New MSP/P5/MP3/Sedan Radiator!!!

[Jaysanooch]

at this rate, it's looking like MSP owners are screwed again and having to hack up their (expensive) stock fan shrouds or buy fans to fit this radiator ALSO

Thanks for pointing this out. If this is the case, I'm out! Hacking up the fan shrouds wasn't my plan at all.

I'm willing to wait this out for the final design....buying brackets is one thing but stock fans and all must fit.

 

[AusOrion]

Thanks for pointing this out. If this is the case, I'm out! Hacking up the fan shrouds wasn't my plan at all.

I'm willing to wait this out for the final design....buying brackets is one thing but stock fans and all must fit.

As we haven't gotten to the final design stage, I'm sure there is time for some adjustments to be made. We are still waiting for a few more deposits to come in before we even move onto the final design stage anyway.

I think that all of this is showing that the majority of buyers are MSP owners, although it is not clear how many of then are still running stock fans/shrouds.

I personally could deal with having to source my own fans (if the mounting points had to be for MSP's), but I am not only the only one in this so whatever direction this goes in everyone needs to be ok with it.

 

[Dpwhitehead1]

are there going to be 2 different types of rads being made?? i'm confused as to WHY you checked into the whole who has what setup.. mine might as well be considered a msp.. but.. lol. it's SOOO much different.

 

[AusOrion]

are there going to be 2 different types of rads being made?? i'm confused as to WHY you checked into the whole who has what setup.. mine might as well be considered a msp.. but.. lol. it's SOOO much different.

I doubt very much that there will be two different radiator setups made.

I looked into who was which car basically to see who would have MSP fans and who would have P5/sedan fans as the setups are very different in terms of how they are mounted.

I put you down as a sedan because I assumed that you went straight to a FMIC and would have kept your sedan radiator and fans.

 

[Dpwhitehead1]

no biggie. i have slim fans. and .. yes i will have a fmic.. something WAAAAy different than anyone however, as the cooler will be, for a dual setup. 2 inlets, one outlet.

 

[AusOrion]

no biggie. i have slim fans.

Ok, well you already have slim fans and I would be willing to go to slim fans.

That just leaves pw~mp5 and lemondrops (although he may be an MSP - I'm not sure) that may require non-MSP mounting points for their fans.

Tom, I'm not trying to cause issues. I am just trying to help this result in a workable solution for all. Hope to get your thoughts or an update in the near future.

Cheers.

 

[Dpwhitehead1]

Ok, well you already have slim fans and I would be willing to go to slim fans.

That just leaves pw~mp5 and lemondrops (although he may be an MSP - I'm not sure) that may require non-MSP mounting points for their fans.

Tom, I'm not trying to cause issues. I am just trying to help this result in a workable solution for all. Hope to get your thoughts or an update in the near future.

Cheers.

pmed you.

and i dont think it'll cause issues. tom is good bro. anything is good to help!

 

[littlemimus]

ok. so to run this radiator we will need a fmic. and slim line fans right? wouldnt u need those anyways if you ran a fmic?

 

[Dpwhitehead1]

ok. so to run this radiator we will need a fmic. and slim line fans right? wouldnt u need those anyways if you ran a fmic?

you dont need them no.. it just makes it much easier.

but yes. you will need a fmic

 

[AusOrion]

ok. so to run this radiator we will need a fmic. and slim line fans right? wouldnt u need those anyways if you ran a fmic?

You will need a FMIC for this radiator. It is in the first few posts of this thread. Also, you don't need slim fans if you are running a FMIC.

The aim is to have a radiator that you can bolt your stock fans onto. The discussion at the moment is how best to achieve this. Hopefully we will sort something out soon.

Cheers.

 

[littlemimus]

i knew we needed a fmic. i didnt get the fan part.

 

[Lemondrops]

hehe, i am a speeeeeeed!

 

[AusOrion]

hehe, i am a speeeeeeed!

Ok, so the majority of people in the group buy are MSP's. And two of the three non-MSP's are ditching their stock fans for slims anyway.

(member) - (stock fan setup)
1. o0n8 - MSP
2. Boostdprotegelx - Sedan
3. littlemimus - MSP
4. MS_Rick - MSP
5. Harrisonchang - MSP
6. MSPM1chele - MSP
7. AusOrion - Sedan
8. gtrs28 - MSP
9. MSP 2731 - MSP
10. Beat - MSP
11. pw~mp5 P5
12. Hellin1978 - MSP
13. Discospeed - MSP
14. SleepyMSP - MSP
15. Jaysanooch - MSP
16. lemondrops - MSP
17. ear8051 - MSP

 

[SleepyMSP]

so guys...we still need a few payments...

 

[MP3racer]

Well I have taken a few days to brainstorm and work with the engineer at Mishimoto on the suggestions/requests made.

First off, I would like to say that it was never our intention with this project to have as stated in a previous post here.... " at this rate, it's looking like MSP owners are screwed again"

I really appreciate everyones comments, suggestions, and input but when it comes in that form it is really not beneficial for anyone!

Second, the intention as stated from the start was to get for our market a performance radaitor that was of reasonable quality at a more reasonable cost than currently available. This required contacting and negotiating with several companies due to the relatively small market of the Protege let alone the even smaller market of the MSP.

So with those thoughts in mind I have attempted to come up with some ways to possibly make this work for as many as possible.

The passenger side (US) MSP radiator fan is similar in mounting on the top side to the sedan fan. The main difference is that the pointed locating lug on the bottom is longer. Rather than making those who wish to use this fan alter the fan I think an extra tab can be welded to the radiator. However, it will be directly below the tab for the sedan fan so when installing the radiator one of the tabs will need to be cut off.

As for the driver side (US) MSP fan, the fan runs into clearance issues with the water inlet. It seems as though it should be a simple solution to just change the palcement of the water inlet but with the cost constraints on this project it is not possible. Therefore, even though I have tried several means to get something to work for this fan I don't think it will be possible. The radiator will be set up to use the sedan/P5/MP3 driver side fan. If you determine it is necessary to have this fan several of these are available used on this forum very inexpensively.

Regarding the request to have the radiator mount so that the top of the tank is flush, that may be possible. However, the radiator dimensions are going to stay at those mentioned early on in the thread. The best way I have determined to make the radiator mounting similar to the MSP would be to provide extra long lugs on the bottom of the radiator and spacers that will allow the radiator to move up in the mounts to near the hieght of the MSP radiator. Once a prototype is received I can determine this further. My hope is that this will allow use of either the MSP mounting location and brackets or the sedan/P5 mounting location and brackets by simply using or not using some supplied spacers. If this is determined to be possible it may add some extra cost to the radiator.

I hope that our efforts in this project are appreciated??

I am open your thoughts on the ideas submitted to make as many Protege owners able to use this product as possible.

I am concerned that if a resolved consensus is not reached soon and the last few needed deposits are not received it may be a moot point....

 

[SleepyMSP]

I think for the pass side this solution is acceptable for everyone as those who do not need the tab can simply remove it with little effort

for the drivers side, would it be wrong to assume that the water inlet position on the new rad be different from the stock location? I was under the impression that both the MSP and protege inlets were in the same location?

for mounting options I believe the concept of making the rad flush is not necessarily to overcome the need to acquire additional brackets but to add overall efficiency by making a larger core. I would personally like to see a bigger core but will bend to the options available to the funding of the project

personally, I think everyone needs to remember that this is an after-market modification that may or may not be direct plug and play for everyone. Things are seldom perfect fits for any application

 

[MSP 2731]

Thank you Tom for your efforts to make this work, I appreciate it.

 

[SleepyMSP]

after looking at the p5 rad I see why the MSP fan will not fit properly here...still for me this is not an issue as I think I will be getting some slim fans to go in this thing anyway as I have a perrin FMIC and will be putting a MAM manifold on this summer

 

[pw~mp5]

I am not concerned about the stock fans. I will be getting new slim fans. Brackets are not an issue with me either, I will not be using factory brackets (Sedan/P5 or MSP). It would be very nice to have the larger core. A larger core provides more aftermarket fan options as to what size fans will fit, it is more efficient (even if only slightly) and fitting flush will make the installation look neater.

 

[AusOrion]

I am not concerned about the stock fans. I will be getting new slim fans. Brackets are not an issue with me either, I will not be using factory brackets (Sedan/P5 or MSP). It would be very nice to have the larger core. A larger core provides more aftermarket fan options as to what size fans will fit, it is more efficient (even if only slightly) and fitting flush will make the installation look neater.

Alrighty. Well from what I can make out all of the non-MSP people will be going to slim fans anyway. Tom, if you want to put the extra mounting point on for the passenger side sedan/P5 fan then thats ok, but it seems that its not needed.

I would also like to see a taller core with the radiator sitting flush. Although I think that if it came to the crunch, then the spacers would be a good compromise. Tom, would increasing the height of the core make fitting in the drivers-side MSP fan any easier?

Tom you are doing a good job and its good see that you are actually looking for feedback to get the best product achieveable within reason. It is very much appreciated!

Now, c'mon all those sitting on the fence about buying these. Lets get the last few deposits in so that we can get this happening! (cabpatch)