Mazdaspeed springs on stock ES struts?

[SilverBulletES]

I have read conflicting opinions on whether these fit on stock ES struts?

I think most threads have said "no problem" but one thread I read said they _did not_ work. Which is it?

I am buying these off a board member... 13K miles on them to go on my stock 2003 ES struts with 27K miles. They are red... the ones that lower you .75?, .875?, 1 inch? I've read conflicting things on that too.

gracias

 

[JCell]

they will work, they will lower ur car by half an inch

btw, springs never were out, they may sag, but won't wore out

 

[dmitrik4]

have 'em on the front of my ES. i kept the stock ES struts on front and put the MSP struts on the rear w/ MSP springs all around. no problem...after all, the MSP springs aren't THAT stiff.

 

[mspdfreak]

Yeah, but with the struts AND the springs, it's a shitload stiffer than an ES. I know, because my rental was an '03 ES, and it was a lot different in the turns, lol.

 

[JCell]

Es > Msp

 

[dmitrik4]

Yeah, but with the struts AND the springs, it's a shitload stiffer than an ES. I know, because my rental was an '03 ES, and it was a lot different in the turns, lol.

i know too, b/c my g/f hates it (i think it's perfect!).

my point was that the springs themselves aren't much stiffer (the sway bars do most of the work), so it's no problem to pair them with the ES struts...they can handle it.

 

[Silver Bullet]

I'm the last one who said the MSP spring do not fit the protege's struts. I ordered a set of rear spring from Racing Beat to solve my problem. They have one more loop than the one on the Msp. I took some mesurement on Msp struts and on P5 and ES, the MSP struts are different. The spring seat is 3/4" higher than P5 and ES. The result is that the rear of the car is too low (about 1,5" lower) and the spring doesn't have any preload, it wiggle in the strut assembly. So if you raise the car the top of the spring can pop out of its seat. That's not good. I recommand to order a new set of spring!

 

[SilverBulletES]

I'm the last one who said the MSP spring do not fit the protege's struts. I ordered a set of rear spring from Racing Beat to solve my problem. They have one more loop than the one on the Msp. I took some mesurement on Msp struts and on P5 and ES, the MSP struts are different. The spring seat is 3/4" higher than P5 and ES. The result is that the rear of the car is too low (about 1,5" lower) and the spring doesn't have any preload, it wiggle in the strut assembly. So if you raise the car the top of the spring can pop out of its seat. That's not good. I recommand to order a new set of spring!

Anyone else think this is a problem??

It's not that I have such a hard-on for the Mazdaspeed springs... it's just that they're practically free and I think 1/2 inch to 3/4 inch drop is really all I want. I can sell them if I change my mind. If this is going to be a problem with the stock struts I'll just wait and get some Tokicos to pair them with...

 

[dmitrik4]

i think they're a great option. they're stiff but not too stiff, and the slight drop is perfect. i was able to pick up some low-mileage MSP struts for $240. so spent $280 on the springs and struts, and $40 on the RB bar.

unless you're driving the car so that the suspension is at full droop (jumping over stuff dukes of hazzard-style), it shouldn't be a problem. i've been autoXing on mine for a year now, and they've been great.

 

[Silver Bullet]

i think they're a great option. they're stiff but not too stiff, and the slight drop is perfect. i was able to pick up some low-mileage MSP struts for $240. so spent $280 on the springs and struts, and $40 on the RB bar.

unless you're driving the car so that the suspension is at full droop (jumping over stuff dukes of hazzard-style), it shouldn't be a problem. i've been autoXing on mine for a year now, and they've been great.

With the Msp strut, there is no problem at all. It is with standard strut that there is a problem. And the rear is going to show 1/2" wheel gap and the front about 2" so it is going to look so crappy! And plus to run a car with that kind of set-up (hand) it is really not the best. The life of the standard strut is not going to be long. The rear of the car is going to be bouncy and the struts are going to last half the life of your front strut!

I respect your choice but I would not do it.

 

[dmitrik4]

i have the MSP springs all around, MSP struts on the rear, and ES struts on the front. MSP rear sway bar, ES front sway bar.

the front isn't underdamped- as i said above, the MSP springs aren't a whole lot stiffer than the stock ES springs (~17%), so the damping ability of the stock struts is enough.

it's an autoX setup, so the goal is rear stiffness...if the spring length weren't so different, i'd be running the ES springs on the front as well.

after several seasons, it's proven to work wonderfully, esp for the price. not quite as much rotation as i'd prefer, but a lot better than stock.

 

[J dragon]

what about LX/DX..and the racing beat website said they would not work on Regular sedans without modifications

 

[SilverBulletES]

I'm so confused now.... (hand)

OK... this is my daily driver... I don't want more than an inch drop... but I would like a decent autocross type setup...

Maybe I should just keep the 'Speed springs and save up for some Tokico Illuminas... and a rear sway bar... and then install them all at once...

Dmitrik what do you mean by "Mazdaspeed struts"... the expensive defunct green ones or Tokicos??

 

[Silver Bullet]

i have the MSP springs all around, MSP struts on the rear, and ES struts on the front. MSP rear sway bar, ES front sway bar.

the front isn't underdamped- as i said above, the MSP springs aren't a whole lot stiffer than the stock ES springs (~17%), so the damping ability of the stock struts is enough.

it's an autoX setup, so the goal is rear stiffness...if the spring length weren't so different, i'd be running the ES springs on the front as well.

after several seasons, it's proven to work wonderfully, esp for the price. not quite as much rotation as i'd prefer, but a lot better than stock.

I'm prefectly according to your statement. Once again, the only possible problem is with rear MSP spring (not Real Racing Beat) and Standard strut (not MSP strut), those (msp spring and standard strut) are not mecanicaly compatible.

 

[Silver Bullet]

I'm so confused now.... (hand)

OK... this is my daily driver... I don't want more than an inch drop... but I would like a decent autocross type setup...

Maybe I should just keep the 'Speed springs and save up for some Tokico Illuminas... and a rear sway bar... and then install them all at once...

Dmitrik what do you mean by "Mazdaspeed struts"... the expensive defunct green ones or Tokicos??

The problem is the rear spring with standard strut or after market strut. It is not the ability to damper of the stock struts. If you want to keep the drop of the msp you should buy a set of rear spring at Racing Beat. Or buy a set of rear msp strut. What I mean is that rear MSP strut and spring is different that anything on the market. Once you have the new and old in hand you're goiing to understand what the problem is.

Here is a link to an msp with the opposite problem (post 9 expose my point)
http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=105476

 

[dmitrik4]

ok, we're on the same page. i thought when you said "the rear is going to be bouncy," you thought i had the MSP springs and ES struts on the rear, which is not the case. i can't testify to the bounciness or feasibility of that arrangement, since i never tried it.

so the bottom line seems to be:

MSP springs/ES struts: OK on the front (according to my experience), won't work on the back (according to yours).

I
Dmitrik what do you mean by "Mazdaspeed struts"... the expensive defunct green ones or Tokicos??

i haven't yet used the term "mazdaspeed struts." i have always called them "MSP struts" as in "struts off a mazdaspeed protege." i haven't had the good fortune or $$$ to happen into a set of the sadly-discontinued green Mazdaspeed adjustable struts.

 

[J dragon]

So what's wrong with mazdaspeed Struts on regular sedan protege's?

 

[Protege52003]

So what's wrong with mazdaspeed Struts on regular sedan protege's?

i can't see anything being wrong except for the shortened strut life. i put eibach's on my factory springs with 45K on them and they are doing fine. no bouncing and they ride nice.....

 

[Silver Bullet]

ok, we're on the same page. i thought when you said "the rear is going to be bouncy," you thought i had the MSP springs and ES struts on the rear, which is not the case. i can't testify to the bounciness or feasibility of that arrangement, since i never tried it.

so the bottom line seems to be:

MSP springs/ES struts: OK on the front (according to my experience), won't work on the back (according to yours).




i haven't yet used the term "mazdaspeed struts." i have always called them "MSP struts" as in "struts off a mazdaspeed protege." i haven't had the good fortune or $$$ to happen into a set of the sadly-discontinued green Mazdaspeed adjustable struts.

Exactly (thumb) (first)

 

[SilverBulletES]

OK.... not wanting to beat a dead horse... but...

So I have an '03 ES and these Mazdaspeed springs (they are the red ones-- I'm assuming they're the MSP springs) on the way. So you guys have explained to me (and I understand now) that the 'speed springs will not work well on the back unless I get the Mazdaspeed struts.

So

a) I'm either going to sell them and try to get what I paid for them or close, then save up for another spring/strut combo (thinking about Tokico Illumina/spring package)

or

b) keep the cheap, barely used 'speed springs I've just purchased and find a full set of cheap, slightly used factory MSP struts. This would be the cheapest route.

If I go for Option B, the full Mazdaspeed Protege setup, would this be a good setup on my ES as far as balance? I'm sure there's a slight difference in weight and balance but my ES is loaded with options so I'm guessing it's similar to the MSP. Also please consider I will probably keep the stock ES front sway bar and possibly add a RB or other aftermarket sway bar to get some nice oversteer in there. BTW I'm running stock wheels with these quite sticky Fuzion 205/50/16 tires.

thanks