thinking of getting a built mpi motor

[smo0f]

More like lower central new jersey (west longbranch/eatontown). The best thing to do is to contact him (MPNick) and ask him about prices, because he has several packages and brands. He also does the turbo upgrade (for those with msps/t25s) where he guts out the t25, ports and polishes the inside, and puts gt28 internals into it (also includes porting and polishing of exhaust manifold and s-pipe, only if you dont plan or dont already have a turbo-back/upgraded downpipe i guess). I've heard nothing but phenomenal things about it and i'm getting it myself next, as it will be the last piece of the puzzle

 

[Metal MP5]

i will be getting that turbo upgrade too =)

 

[apocman]

All I can say is I truly love Nick's work!!!!! He has always treated me great and I have never had any issues with any of the turbo upgrades he has done for us. I love the MPI as well... MPI all the way!!!!

 

[mazdaspeedwerx]

anyone have a link for mpi?

 

[smo0f]

there's really not much on the website. best thing to do is to PM him. his name is MPNick. Or you can try calling at 732-222-3679, but he might not pick up because he's either working or something or helping a customer (like me, when i go hours at a time)

 

[Metal MP5]

yeah pm or email mp23cc@aol.com
he's usually pretty quick to reply

 

[MrDiggler]

Yup. If you get your block bored out .xxx", as long as the damage is shallower then than it will be gone.

I would agree with that too. Minor scoring can be machined out. This is where the machine work comes in too, though. Our iron blocks can be magnafluxed for cracks, and I'd want it done. I'd also want to make sure no serious core shifting has happened (don't know if it's an issue with the FS blocks), and I'd preferably want the boring/honing done with a torque plate. I know for my Pontiac engine work there are only a few who have a torque plate. FWIW, the torque plate is like a template of the head, and is bolted to the block before final machining to reproduce the distortion the head and head bolts have on the block. Yes, it actually happens and is measurable. On Pontiac V8's, it's a free 25 hp you get just from having them machined with a torque plate installed because the cylinder roundness is set perfectly just like the head is installed. You get better cylinder sealing. The weaker the block design, the more important this becomes, and I'm pretty sure the FS isn't the strongest block around.

 

[MSpeed2397]

Hrmm...now would any machine shop have these tools (torque plate and whatever is used for magnafluxing if that's a word) available to them or would I have to find a particular place that does this specific type of work?

 

[MSpeed2397]

Bump for ? above

 

[122 Vega]

The FS Is a solid deck block so you don't have to worry about core shift. Of course with open deck blocks you don't have to use torque plates.

The torque plate is something that I would assume Nick has and uses when building his motors. If not, I would look elsewhere. No local machine shop will have one, they can make them, but they are expensive and usually require you to have the enging blueprints available. They can be made from the block though. You can also make them from the head gaskets as well.

As far as magnafluxing the block, any machine shop can do it, but I'm not sure if it's necessary. I doubt there are any issues with cracks in the block that lead to engine failure. The majority of failures on the FS are from broken rods, wrist pins and detonation damage to the pistons. Do have the crank magnafluxed before and after any machining.

If your crank has to be turned down, I would look into nitriding it, which is a process that hardens the surfaces after macining. The get the crank balanced to 0.5 grams 6" from centerline. Do not have the crank balanced with the flywheel clutch and pressure plate installed. Many shops will try to say you need to do that, but what happens when you have to replace the clutch? Balance them seperately. Same with the crank pulley.

For a high performance, high rpm engine, have the mains line bored as well. Typically you won't need to do this if you have the original main caps, but to get all the power out you can, you need to make sure that things are straight and perpendicular to the cylinder midlines.

Britt

 

[MSpeed2397]

Awesome Britt...thanks for the info on all of this. Does someone else have any input on this topic...now that my motors pretty much toast I think I'll be getting a built motor.

 

[MSpeed2397]

Bump for a new question, and what does the compression ratio do for your car? Is higher or lower better?

 

[MrDiggler]

Bump for a new question, and what does the compression ratio do for your car? Is higher or lower better?

I believe that performance-wise the compression ratio relates to how much air/fuel you're squeezing into a certain space, with more being better until cylinder pressures go too high for your fuel/timing and it starts preigniting or detonating.

I can relate some limited experience here. Our motors are 9:1 IIRC. I have a built motor that's not installed yet, and one reason is because I don't know what the compression ratio is. If it's less than 8.5:1, I'm swapping for higher compression pistons. Why? Because I want snappy off-boost response like what I have now. Drop it too much and the engine will feel more soft and sluggish off the line before the boost comes up, which drives me nuts. My 323 GTX has 7.9:1 compression and it will flat out scare you pulling into traffic when the turbo isn't spooled up. One...two... then it pulls like a freight train and barely keeps you from getting crunched.

That said, a lower CR does allow for more boost, but I'd still rather have a decent CR for a street driven car.

 

[MSpeed2397]

So the 8.5:1 CR pistons would have a potential for more boost, but less responsive on initial acceleration than say a 10.7:1 CR piston? I was just reading before in another thread about CR and that's kinda the gist that I got. Basically around what we have stock is close to a good medium for CR if not slightly higher for a quick off the line streetable car.

 

[MrDiggler]

So the 8.5:1 CR pistons would have a potential for more boost, but less responsive on initial acceleration than say a 10.7:1 CR piston? I was just reading before in another thread about CR and that's kinda the gist that I got. Basically around what we have stock is close to a good medium for CR if not slightly higher for a quick off the line streetable car.

I'd agree with that. I think the 9:1 is about ideal, but 8.5:1 is still decent. There are a lot of other factors that come into play when figuring the optimum CR, such as combustion chamber design, the amount of boost you want to run, type of fuel, the abilities of your EMS, etc. Generally speaking and based on my experiences with the GTX, I'd say 8.5-9:1 would be the sweet spot if you're not going to throw insane boost to it.

The GTX does have a 1.6 L vs. our 2.0 L, which obviously makes some difference in off boost response between the two, but I still wouldn't want to go below 8:5-1 on my MSP. The initial off boost snap we've got is really nice, and pretty good for a turbo car. Now all we need is consistent ON boost snap, lol.

 

[MSpeed2397]

No doubt about that...I hate the gradual power loss through the RPM band that our cars have. I gotta say I LOVE my car to death, but omfg that thing has given me so many problems lately, and apparently all because of the previous owner. I looked into getting the problem with my engine fixed through the extended warranty I bought and I dunno if that's even going to happen. I'm just looking to get an effing running MSP!!!!!! RAAR!!! - sorry for rant

 

[mspHtown]

No doubt about that...I hate the gradual power loss through the RPM band that our cars have. I gotta say I LOVE my car to death, but omfg that thing has given me so many problems lately, and apparently all because of the previous owner. I looked into getting the problem with my engine fixed through the extended warranty I bought and I dunno if that's even going to happen. I'm just looking to get an effing running MSP!!!!!! RAAR!!! - sorry for rant

what mods did the previous owner put on?

 

[MSpeed2397]

Well to start things off, apparently it wasn't him, but I don't know what/who to believe...but:

He had an FMIC, exhaust, intake, BOV, blah blah, bunch of bolt ons, maybe a TT as well, I can ask MSPro to see what exactly he had on it. He was a previous forum member, but he sold his car. Evidently a kid at the subie dealer where he traded in his car over-revved it and blew the third piston ring. Like I said though, there's a 1000 stories so I don't know what to believe. I don't think he had any engine management though (maybe unichip if anything). My third cylinder piston ring is bad though, and I probably need to replace all my gaskets as well because I'm burning TONS of oil. If anyone would be interested in helping me replace some things, that would be AWESOME, but I dunno what to do besides get a built motor or have mine remachined and get forged internals for it. - - - it's just frustrating to not have a running MSP!!!!!!!

 

[Little Beavis]

it's just frustrating to not have a running MSP!!!!!!!

I feel your pain. Been there done that. I've got a MPI block with all the goodies, a MPI tweaked turbo, and lots of other goodies. But the best modification was to have NSN come put a Microtech in there. A whole different car - it is awesome. But now my wife wants me to sell it. . .:bs:

If you're ever in the Chicago area, I'd be happy to show you all the goodies and if my wife gets her way, maybe you'd get first dibs. The cars do have some nice potential once you get everything right. But I suffered a whole lot of frustration before achieving Protege nirvana or something!

 

[MSpeed2397]

No doubt about it..how much did you pay for the built block and tweaked turbo? I'd assume the GT28RS internals help out tremendously, but I dunno...I'm just looking to get a price range here.