Now using the MAP sensor..

[MPNick]

Yes, I am a nuts.


Then what's wrong with his car? Wasn't he running ok when he had an FMU, before he put the MPI in?


.

You bloody well know he was having the same problems with the FMU/clamp setup he had. Do not play dumb, and do not start s***.

 

[Kooldino]

No you do not know how to tune the stock MAF, thats why you are not doing it that way.

Sure I do. I've tuned several EMS before. All using MAF.

What the hell do you not understand? People are tuning the stock MAF everyday on the forum. You could not because you do not know what you are doing.

Right, now it's that I don't know what I'm doing. Point the finger of blame at me. And you know what? Pat doesn't know what he's doing either. Neither did 505zoom. Or pdhaudio. Or several other people that have experience with other EMS. Need I go on? Putting ambiguous numbers in an 8x16 grid is NOT how most EMS are tuned.

Are these people thinking they are tuning the MAF, but they are not? You keep making post's about why you cannot do it but you just do not understand.

I never said you CANNOT do it. I'm just pointing out the issues with it. You're saying I can't properly tune with a MAP. But I have.

Nick, you keep making assumptions about me. Stop. I'm just here defending my MAP loving ways.

Mazda Protge forum members are tuning the stcok and my aftermarkt MAF all day long. You cannot say it cannot be done it is being done. Stop saying it cannot be done it is, every ******* day.

When the HELL did I say it cannot be done? Now you're putting words into my mouth. I only said that it's EASIER to tune with a MAP vs a MAF, partially do to the limited resolution of the MPI tuner.

This is why you do not know what the hell you are talking about. Other ems system like standalones need the have more resoultions, because are running the whole thing. We are a piggyback, we do not need to do what the standalones need to do.

(poke) Now you're saying that more than EIGHT positions for TPS is pointless? A piggyback will make just as good a use as high resoultion as a standalone would. There have been several cases in my tuning of the MPI where I would have liked more resolution in my tuning map, but since the MPI sometimes interpolates between cells, I was able to get away with the resolution that the MPI offers.

 

[Kooldino]

You bloody well know he was having the same problems with the FMU/clamp setup he had. Do not play dumb,

I didn't know he was having issues with the FMU...and I'm not "playing dumb". I apologize for not having a timeline of Pat's car issues in front of me.

and do not start s***.

I haven't started anything, and I'm not trying to. Chill out, man. (hippy)

First you accuse me of "hating the MPI", then you put words into my mouth, you tell me I don't know how to tune, then you accuse me of "starting s***"...

I'm trying to help out others, just like you are. We disagree on one thing...I prefer MAP on the MPI and you prefer MAF. Big deal. Stop bringing up the fact that I like to MAP tune, and I'll stop replying to you and defending my position. We're not going to change each other's minds here.

 

[igdrasil]

I want to jump and say that Linux's car is having O2 sensor issues, and running limp mode.

I bet $20.00

 

[LinuxRacr]

I wouldn't doubt this. What are the symptoms of limp mode?

 

[acidbug]

Dana Man...how can you say..some of these things..THe mpi tuner..is a piggy back...it alters the oem maps to accomadate boost. As nick mentioned...other ems's..like haltech or whatever..do no tend to use oem maps...which is the main reason why they have much more variables to play with & the map sensor.

I know you believe that tuning w/ the map is far better than tuning w/ a maf...but fact is that anyone can tune using the stock maf...it's all about how dilligent the tuner is to fine tune when boost hits..Nick is nice enough to come on the boards and talk about these old ass issues...but really..there is no need to keep coming back to this same bulls***..of Map Vs. Maf...

Plain & simple..they both work! How well they work has to do with the person who is tuning them.

Pat..man..you car has lots of issues..to work out..i have tried to help you out...for your car..i would pull out the mpi tuner..all together..you have the vc in place...just purchase a $100 RRFPR...and put it in...it's the easiest way to see if the mpi tuner is causing it to lean out...I personally do no have problems with it leaning out..if anything i have the opposite problem..the colder it gets here in NJ...the ******* richer i run...and it has to do w/ my tuning...It's hard to tune for 10degrees...when the weather keeps changing from 60 to below zero...

I still agree w/ the masses..that you o2 sensor is ******..i mean..the pictures you showed of how frayed the wiring is...is clearly an indicator..that you o2 sensor..has been reading wrong #'s..and would indeed cause you to lean out...

Replace it..save yourself the headache...and atleast you will know if the o2 sensor was causing the bulls***...

Also, check out your fuel pump...maybe it's no upto handling the amount of pressure...i know you have the pierberg..blah blah blah..but if i remember correctly...over time..they tend to make the stock fuel pump...fail...and make wierd noises...

-chas

 

[igdrasil]

I wouldn't doubt this. What are the symptoms of limp mode?

Poor driveability
Basically poor throttle response.
Probably cold start issues

Small changes in the analog map doesnt do s***. Big changes...maybe

BUT its very consistent with A/F ratios if you have a good map for the limp mode. Limp mode=very basic map that will ignore most sensors.

Being turbo is not that evident if its been happening for a long time.

The bad thing is, if you have problems with both O2 sensors, the car will be running in limp mode. In my case, my 2nd O2 sensor does not exists and the 1st O2 has some wiring done to it, sometimes it fails to read good.

 

[igdrasil]

I still agree w/ the masses..that you o2 sensor is ******..i mean..the pictures you showed of how frayed the wiring is...is clearly an indicator..that you o2 sensor..has been reading wrong #'s..and would indeed cause you to lean out...
-chas

Guess what, all my problems started when my O2 sensor wires melted on the Wastegate....

So...matt, please check your O2...

 

[Captain KRM P5]

so to sum things up in a simpler manner...if you have the MPI tuner wired up the way MPNick says to wire it up and he tunes it for you personally, you're ok. if you have the MPI tuner but are left to tune it on your own you're screwed. if you throw out his instructions and install it the way Kooldino says to, your car runs very well and the tuning actually makes logical sense.

So the best way to use the MPI tuner is to either live in or near West Long Branch or do it Kooldino's way? Why again did Beau over at MAM drop the MPI tuner?

Sorry if that sounds like a "flame" but that's what I'm getting out of all this.

 

[terbow]

I think your level of understanding for tuning would have a factor as well. It seems like you need to see what the car is doing and tune it from there, rather than get into micro detail and figure it out. It seems like if you try to hard it gets more difficult than it should be (if your car is 100% before you install). I dont think nicks way doesnt make logical sense, but tuning from the map and maf are different. I wouldnt discontinue either method if they both work which they do.

 

[Focus]

so to sum things up in a simpler manner...if you have the MPI tuner wired up the way MPNick says to wire it up and he tunes it for you personally, you're ok. if you have the MPI tuner but are left to tune it on your own you're screwed. if you throw out his instructions and install it the way Kooldino says to, your car runs very well and the tuning actually makes logical sense.

So the best way to use the MPI tuner is to either live in or near West Long Branch or do it Kooldino's way? Why again did Beau over at MAM drop the MPI tuner?

Sorry if that sounds like a "flame" but that's what I'm getting out of all this.

Then you need to go back and read. Because all you are doing is starting this flame war back up.,

BTW what experience do you have with the MPI?

 

[igdrasil]

Thing is:

Inexperienced tuner = will have problems with any EMS

MAP sensor = easier to tune, thats it.

 

[MPNick]

Sorry if that sounds like a "flame" but that's what I'm getting out of all this.

Lets see. The guys that have no problems with there car can tune just like I tell them to. They can tune it all on their own from any in the world. The guys with problems can try anyway they what to. The problems will still be there. You cannot tune around a problem. You are getting out of this with what you came into this thread with.

 

[Captain KRM P5]

Thing is:

Inexperienced tuner = will have problems with any EMS

MAP sensor = easier to tune, thats it.

fair enough

BTW what experience do you have with the MPI?

onhand and direct observation of how it is wired up and tuned with the software. which is more than most people who just come to a thread to pick a fight.

Lets see. The guys that have no problems with there car can tune just like I tell them to. They can tune it all on their own from any in the world. The guys with problems can try anyway they what to. The problems will still be there. You cannot tune around a problem. You are getting out of this with what you came into this thread with.

sounds like an accusation of bias. if there is any bias it only comes from what I have seen, read and heard about problems with the unit. carry on.

 

[Focus]

onhand and direct observation of how it is wired up and tuned with the software

On who's car ??

 

[MPNick]

Well I finally hooked up the MAP sensor tonight, and let me tell you, the car drives much smoother than before. Drives just like stock when not in boost. When I nail the gas, I am gone!! I need to retune my fuel map, but the outlook is promising!!

OK Pat, it has been a while since your last post here. How is the car running with the MAP? Is it 100% better, is it fixed, or are you still having problems?

How about an update on your car on this thread?

 

[Captain KRM P5]

On who's car ??

pdhaudio's turbocharged mp3. just from what I saw, I wasn't too impressed. but knowing the typical rhetoric, I'll be told that its not the fault of the MPI software and that problems had with the unit are the user's problems and not the MPI tuner. I'll be told that Linux, Pdhaudio, Matthew, Mental Addiction, Kooldino, SpicyMcHaggis and everyone else who has had problems - many of them the same ones - with thier MPI had them because they are either incompetent or because their cars have problems, right? And that even though Juan sold a bunch of working, drivable and perfectly fine HiBoost turbo kits with his own engine management the MPI is superior, correct?

so please feel free to tear into me or tell me my impressions of the tuning software or performance are unjustified in some way because of the owner, I fully expect you to do so and shut me down as MPNick so often does with people that dare complain.

 

[Captain KRM P5]

OK Pat, it has been a while since your last post here. How is the car running with the MAP? Is it 100% better, is it fixed, or are you still having problems?

How about an update on your car on this thread?

yes, I suppose this really should be about Pat's car. I apologize for getting heated with my opinions and taking attention away from his problem. Hopefully it can be resolved as he has had enough bad luck with his car in the past two years

 

[MPNick]

pdhaudio's turbocharged mp3. just from what I saw, I wasn't too impressed. but knowing the typical rhetoric, I'll be told that its not the fault of the MPI software and that problems had with the unit are the user's problems and not the MPI tuner. I'll be told that Linux, Pdhaudio, Matthew, Mental Addiction, Kooldino, SpicyMcHaggis and everyone else who has had problems - many of them the same ones - with thier MPI had them because they are either incompetent or because their cars have problems, right? And that even though Juan sold a bunch of working, drivable and perfectly fine HiBoost turbo kits with his own engine management the MPI is superior, correct?

so please feel free to tear into me or tell me my impressions of the tuning software or performance are unjustified in some way because of the owner, I fully expect you to do so and shut me down as MPNick so often does with people that dare complain.

Linux, still has not fixed his car. The same problem pulled fuel before the MPI is pulling it now, so 1 down.

Matthew, Gos this is a gift. He still has not fixed his car. Turned out he tried to run the system without a ait temp sensor among not wired the system right, 2 down.

PDHaudio, blown O2, screwed up latop top the crashed and MAF that was installed backwards, 3 down.

MAM, loves the system and just got one from me last week, 4 down.

Dana has the system working the way he likes it to work. Still think he would gain from using the MAF but what ever. We will see how great it is at the dyno day.

Spicy, not sure who he is. May not know him from that name.

People come here and tell that they love the system. You do not care about that. You are only looking to cause s***, I do not care because I have seen you type many times before.

Juan has seen people have the very same problems as I have. If you think his setup is better thats great, get one.

 

[Captain KRM P5]

MAM, loves the system and just got one from me last week, 4 down.

odd. last i heard from him and pat he was dropping it favor of his own AEM

People come here and tell that they love the system. You do not care about that. You are only looking to cause s***, I do not care because I have seen you type many times before.

I actually have not really seen alot of these positive messages in comparision to the numerous negative ones, so if there are a plethora of praises I'd be happy to read them. Unless you mean the positive ones from the people whom you have tuned yourself. I am not here to "cause s***" as you put it because I really have nothing to gain from that. I post because of the impressions I had from what I had seen and heard from people who have owned and been tuning this car for a long time, as well as what seems to be the same damn problem over and over and over again on different cars. plus you seem to take a pissed off and hostile approach to anyone who even suggests that the MPI is not the Lord's gift to engine management. and excuse me for not exactly digging the software.

Juan has seen people have the very same problems as I have. If you think his setup is better thats great, get one.

already have one and its ran solid from day one, has been a relative breeze to tune.