Zoom Zoom BOOM - I joined the blown up club.

But one thing is out of the thousands of mazdaspeed3's that have been sold worldwide since 2007..how many have blown????? Is it worse than other cars track record?? Whos to say..Iam very carious...check the statistics and then compare..I know the new 2009 wrx engines have been blowing more than they used to..and that 2.5 boxer engine has alwas been a very reliable platform..some cars will be lemons..thats just how it goes.. ..but like i said..you gotta sit down..count how many ms3's have been made..then devide that by blown engines..and see if thats out of the "norm"

It might not be, but...

Well it sucks but you pay to play. But if you want to make sure you have everything covered you have to not mod and have them do all the services...

I did all that, but...

If the warranty support is as bad as I've experienced, it isn't worth a s*** and the car is worth less than a car with good warranty coverage.

It just might be a great car with lousy customer care!(argh)
 
i remember they gave me the run around for 2 weeks when my motor blew i finally said screw it and called mazda and asked for a rep and told him my situation he called the dealership put us on 3 way and the dealers tone changed completely. he said yes its under warranty right then and there. my car was completely stock when it happen.
 
i remember they gave me the run around for 2 weeks when my motor blew i finally said screw it and called mazda and asked for a rep and told him my situation he called the dealership put us on 3 way and the dealers tone changed completely. he said yes its under warranty right then and there. my car was completely stock when it happen.

Did that too. Mazda NAO didn't offer a three way call... Inconsistency is the order of the day!
 
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Yep, @ 3,600 miles I'd only had one oil change at the dealer. Mazda NAO said the dealer screwed up and denied the warranty. That was seven months ago. I still have a car with a hole in the block sitting in the driveway.

Are they repairing your car under warranty?

Sounds like you got screwed worst than me, at least I got 2 1/2 years out of mine. I feel your pain. My story ended today at a Honda dealership where I might get $3000 for my 2007 mazda3 as a trade-in on a 2009 Honda Accord.
Of course Mazda did the did not honor their warranty on my car. I provided them short history of my previous new cars, and my oil change history

I had a 1993 Nissan Sentra for 9 years, put more than 120,000 miles on it when I traded for a 2002 Mazda protg. I had the protg for more than 5 years and 88,000 before I gave it to my son. The protg is still running with over 100,000 miles on it. If your counting, that's 2 cars over 14 years and over 200,000 miles traveled with no engine issues. I provided car VIN numbers and other documentation to prove this history. How is it I am not capable of maintaining the Mazda3 for 33,000 miles. I provided all the documentation on my oil changes, The first one at 1,500 I did my self, but the other 4 oil changes was fully documented. The warrenty was rejected because synthetic oil changes are recommended at 7,500 miles, one of my changes was a 9,000. Also I had no receipts for the oil change at 1,500. The dealer said there was no sludge or evidence of bad oil. They know it was not the oil that caused this blowup, but they do not care, they got there money. Good luck to all you Mazda3 owners, your warranty is VOID, and your mazda3 is ready to Blow.
 
^^ This can be any of us in the near future. Sad to say...Mazdas are fun cars until something happens and then we just hope they don't void warranty for any suck a** reason.
 
Needless to say, those of us with the Cobb AP are totally screwed. No way they won't check that.
Well, no need to sit around waiting and praying... time for more mods then!
 
Wow you guys are scaring me... I guess I'll just do regular 3k oil changes and keep all the receipts in an envelope.

Makes me feel glad I pay for Legal Services on my benefits and keep a lawyer on retainer. Hope I never have to use him.
 
hey i just noticed this happens to my car, only mod i have is a mazdaspeed CAI in a 07 with 33k on it, is there any fix to this?
 
what just happens to your car? did it blow up?

from what i have heard the MS CAI is coverd...

but let me make sure i am getting the moral of the story correct here:

1: dont give boost in high gear / downshift before accelerating even if doing it slowly minimizing boost and therefore insta torque on rods.
2: if you do blow up... ur ****** regardless of warrenty
 
no engine is still working, but every now and then I hear the rattling, finally figured that's not right and search the boards. so i guess don't floor it in 6th if I'm cruising along.

I just wish there was another way to correct it so we don't have to worry about this occurring

what just happens to your car? did it blow up?

from what i have heard the MS CAI is coverd...

but let me make sure i am getting the moral of the story correct here:

1: dont give boost in high gear / downshift before accelerating even if doing it slowly minimizing boost and therefore insta torque on rods.
2: if you do blow up... ur ****** regardless of warrenty
 
I agree about the warranty. On my truck I put in JE forged pistons, moly rings, Nascar Heads, Cam, Supercharger, Edlebrock ceramic headers, free-flow cat, Flowmaster series 40 dual rear exit mufflers, Edlebrock TBS shocks, beefy sway bars, performance computer, MSD ignition, dual Spal electric fans etc. etc. The lame ass dealer told me I could stick a fork in my warranty because it was DONE!! I told him I would hold my breath untill he honored the warranty. I think I have Brain Damage!!!
 
Shocked, twice.

Over the past few months I added a K&N Typhoon Intake, Cobb Turbo Inlet, Turbo XS bpv and turbo boost gage to the MS3. I noticed about after 350 miles of regular easy driving I started to get a nasty vibe in idle. The clutch pedal would feel terribly shaky until depressed. Had no idea what it could be. I tried researching the gripe on every possible forum I could Google. Nothing. on Halloween night I was headed down I-264 going to Norfolk when the car did what felt like a red-line quit stall and POP! I lost all power, got off the highway into the busy town center of VA Beach and pulled over. Hardly any smoke came out when I popped the hood and nothing leaking on the deck. I called roadside assistance and within a half hour a flat bed showed up. And my mind was so scattered that I told the driver to take it to the dealership. WHAT? Why would I tell him that?!?!? I really wanted to take it home to return all of it back to stock and then the dealership. I got the call from the service dept. saying I got a hole in the side of the engine. And he needs all my service history records. I just wanted to know how much all of this was going to cost me. I was quoted anywhere from $5000 to $7500. WOW, I got depressed for a week. I could not believe I made such a dumb mistake of bringing it to the dealer with after market parts still installed.
So this morning I got a call from the service guy. He said that the new engine is being installed, should be ready by next week. And Mazda is covering all costs!!!!!!!Unreal. I was shocked again. Thank god they picked up the bill on this, everything Ive read and heard was that any after market parts would the warranty. Maybe the service guy never notified big Mazda about them. anyways, now I can sleep easier these days. Happy Holidays.
 
Over the past few months I added a K&N Typhoon Intake, Cobb Turbo Inlet, Turbo XS bpv and turbo boost gage to the MS3. I noticed about after 350 miles of regular easy driving I started to get a nasty vibe in idle. The clutch pedal would feel terribly shaky until depressed. Had no idea what it could be. I tried researching the gripe on every possible forum I could Google. Nothing. on Halloween night I was headed down I-264 going to Norfolk when the car did what felt like a red-line quit stall and POP! I lost all power, got off the highway into the busy town center of VA Beach and pulled over. Hardly any smoke came out when I popped the hood and nothing leaking on the deck. I called roadside assistance and within a half hour a flat bed showed up. And my mind was so scattered that I told the driver to take it to the dealership. WHAT? Why would I tell him that?!?!? I really wanted to take it home to return all of it back to stock and then the dealership. I got the call from the service dept. saying I got a hole in the side of the engine. And he needs all my service history records. I just wanted to know how much all of this was going to cost me. I was quoted anywhere from $5000 to $7500. WOW, I got depressed for a week. I could not believe I made such a dumb mistake of bringing it to the dealer with after market parts still installed.
So this morning I got a call from the service guy. He said that the new engine is being installed, should be ready by next week. And Mazda is covering all costs!!!!!!!Unreal. I was shocked again. Thank god they picked up the bill on this, everything Ive read and heard was that any after market parts would the warranty. Maybe the service guy never notified big Mazda about them. anyways, now I can sleep easier these days. Happy Holidays.

**** off seriously?...(fuoops)
 
awesome...and maybe you lucked out too..but regardless..im glad that your getting squared away without money out of pocket...1 thing that might have helped you is that while you do have mods..you dont have alot..the K&N intake is so dam common on cars and trucks these days that dealers dont look at that as a bigdeal...next you have the cobb inlet which is pretty much the rest of your intake sysem..and the depending on the bpv,prabaly didnt draw too much attention..but for guys with turbo back exhausts...fmic or bigger tmic..tubo manifolds and bigger turbos..that s*** sticks out and says im heavily modded...and with those mods..you might not have been as lucky..but regardless..good s*** and good luck with your new motor! :)
 
awesome...and maybe you lucked out too..but regardless..im glad that your getting squared away without money out of pocket...1 thing that might have helped you is that while you do have mods..you dont have alot..the K&N intake is so dam common on cars and trucks these days that dealers dont look at that as a bigdeal...next you have the cobb inlet which is pretty much the rest of your intake sysem..and the depending on the bpv,prabaly didnt draw too much attention..but for guys with turbo back exhausts...fmic or bigger tmic..tubo manifolds and bigger turbos..that s*** sticks out and says im heavily modded...and with those mods..you might not have been as lucky..but regardless..good s*** and good luck with your new motor! :)

Exactly why I spent the extra money on the K&N. I am running an ets tmic, but have my tmic ready to go back on quick. Got an extra cold pipe, oem bpv, all assembled & ready to swap. 3 bolts, 4 clamps done..

On another note, I wonder if they even realized the tip was aftermarket ?
 
just rolled on 50k on mine. Im pretty hard on the car, and it hasnt given me a problem yet. I know other guys that track their car or autox the piss outta them, and no one else seems to have a problem. So you need to beat on your cars more:)
 
Sorry the pics of the graphs won't paste.

I have looked a lot at these blown engine issues. In the end it was all under our noses. The rods are plenty strong for this application and I have compared them dimensionally to both EVO X and SRT4 rods. They are no lighter and although the bolts are a mm smaller in diameter, the DISI engine was not designed for high RPM and we are not breaking rod bolts. I have looked at binding issues, hydrolock etc ... nothing was concrete.

So then I looked at the rod construction and noticed the small end is tapered. Interesting. Diesel engines taper the small end so that the bearing surface is lower so that the rod takes a high load. The rod I have seems to have some good wear on the bottom of the bearing caused by cylinder pressure. Interesting. Perhaps poor oiling. Perhaps too much pressure.



I then looked at how similar cars produced power and as it turns out no EVO or SRT4 motor makes as much torque as we do at such low RPM. Period.

The way this Mazda is calibrated is more like a truck than a performance car. We don't need more than 300 ft lbs of torque to make well over 400whp but Mazda didn't want that for this motor.

Everyone has been looking at hp gains for this car and have completely ignored the torque and where it is at its maximum and that it doesn't carry into the RPM band.

Further torque is the one that is DIRECTLY proportional to cylinder pressure.

Case and point, look at the tq and hp on this 450whp evo


Now look at Darksun's dyno. Again look at the torque he made.


Take a look at this recent DISI dyno. 375 ft lbs at 3000 RPM.
http://**************************/foru...ue-maf-cal.jpg

Cylinder pressure is what causes the "force" that is then back calculated as torque by a dyno. The gases that cause the cylinder pressure as a result of combustion expand at the same rate no matter how quickly you engine is spinning. This is the reason that you advance spark timing - so that the flame front occurs at the appropriate time to provide as much force to the downward moving piston as possible.

Now, as RPM rises, the piston moves much faster. So then amount of TIME it is subject to the pressure of the expanding gases is less per each power stroke. The reason cars make torque during a certain part of the RPM band is because there is a relationship between how you can control the burn rate (which depends on air/gas inflow, mixing, lighting mixture) with respect to piston speed

So when you are making 300ft lbs of torque at 2500 RPM, the motor sustains the force required to makes that torque for longer each power stroke than if you made the torque at 4500 RPM. Let's not even talk about the fact that a dyno takes an average force applied which favors high RPM to low RPM. It's pretty damn hard to make the torque we do at such a low RPM. The principle is similar to lugging.

So our engines making 300 ft lbs of torque at 2500RPM and only 280whp are under a lot more mechanical stress than an F/I honda motor making 300 ftlbs of torque at 5000RPM and 400whp at 7500RPM.

Once RPM increases too much, inertial loads of the rod and piston break rod bolts. The counterpart is extreme torque at low RPM. Oil pushed out of bearings and extreme connecting rod loads are the result. This load applied again and again eventually results in bent rods and holes through blocks.

Once you open up the flow path to this car it makes MUCH more torque at an even lower RPM instead of breathing better at higher RPMs.

Have you seen the rods on a diesel? Here is an example of a TDI (yes diesel) dyno. Look familiar?



Here is an example of a 1.9 TDI rod and piston that makes 170 ft lbs of torque and 100hp from the factory. The rods are bombproof compared to us because THEY WERE DESIGNED to take high torque at low RPM.




Nuff said. I don't think anyone should be wondering why we break rods anymore.

Solution? There are many factors that affect how an engine produces torque and power. In order for the stock bottom end to stay in one piece, change the stock tune so that you don't hit 21psi at 2800 RPM. Help the motor breathe and move the torque curve further in RPM. Not only will the engine survive longer, but it will also make more whp. And everyone will be a hero, not just whoosh, who certainly didn't make the power he did by chance.

EDIT: This is an addition further explaining the low load rod breaking phenomenon:

I know that people are concerned with the part throttle blow-ups. These are certainly explainable - and I think the short article below from Hot Rod magazine clearly explains how fatigue and material impurity can lead to brittle fractures when components are under high stress. Brittle fractures start at a point of imperfection or impurity in the metal and propagate through. This is why some guys last longer stock and some don't. When a brittle fracture starts to happen, you won't feel anything until that fracture has grown enough to cause the rod to snap. The fracture will most likely let go under vacuum or when engine RPM changes (gear changes) since the rod is being "pulled apart" at that point if you will.

Cylinder pressure, high RPM, etc all play a part in exploiting a material flaw if it exists in the first place and bring it out of the wood work faster.

If you look at MS3 rods, you clearly see that the surface finish is not smooth (machined) like it is in aftermarket forged rods.


Stock Forged Steel

Original-equipment forged steel rods are the next step up the strength and reliability ladder. Detroit-sourced OE-forged rods begin life as bars of carbon steel that are passed through a rolling die. The rolling process compacts the molecular structure and establishes a uniform, longitudinal grain flow. The bars are then heated to a plasticized state, inserted into a female die, and pressed into the near-final shape while a punch locates and knocks out the big end bore. In doing this, the grain flow at the big end is redirected in a circular pattern, like wood fibers surrounding a knot, and excellent compressive/tensile strength results. Finally the rod is put through a trimmer (that leaves the characteristic thick parting line on the beam), the big end is severed and machined to create the cap, bolt surfaces are spot-faced, then final machining and sizing take place.

But there are some drawbacks. When the forging hammer hits the hot bar, heat transfers from the bar to the hammer causing a phenomenon called de-carb (decarburization). Here, trace amounts of the carbon in the steel migrate to the surface resulting in a rough finish full of what metalurgists call inclusions. An inclusion is described as anything that interrupts the surface of the metal, or a lack of cleanliness (impurities) in the material. The effect of a surface inclusion can be likened to a nick in a coat hanger. Bend it enough times and the wire will fail, usually right at the nick. The rough surface caused by de-carb affects the surface to a depth of 0.005 to 0.030 inch and is packed with inclusions that are a breeding ground for cracks. The old hot rodders trick of grinding and polishing the beams is a valid solution to this problem, though far too labor-intensive to ever be considered by Detroit.

When it comes to inclusions caused by impurities, Detroits need to control costs can result in purchases of bulk steel that may (or may not) contain contaminants such as silicon that are not detected during manufacture. Such impurities can interrupt the grain boundaries between the parent molecules and lead to a fracture minutes or years after the rod is first installed in an engine. Its a matter of luck and what kind of abuse the flawed rod is subjected to.

Stock forged steel rods are an economical choice that should be able to handle one horsepower per cubic inch with quality fasteners, and as much as twice the factory-rated output if the beams are polished.

This makes total sense to me. As an owner of a Stage3 highly modded SRT-4 and a stock MS3, I find that the stock MS3 and it's grippy clutch would develop much more torque at low RPMs than even my modded SRT-4. The combined torque stress with boost at low RPMs and the inherent weakness in the rods as mentioned (especially if any impurities were in the rods making slow cracks over time) would eventually make some engines meet their maker earlier. Good information. Perhaps I will now go get the Aeroforce Scan gauge and monitor computed engine load, RPM, and boost so I won't become a member of the club.... Or, just remember to not boost much at low RPMs over a long period..... downshift before passing, even if the MS3 can push along past a slower vehicle without a downshift...... One of the things I rather liked about the MS3 compared to the SRT-4 too.... No downshift needed due to high torque at low RPMs...... Still, stock for stock, MS3 is a much better car than the Neon SRT-4, overall.... unless this becomes a TSB for a motor swap required, that is.
 
I dont really understand it. Why would Mazda, with a car with obvious mods, cover it under warranty?
 
Well I heard the worst sound of my entire life on Friday July 17th in Danville VA. :'(
I drove down from Ohio (500mi) and the car ran like a champ, and got 32mpg to boot. It's about the 5th time I have driven down here. I had my dashhawk on the entire trip down - no knock, everything looked great. I was leaving the plant and had driven my car for about 1 mile to the front gate, dropped off my pass and hopped in excited for a nice ride home - I love goin through the mountains of VA and WV. I was in no hurry and leasurely ran through 1st and 2nd then shifted into 3rd at about 3k and maybe 1 or 2 psi (I was driving like an old lady). Then the sound that still haunts me: a hand full of nuts and bolts thrown into a blender on high speed, followed by a "pop" about 1 sec later, then the instant strong smell of oil and antifreeze. Was running on like 1 or 2 cylinders when I shut it down (almost immediately). I got out and there was a trail of oil and antifreeze and a giant pool of both under my car. I popped the hood, nothing visible except oil everywhere.
34k miles on the car. I had my wife call and get me towed to an empty lot next to my hotel in town, then bummed a ride to RDU and flew home 5 hrs. later to Cleveland.

Well after I got home I started talking with Palerider about what I should do and he pointed me to Darrell Cox Racing - like 30 miles away from where I blew !!!! I met up with Darrell and he is building my forged motor !!!! Like Randy said if you are going to blowup there is no better place to do it than near DCR, probably the best shop in the country for building bomb proof forged motors!!! So I'm totally excited about DCR working on my car.

your sig said cai only in SRI mode was your only mod, is that true?
 
I dont really understand it. Why would Mazda, with a car with obvious mods, cover it under warranty?

You might not have been the first, and the same dealer might have caught a lot of s*** about it from somebody else before your problem. Thinking about it, if Mazda makes a recall on this issue, then there's a good chance all the people they forced to pay out of warranty might be legally reimbursable. Not to mention the smear on the car's reputation. Hell Mazda already has one car (cough *RX8* cough) wearing the scarlet "U" (unreliable) due to a plethora of engine failures. (chair)

I really, really, really want to add an intake and a rear MM, but I'm not touching my engine until there's an official fix for this s***.
 

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