My poor Protege5 may be going to Mazda heaven.... :(

[tweety2300]

You should have heard a very loud ticking/knocking if a vlave hit a piston even over the radio. You may be able to find a head somewhere and it could be a cheap fix...

I had a vlave drop on a built scooter with over 4k invested in just the motor at over 70mph and about 9500rpms that was a fun experience so I feel your pain

 

[MasonMetcalfe]

sorry to hear bro.
I understand the cold, freezing my butt of over in MTL.

 

[RABID_MP5]

yeah worst case scenario realized.

BTW when a broken timing belt is suspected you can just pull the oil filler cap and see if the exhaust camshaft turns with the starter motor. Also, you can pull the little middle section of the timing cover without pulling the valve cover.

 

[Lboogs]

Sorry to hear that, I hope things work out for you.....................................I'm a little confused as to why this intereference/non-interference issue still hasn't been resolved. What did Mazda classify the FS-DE as? I'm sure the manufacturer is the best voice to say iwhat this engine is or isn't right?

 

[MazdaSpeeder]

Mazda says it is interference, so it is. The reason this is debated is that some guys have had belts break with no damage. However, as the OP has experienced first hand, that's not always the case. The belt can break and no damage occurs, especially at low speeds, but you can also destroy your engine.

 

[Lboogs]

^^^^^
good to know thanks for your response

 

[i12drivemyMP5]

If it hits when the belt breaks and bends valves then it was interference, it it doesn't then it wasn't. Either you were lucky or unlucky. This unresolved debate has been going on for years. Assume it is interference, act accordingly as far as maintenance goes & have no problems. If you don't know if or when the timing belt has ever been done and you have 80k miles or more and bought used then just change belt, tensioner, cam seals, vc gasket & water pump while there and be done with it. Is it more of an imposition to be proactive about it or possibly be left stranded with a bunch of unecessary damage and it costing lots of extra time and money or worse possibly, depending on circumstances surrounding it breaking while driving.

 

[MazdaSpeeder]

^Right, but it's actually listed as "interference." There's no debate as to the classification, just to the actual damage or lack thereof in practice. So, it's an interference engine that sometimes doesn't damage when the belt breaks.

Agreed...proper maintenance is the key to no worries.

 

[Mike999]

Agreed to the above. We bought the car at 117 xxx km from a mazda dealer (though with no warranty, as it was an 8 year old model), and they assured us the belt was changed. We cant find anything in writing saying it was changed, though. My mech. said there's no way this is a belt with only 10 000km on it, and we were likely lied to by the dealer.

I wonder if there's anything we can do to get this paid for by the dealer...

 

[i12drivemyMP5]

There's no debate as to the classification.........

Based on the number of threads that still come up supporting both sides, I'd say the actual classification is debatable. Individual results when it happens aren't tho.......

I wonder if there's anything we can do to get this paid for by the dealer...

Highly unlikely

 

[MazdaSpeeder]

No trying to be a jerk here, but let me explain my reasoning.

A) If an engine is non-interference, then under no circumstances should a belt breaking bend valves or cause other damage.

B) If an engine is interference, then under some or all circumstances a timing belt breaking would bend valves or cause other damage.

A) is false. The OP and several other members can attest to damage caused by broken belts. To be non-interference, the engine should be designed to never be in a mechanical position where a timing belt breaking can cause parts to ram together that shouldn't. It sounds like it's relatively uncommon, but that this does happen, so the engine cannot be non-interference by definition and must be interference by design. Whether interference damage occurs depends on the situation.

Additionally, I know the Gates Manual lists this engine as interference. Sure, it's not ironclad proof, but it's worth noting.

 

[tweety2300]

I think we get the point that its interference...

 

[i12drivemyMP5]

If an engine is non-interference, then under no circumstances should a belt breaking bend valves or cause other damage.

There is no debate about this. ^^^^^ ......anything else = interference.
IMO, any engine that is interference or could be should have a timing chain, not a belt....from a consumer standpoint.

 

[MazdaSpeeder]

IMO, any engine that is interference or could be should have a timing chain, not a belt....from a consumer standpoint.

Agreed. I don't know why they wouldn't do that!

 

[RABID_MP5]

cost...from a business standpoint

 

[i12drivemyMP5]

Cost...yeah, understood but long term successful business models that focus on reliability and longevity making the consumer feel they are getting their money's worth is what generates customer loyalty and repeat business. I know, I live in a dream world where that should be more the norm, not something that would land you in a psych ward, lol.....but I'm 50, I come from a different time and place where things weren't geared towards instant gratification, shell games & take the money and run scammage.

 

[tweety2300]

Honestly I don't think mazda cares about a 10 yr old car they're not making any money off it. If you want something reliable get an early 90s honda or and 80s model car with a 305,350,302,351 they last forever and they have a huge market even now. Cars are meant to break down now its "better" for buisness to them

 

[P-Funk!]

i understand that, but i was just throwing out a suggestion, somehow it worked and ive heard of it working before. im no going to bother dissecting it happens though, just like the pyramids, nobody knows how they happened they just know they did. its also possible the engine filled with so much fuel it was able to run for a little while with open valaves

Nope. Simply impossible. From my MS/Engineering and 30+ years wrenching experience - it ain't happening.
I understand that you just wanted to help...

 

[MasonMetcalfe]

I don't know about ontario Mike but in Quebec you can go back and sue the previous owner of something if it can be proved that they made fraudulent claims even if its 40 years later.

 

[Lboogs]

slighty off topic. I currently have 88500k on my '02 LX 5spd. I planned on waiting till 100K + before doing the tbelt change b/c I thought it was N/I. After reading this thread I am planning to just get it over with on or before 90k. I have all the part numbers that I need and plan to order from onlinemazda.com. My question is for those who have personal experience, and wrenching experince. Is the Gates Tbelt kit on Rockauto reliable/equivalent to OEM reliability? I don't mind paying for OEM parts, but when I see the tensioner is $130, idler is $43, and tbelt is $40, and the Gates kit is $130 for all three. I wonder if it's a waste of money to buy those parts from Mazda if the kit is just as reliable. Have any of you seen or used the kit? What is your experience. How does the belt quality compare? how does the quality of the tensioner and idler pulley compare?