MSP Engine Internals

[perfworks]

no internals are not forged

rods and crank are forged. But the rods are not spec'd for high boost pressures

 

[Bigg Tim]

So would it be possible to get the MSP software into a MP3 or P5 ecu? Is that what the flash is, a completely new program? I thought it was just some patches.

 

[70]

Then we still don't know "for sure" if the rods were switched at the last minute on the docks...

Just because he saw them up close doesn't prove anything.


I guess we'll ahve to wait for the legal battle to be over with to find out for sure.

 

[perfworks]

So would it be possible to get the MSP software into a MP3 or P5 ecu? Is that what the flash is, a completely new program? I thought it was just some patches.

you are correct sir! It CAN rewrite the entire fuel and ignition map.

 

[1sty]

He said 2 contradicting things, which is right?

 

[70]

So would it be possible to get the MSP software into a MP3 or P5 ecu? Is that what the flash is, a completely new program? I thought it was just some patches.

In order to flash the ECU the whole program has to be written on it. So, I'm sure they are just patches as the software is concerned, but where the flash is concerned its all or nothing.

It is possible, just finding a dealer to do it is tough.

 

[Turbo Matty P]

long story short, the rods and pistons are the same factory pieces across the model range. They are not forged. I've seen them first hand....hell I almost caught the rod as it shot out of my block! The point is...if you plan on running higher boost levels and you want the peace of mind that comes with forged internals....DO IT BEFORE THERE IS A PROBLEM. Had i built my block FIRST I wouldn't be driving a new P5 today!!

If you want to beef up the internals all you should really worry about are the pistons, rods, and head gasket. The stock compressions ratio of 9.1:1 is fine for running 15-22psi on that small turbo. If you plan on getting serious (25-30psi) look into dropping down to 8.5:1.

The headgasket would be the first thing I would upgrade for you guys running 9-13psi. Seriously, listen to me...it's cheap and it'll save your motor!!

 

[perfworks]

He said 2 contradicting things, which is right?

I just clarified it.
I had to read it back then i edited it.
It can flash the entire program to be writen to the end users specs.

 

[1sty]

hmm, maybe its time to bribe a local service tech with some sub woofers for a reflash

 

[70]

long story short, the rods and pistons are the same factory pieces across the model range. They are not forged. I've seen them first hand....hell I almost caught the rod as it shot out of my block! The point is...if you plan on running higher boost levels and you want the peace of mind that comes with forged internals....DO IT BEFORE THERE IS A PROBLEM. Had i built my block FIRST I wouldn't be driving a new P5 today!!

If you want to beef up the internals all you should really worry about are the pistons, rods, and head gasket. The stock compressions ratio of 9.1:1 is fine for running 15-22psi on that small turbo. If you plan on getting serious (25-30psi) look into dropping down to 8.5:1.

The headgasket would be the first thing I would upgrade for you guys running 9-13psi. Seriously, listen to me...it's cheap and it'll save your motor!!

So the rods were broken?? Verified part numbers?

Because with what you have said here, and the reliable sources mentioned elsewhere, this is two different stories.

Then there is this:

Originally Posted by perfworks
rods and crank are forged. But the rods are not spec'd for high boost pressures

 

[Turbo Matty P]

anyone been able to get the MP3 flash in the P5?? I wouldn't mind "tipping" for that

 

[perfworks]

long story short, the rods and pistons are the same factory pieces across the model range. They are not forged. I've seen them first hand....hell I almost caught the rod as it shot out of my block! The point is...if you plan on running higher boost levels and you want the peace of mind that comes with forged internals....DO IT BEFORE THERE IS A PROBLEM. Had i built my block FIRST I wouldn't be driving a new P5 today!!

If you want to beef up the internals all you should really worry about are the pistons, rods, and head gasket. The stock compressions ratio of 9.1:1 is fine for running 15-22psi on that small turbo. If you plan on getting serious (25-30psi) look into dropping down to 8.5:1.

The headgasket would be the first thing I would upgrade for you guys running 9-13psi. Seriously, listen to me...it's cheap and it'll save your motor!!

Sorry bro but a little info is wrong here.
The stock rods and crank are forged. They may not be forged to the spec of an aftermarket manufacturer like pauter or crower and such but they are.
That doesnt mean that hey are any stronger than some cast units ive seen.
But the head gasket is also a metal performance unit . The Ford dual stage metal head gasket comes stock. It is a very good unit and will maintain boost pressures as long as the head doesnt warp.

 

[1sty]

not that I know of but I think I may be out to see if I can get a MSP flash to my MP3.

 

[70]

anyone been able to get the MP3 flash in the P5?? I wouldn't mind "tipping" for that

Not that i have heard...People just trade.

There was specualtion if the dealers had the MP3 program to begin with.

 

[Bigg Tim]

Sorry for the contradiction, I thought a patch was just some upgrades to existing software. I was not sure if the MSP software was different or if it was just the fuel and igniton maps that were different.

So are just the fuel and ignition maps different?

If that's the only difference, I may look into getting mine reflashed. I have a friend who works at a dealership and maybe he can pull some strings.

 

[PaulMP3]

THE MAN mentioned that 1/2 way through 2002 they changed the design of the pistons on the protege. Maybe anticipating the MSP

 

[Turbo Matty P]

You're correct Nick, the internals are slightly stronger, but not enough to handle what we're talking about doing. The same goes for the headgasket. Mine blew clean apart. If thats considered acceptable then so be it. I would just replace it with an all- copper racing unit that I know will hold over 30psi of boost. I've used them on my SVO motors and had no problems at all.

 

[1sty]

Ok so we have a compromise. They are forged and slightly stronger but still suck.

Excellent.

 

[perfworks]

You're correct Nick, the internals are slightly stronger, but not enough to handle what we're talking about doing. The same goes for the headgasket. Mine blew clean apart. If thats considered acceptable then so be it. I would just replace it with an all- copper racing unit that I know will hold over 30psi of boost. I've used them on my SVO motors and had no problems at all.

Those SVO motors needed something better back then. But now the new ford gaskets are in pretty good shape.
Oring and copper ok then i'll agree.
But the stock unit for me held great to 20 plus psi.

And yeah the rods and pistons are not strong enough by anymeans. Just a bit of info that is sometimes useful.

 

[Turbo Matty P]

My headgasket was in pieces. I am wondering why yours holds at 20psi and mine goes at 11-14??