in DFW and had a Car like yours that think was so damn fast it was crazy!

 

[redspeed]

Went to the dealer yesterday to buy the bolts. They had to order em so I won't have them until Monday. Ill test em tuesday mornging and post the results in a new thread in this area. Later

Can't........... wait!!(nailbyt) (nailbyt)

 

[CTGrey02]

CHeck my sig............ the SVO has a few go fast parts. Best pass so far (1/8th mile) is a 8.13 at 85.5. good enough for a mid to low 12. Its nothing crazy , but it holds it own against my V8 buddies.

Hell i pulled a slightly modded 04 Cobra up to 125mph, then he went around me like i threw an anchor out. It was funny though. from 50mph i pulled a car and stayed there till 125. the owner of the cobra was shocked as well as I.
Not shabby for a poor ole 2.3

Those damned T-56's.

 

[ptperformance]

Nice! If we can get an upgraded bolt and a solid mount vice this two piece shearing deal the headache will hopefully be gone. VENDORS PLEASE TAKE NOTE! I might just contact a few of these urethane companies and see what it would take. I would purchase an extra side OEM mount to send in, if they are willing to make us a nice urethane one. At this point I would settle for a solid rubber OEM style mount and upgraded bolt for that matter.

Way a head of you. We are looking at an upgrade but the mount needs to be re-designed before its better. Just making one out of urathane or adding an insert would make it even worse. For a temporary fix we will be making a strap and upgrade for the bolt to a stud and nut. The strap kit will keep the motor and engine from dropping down and causing all the damage.

 

[M3_Zoom]

Way a head of you. We are looking at an upgrade but the mount needs to be re-designed before its better. Just making one out of urathane or adding an insert would make it even worse. For a temporary fix we will be making a strap and upgrade for the bolt to a stud and nut. The strap kit will keep the motor and engine from dropping down and causing all the damage.

Super! That's a start and let us know. Thank You!

 

[matsuda]

In their words the mounting system (theres a plate with 4 mounting holes to the sub frame and a bracket with 4 mounting points. Those two items are then connected together with the bolt in question. )
The problem is when the upper mount is made it has 2 separate pieces that are molded together with rubber (vibration isolation), these 2 pieces are strong enough in design and they promised me that the whole design is "strong enough" for this car. The "PROBLEM" is in the molding process there is excess rubber that covers the actual mounting point on the upper bracket where the bolt threads in. this little bit of rubber (maybe 1/32th" thick) is now between the 2 mounting points. When the bolt is properly trqed this rubber is squished out slighty and stays in place. Well because the rubber is inbetween the 2 mounts it alows the motor to rocks a little. OVer time (not very much ) the rubber then squishes out and causes slop in the mount. With the power that the motor has it causes a rocking motion that alows the mount to shift for /aft within the bracket. The "Slop " gives enough play to make the 2 mounts act like a set of shears and if not fixed it can cause the bolt to shear off. (damn i hope this isn't to confusing)

In the end the fix is simple "so they claim". First support the enigne/tranny. remove the bolt and remove the upper mounting bracket. trim away the "excess rubber" where the lower mount would touch the upper mount. (its on the underside of the upper mount) reassemble and trq the bolt properly. this will eliminate the bolt was having any slop and stop it from breaking. It sounds good, whether its true, well i dunno time will tell.

This is good information, thank you.

It would explain the failure even when the bolt was properly torqued and the car was not abused.

It seems that by luck of the draw, some cars have excess rubber between the mounts and some do not.

Since that information came directly from some JDM Mazda guys, I would take it as gospel.

 

[desperado-c]

This is good information, thank you.

It would explain the failure even when the bolt was properly torqued and the car was not abused.

It seems that by luck of the draw, some cars have excess rubber between the mounts and some do not.

Since that information came directly from some JDM Mazda guys, I would take it as gospel.

Again, has anybody actually sheared a bolt? I don't recall anything but bolts backing out and stripping. It may be that the squishing rubber and rocking motion are causing the bolt to loosen up and back out. In that case I question whether a fix that doesn't include the bolt modified with an added washer is really going to be 100% effective. The washer presumably allows for some slippage during engine rocking and thus prevents the bolt from becoming untorqued as it were.

 

[Rotus8]

Again, has anybody actually sheared a bolt? I don't recall anything but bolts backing out and stripping. It may be that the squishing rubber and rocking motion are causing the bolt to loosen up and back out. In that case I question whether a fix that doesn't include the bolt modified with an added washer is really going to be 100% effective. The washer presumably allows for some slippage during engine rocking and thus prevents the bolt from becoming untorqued as it were.

In at least one incident the bolt sheared; pictures were posted on "the other forum". It is not clear if it was an actual bolt failure, or if it first loosened which allowed the mount to move around and that motion damaged the bolt enough that it failed.

 

[matsuda]

It may be that the squishing rubber and rocking motion are causing the bolt to loosen up and back out.

That is the way that I understood it (i.e. the bolt could have been torqued correctly at some point in time but would eventually loosen because of the rubber).