Timing belt slippage?

[MrGiggles]

Wait a minute. You say you disagree with what I stated...and then proceed to reiterate what I stated?

We already know the timing belt is not entirely broken. Diagnosing it any further through the oil fill can't be done.

This is a none interference engine. Some people get valve to piston contact, many people do not. Suggesting the entire engine needs replaced after only removing the oil cap is absurd.

Further, nobody has commented on the fact that this mechanic replaced the belt 20k miles ago! Something is wrong if this engine has already jumped time.

Not really. It would absolutely be the case if he had discovered a broken belt on most Japenese cars. I wasn't agreeing or disagreeing earlier, just trying to show things from the technician's perspective.

You can say it's a non-interference engine, if there is still a chance that there could be valve damage, it doesn't mean much.

 

[Maroon]

Not really. It would absolutely be the case if he had discovered a broken belt on most Japenese cars. I wasn't agreeing or disagreeing earlier, just trying to show things from the technician's perspective.

You can say it's a non-interference engine, if there is still a chance that there could be valve damage, it doesn't mean much.

Right, if he had discovered a broken belt he could say that maybe the engine is bad (and then proceed to verify). But as was established in post #4, he did not find a broken belt and then proceeded to say that the OP needs a new engine.

It means a whole lot to say it is a non interference engine because it has a good chance of being just fine! There are plenty of people with this engine who have snapped their belts or jumped time with no other consequences. Even interference engines have a chance of being okay after snapping a belt.

 

[i12drivemyMP5]

Further, nobody has commented on the fact that this mechanic replaced the belt 20k miles ago!

Try reading post #7 second question..................

 

[talltim]

Will a bad cam position sensor give a no start issue?

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[Maroon]

Try reading post #7 second question..................

You're right, I missed that. Kind of easy to do when you don't put things in paragraphs. I had to read it twice to catch it............

 

[jonathan62019]

Yeah because paragraphs matter... Lol silly humans.

 

[Maroon]

Will a bad cam position sensor give a no start issue?

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It certainly can on some cars. I can not speak to what it will do on this car.

I'm not an advocate of throwing parts at problems, but if you can't pull the valve cover to check timing, maybe try a new cam position sensor.

I would check timing first.

 

[talltim]

It certainly can on some cars. I can not speak to what it will do on this car.

I'm not and advocate of throwing parts at problems, but if you can't pull the valve cover to check timing, maybe try a new cam position sensor.

Just wondering. Anyone have a link to where the timing marks should be on a protege 2.0?

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[i12drivemyMP5]

There's a service manual stickied somewhere.......ugly.net something................maybe not, don't see it on here any more but found this............

http://www.mazdaspd.com/manuals.html

 

[i12drivemyMP5]

You're right, I missed that. Kind of easy to do when you don't put things in paragraphs. I had to read it twice to catch it............

sorry, I'll start doublespacing each sentence.

That way it'll jump right out at folks all ambush style.

Nah..............Grammar, spelling, phoenetical & profanity police are just rent-a-cops, they have no jurisdiction or authority.

These people care tho....... http://www.usingenglish.com/forum/

 

[pcb]

...., maybe try a new cam position sensor.

There is a code on our car for a bad cam sensor...

It will most likely would throw it if it was bad.

 

[pcb]

Just wondering. Anyone have a link to where the timing marks should be on a protege 2.0?

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[pcb]

Will a bad cam position sensor give a no start issue?

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I'm pretty sure (but not positive) our car will run with a bad cam sensor but will not run with a bad crank sensor.

I just remember one guy had a spark tester and he would get two sparks then nothing every time he tried to start it.

The ECU gave the engine two revolutions before noticing that there was no crank signal.

I don't recall if he had thrown a code for the crank sensor.... Perhaps the failure happened instantaneously and didn't have time to throw the code???

He replaced his crank sensor and all was well.

(I'm 90% sure it was the crank sensor and not the cam sensor... I figure it's more critical for the ECU to know where the crank is at than the cams)

 

[pcb]

My car started to run not so great. I kept it limping along and when I tried to push it to cross the street the car shut down and will not restart but cranks very easy. Took it to a mechanic who said the timing belt isnt broken but when it cranks pressure comes out the intake. Also gives a message the the cam timing sensor (one in the valve cover) is bad. I tend to think it jumped several teeth. I havent done anything with it cause in south florida it is like a 110 degree sponge out there. The mechanic wanted to replace the whole motor. Just let go from my last job and I cant afford that. Any ideas? I feel running a compression test is a start. What else?

OK... I just reread this and it really sounds like the timing belt skipped a tooth or few...

The ECU will know if the cam timing is out of wack with the crank timing and throw that code.

Other guys have skipped a tooth and it would run like what your car is doing.

It's really easy to overstretch the spring on the tensioner pulley which is why I connected my spring after I had my belt completely installed.

Reefing on the tensioner pulley to install the belt can easily stretch that spring.

The spring is CRITICAL to our car working properly which is why you are supposed to measure it.




(No offence intended to any technician, mechanic, or grease monkey that may be reading this)

 

[pcb]

There's timing marks in the crank pulley as well but all that stuff has to come off to get to the cams to see them.

(If it were me I'd just drill a hole though the plastic timing cover to take a look.... Some guys don't even have the covers installed)

 

[pcb]

I'll bet your spring snapped or fell off... Then skipped a tooth leaving it running, then skipped a whole bunch more teeth leaving the intake valves open on the compression stroke.

 

[talltim]

I'll bet your spring snapped or fell off... Then skipped a tooth leaving it running, then skipped a whole bunch more teeth leaving the intake valves open on the compression stroke.

That seems to be the most sensible. I have diabetes now. When I was younger I would jump on it; now I almost kill myself doing an oil change. Im going to have to find someone to do this for me. Unfortunately I have the bad luck of just having lost my job about 1 month ago. I need a new mechanic and I need to either find a place I can work on it out of the sun or I have to find a good mechanic to go thru it for me.

 

[pcb]

Just an FYI....

I remember asking here on the forum a few years ago why the idler pulley spring is used.

I did a timing belt on a Tracker and there was a tensioner spring but it was only there to provide proper tension during install then the tensioner pulley was bolted down.

On our car the tensioner pulley is free floating at all times and is tensioned by the spring. That seemed to me to be just asking for trouble.

Apparently... When we back off the throttle especially from WOT, the crankshaft slows down very fast but the camshafts have inertia and have a tendency to vibrate like mad.

That vibration would shred our T-belt in no time so the tensioner pulley needs to bounce around to absorb that shock.

Either way... I really don't get why Mazda would use a ten cent spring to do a thousand dollar job. I think that spring should be incorporated into the tensioner pulley assembly itself, not just hooked up like some trivial after thought...



Anyway... I'm sure you can feel confident that you have no engine damage and you can easily get it fixed... But for God's sake spent the two dollars and buy a new spring.

 

[pcb]

You should consider doing your water pump, idler and tensioner pulleys too if they weren't done the last time.

My pulleys were pretty wobbly when I did my T-belt (which I assume could help lead to belt slippage) and if your water pump starts leaking shortly, the entire T-belt process has to be repeated.

There are complete kits available.

I didn't do cam or crank seals when I did my car... Some guys had real problems doing them and had to keep redoing them. My weren't leaking and still aren't... I figure leave well enough alone.

(these are Canadian dollars... Your price is about 3/4 of that)

 

[i12drivemyMP5]

Great informative posts.................