RAM AIR CAI Available from RM Racing

[70]

Um, DG Motorsports already has a carbon fiber hood for ram air...

And no one makes an aftermarket MAF that just plugs in and plays. The only way I have to get a better MAP would be on a stand alone set up. Personally, only the addition of a CAI would not warrant the cost of a stand alone ECU set up.

 

[slooper]

Is that who makes it? I remember seeing pics and a link to one back in February or so, but couldn't find it again. Do you have a link, Stutters? Anyway, even if someone else does make one, I'm still going to talk to RM about making one - perhaps they can do it better or sell it for cheaper.

 

[70]

Here is the link to the DG Motorsports Ram Air Hood...

 

[big_ben]

You guys that bought this piece of crap! That's ok, I knew I'd get flamed with my last statement. I have a slow conection on the weekend and to add to the fact that I'm drunk, I'll wait untill monday to post about the "ram air" CAI again. What a ******* joke! No offence to anyone who bought it, but you got ******* had! Damn that must suck!

Also, ....... To anyone who doesn't know how to spell right or doesn't want to spend the time to spell right, I am drunker than a ******* crack ***** that just got some anal loving for $25. And guess what, I can still spell right. It might be very slow, but I can still spell right. GOD DAMN I'M ****** UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I AM SO DAMN DRUNK RIGHT NOW! I feel good as a matter of fact, I love you all. Even the dumb one's that got ripped off on the fake "Ram Air" CAI's. hahahahahahahahaha!(rofl)

 

[YAK Motorsports]

Actually, I bet there is a significant amount of pressure at the location that the intake is getting air from.

It's getting air from the bottom of the car right in front of the front wheels. This is the same place that air collects and would eventually apply a lifting force to the front of the car... Not that the protege can get that fast.

Is it enough to be worth the price tag? That's a judgement call, best left to whoever is forking over the money for the intake.


Oh yeah, big_ben, "Disentegrate"??? Do you mean disintegrate?

 

[pingdum]

Not to mention "conection"

 

[pingdum]

That ram air hood is bad as s***!!! Oh for $1200 and no mouths to feed

 

[70]

Actually, I bet there is a significant amount of pressure at the location that the intake is getting air from.

It's getting air from the bottom of the car right in front of the front wheels. This is the same place that air collects and would eventually apply a lifting force to the front of the car... Not that the protege can get that fast.

Is it enough to be worth the price tag? That's a judgement call, best left to whoever is forking over the money for the intake.


Oh yeah, big_ben, "Disentegrate"??? Do you mean disintegrate?

But where most of the CAI available go to, and where it appears that this one is going to, the spot in the front side of the wheel well is almost completely shut off from the outside world. What little air goes in there comes from in front of the fog lamp. No air comes in from the ground, it is completely covered by plastic.

 

[slooper]

But where most of the CAI available go to, and where it appears that this one is going to, the spot in the front side of the wheel well is almost completely shut off from the outside world. What little air goes in there comes from in front of the fog lamp. No air comes in from the ground, it is completely covered by plastic.

Well, StuttersC, as mentioned in a previous post and something I guess I should have emphasized, is that UNLIKE EVERY OTHER CAI AVAILABLE the piping for this one goes THROUGH THE WHEEL WELL AND BUMPER ASSEMBLY to a large plastic scoop that is attached just behind the lower grill, directly in front of the radiator. And yes, big_ben, this will steal a little bit of cool air from cooling the radiator which still makes it a huge rip-off. It is, however, a huge rip-off that I believe has given me at least a horse or two more than any of the other CAIs I could have purchased.

So anyone who wants more horsepower, buy this CAI. If you are worried about what your friends will say when you show them that you put missed out on another opportunity to throw something shiny under your hood and went with corrugated piping, then I would still suggest buying this CAI and then selling your car to someone who wants more horsepower.

IMHO

(getsome)

 

[70]

Would it not make for a better intake tract if the piping went straight down to the scoop in the gril, as opposed to go all over the place in the front end of the car to get to the scoop.

And if it does have a scoop that is facing the front of the car, then that would add a "ram air" effect to the whole intake system. The next question would be is there a postive air flow build up in that spot so that the "ram air" effect can be capitalized on, or is it a negative air space where there would be little or no "ram air" effect.

And the next thing I would say is you can't feel a one or two horsepower gain on the butt dyno...Dyno it and let us know how it does. Or even better, put the stock intake back on, run some 40-60 times. Then put the new intake back in with and with out the "ram air" part, and run the same stretch of road for some more 40-60 mph times. The improvement in your acceleration times would show more horsepower from the ram air v just the intake, etc.

 

[slooper]

Well, I talked to Jason on Friday trying to get more technical info on the intake considering how much "interest" this thread was getting. He told me that as soon as their cat-back and possible header is completed, then they plan on doing dynos on the Protege with the various combinations (all stock, CAI and all stock, CAI and Catback, Catback and all stock, etc...). I don't have near the time to do a swap and test it out on the highway myself; I kinda already did that while driving it the previous 14K miles. So, I told Jason to get me those numbers as soon as they can and I'll let you all know what the official numbers are.
Regarding the "negative vs positive air flow" I would take a guess that considering the scoop is directly in line with the grill for the radiator that it would simply collect air from a flow channel that the car was originally designed for and that considering the two grills are more likely to have "positive air flow" than anywhere else on the front of the car IMO then it's a safe bet mounting the scoop there. Mind you, I cannot back this up with technical jargon so please - those who know the technical jargon - explain away!

 

[big_ben]

Ok, now that I'm at work and not drunk, I'll post my more technical reason as to why this "ram air" CAI is NOT ram air. If you have been through any fluid dynamics classes such as myself since I'm an engineering student, you would already know this and you wouldn't have bought one of these. In order for "ram air" to work correctly, (and some people still believe that it doesn't work until you reach speeds up to 150+mph), it needs a pretty much straight path into the throttle body. Strike one. If you look at the picture, the CAI comes up from the wheel well, (curve 1), then it turns 90 degrees toward the front of the car, (curve 2), then it turns back towards the battery, (curve 3), then the intake tube turns into the throttle body.(curve 4) Thats four curves of more than 90 degres each. So I think we have concluded that this CAI is NOT a "ram air" setup at all. As a matter of fact, it's not even close.

Now, is this a CAI? Well, if you will look at the setup of the tube that is running from the wheel well, you will notice that it is connected to a filter that is breathable on the sides and on the cap. This cold air tube is only connected to the cap. So really, this CAI is only getting cold air from the cap area and not the sides. Now I'll do some math for you.
The filter looks like it is about 5" long and has about a 6" diameter, that's a 3" radius. But, the cold air tube is only about 3" diameter. That's only 1.5" radius.

Area with cold air=(3.14)*1.5^2=7.07sqr. inches of cold air
Area of hot engine bay air=2*(3.14)*3*6=113.1sqr. inches of warm air

If you don't understand the formulas I just used, the first is Pi multiplied by the radius squared.
The second is 2 multiplied by Pi multiplied by the radius multiplied by the height of the filter. This is the respective surface areas that are collecting air.

Obviously you can see that the warm air area is more than 16 times the area of the cold air. So you make your own conclusions. My conclusion is that this is not even a CAI, it's only about 1/10 CAI. And it has no "ram air" properties at all.

 

[Kooldino]

You guys that bought this piece of crap! That's ok, I knew I'd get flamed with my last statement. I have a slow conection on the weekend and to add to the fact that I'm drunk, I'll wait untill monday to post about the "ram air" CAI again. What a ******* joke! No offence to anyone who bought it, but you got ******* had! Damn that must suck!

Also, ....... To anyone who doesn't know how to spell right or doesn't want to spend the time to spell right, I am drunker than a ******* crack ***** that just got some anal loving for $25. And guess what, I can still spell right. It might be very slow, but I can still spell right. GOD DAMN I'M ****** UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I AM SO DAMN DRUNK RIGHT NOW! I feel good as a matter of fact, I love you all. Even the dumb one's that got ripped off on the fake "Ram Air" CAI's. hahahahahahahahaha!(rofl)

Actually, you spelled "offence" wrong. It should be "offense".

 

[big_ben]

Oh well, I was plastered.

 

[Kooldino]

Ok, now that I'm at work and not drunk, I'll post my more technical reason as to why this "ram air" CAI is NOT ram air. If you have been through any fluid dynamics classes such as myself since I'm an engineering student, you would already know this and you wouldn't have bought one of these. In order for "ram air" to work correctly, (and some people still believe that it doesn't work until you reach speeds up to 150+mph), it needs a pretty much straight path into the throttle body. Strike one. If you look at the picture, the CAI comes up from the wheel well, (curve 1), then it turns 90 degrees toward the front of the car, (curve 2), then it turns back towards the battery, (curve 3), then the intake tube turns into the throttle body.(curve 4) Thats four curves of more than 90 degres each. So I think we have concluded that this CAI is NOT a "ram air" setup at all. As a matter of fact, it's not even close.

Now, is this a CAI? Well, if you will look at the setup of the tube that is running from the wheel well, you will notice that it is connected to a filter that is breathable on the sides and on the cap. This cold air tube is only connected to the cap. So really, this CAI is only getting cold air from the cap area and not the sides. Now I'll do some math for you.
The filter looks like it is about 5" long and has about a 6" diameter, that's a 3" radius. But, the cold air tube is only about 3" diameter. That's only 1.5" radius.

Area with cold air=(3.14)*1.5^2=7.07sqr. inches of cold air
Area of hot engine bay air=2*(3.14)*3*6=113.1sqr. inches of warm air

If you don't understand the formulas I just used, the first is Pi multiplied by the radius squared.
The second is 2 multiplied by Pi multiplied by the radius multiplied by the height of the filter. This is the respective surface areas that are collecting air.

Obviously you can see that the warm air area is more than 16 times the area of the cold air. So you make your own conclusions. My conclusion is that this is not even a CAI, it's only about 1/10 CAI. And it has no "ram air" properties at all.

He does make some good points. I'm sure the intake system does do something. And it probably adds about the same amount of whp as a CAI, which isn't anything huge.

A solution would be to surround the sides of the intake filter with a peice of plastic attached to the intake hose, so that air can only be taken in from the intake piping.

 

[LinuxRacr]

I thought you could only spit off knowledge like that when you were drunk!?

 

[big_ben]

I'm sure it does have some gains to it, but the whole point of my post is that what they are claiming is ABSOLUTELY false. Really, you are paying more money for a CAI that doesn't get 100% cold air such as the Injen or the MHP. That is why I say it's a rip off.

Also, here is another point that will negate ANY pressurized air. The corrugated hose is flexable. That should show you that it won't work. If the hose is pressurized, it will slightly inflate, and the air is not pressurized anymore. Why do you think all drag racing ram air induction paths are made of carbon fiber. It is solid, it wont flex or inflate.

 

[Gyre]

Good ram air article

http://www.snowgoercanada.com/tech_ram_air.shtml

It may be a snowmobile article but I doubt our speeds are much higher for most of us.

 

[big_ben]

In order to implement ram air, the carburetors or throttle-bodies of our engine must seal to an airbox whose volume is large enough that the intake cycle of one cylinder cannot pull its internal pressure down significantly.

If any gains were seen from this cold air tube, the gains would be lost by the open filiment on the sides of the filter. Any pressurized air would be ejected from the sides of the filter. This is of course IF the air was first pressurized, and it's not of course.

Please, someone prove me wrong, I'm begging you.

 

[Gyre]

Please, someone prove me wrong, I'm begging you.

* Puts barometer in cold air pipe

* Puts barometer in front of big_ben's mouth

Well ... the pressure is higher in front of big_ben's mouth, anyway.

J/K

It was too easy. I couldn't resist. Nothing personal and no harm intended.