Amp suggestions

[slvrProLX01]

Ok so i'm a bit of a newb at this audio stuff, and i was wondering what amp would u guys recommend for 4 speakers. I have the infinity reference series 6x8's up front and the Infinity reference series 6x9's in the rear. Im running them off a Pioneer deh-p4700mp head unit. They just sound like crap when there all running off the wimpy deck, but if i put all the deck's power to one speaker they sound pretty sweet. so i was wondering what kind of amp i should get b/c i kno nothing about amps whatsoever heh. It doesnt have to be nething fancy either. I'd say i wouldnt want to spend more than 200 dollars. thx guys

Phil

 

[slvrProLX01]

bump, anyone?

 

[Poseur]

This is a much more complex issue. I would wager that if "putting all the deck's power to one speaker" means adjusting fade and balance to say leftmax, front max, then your biggest issue is one of phase. essentially one or more of your speakers is "out of phase" meaning it's playing in when the other(s) are playing out. Essentially out of phase speakers will try to cancel eachother out.

To solve this problem, try first fading forward, balance left then right and see if the volume increases or decreases as you near centered. If centered has it sounding quieter (primarily in bassish notes) then try swapping your +- termianls to just one speaker and repeating the exercise. it should take care of it. as far as the rears go, front/rear phase is a strange one to conquer, I'd mostly try to make sure your fronts are in phase with eachother, then fading to the rear and doing the same there. make sure they're the same left/right and then we can work from there.

The reality of fade and balance isthat it never puts more power to any single speaker, it simply takes it away from teh rest. a balanced (0) setting will have all at full volume, fading to the left will decrease the right's volume but leave the left speaker at the same level. That deck you have has a decently stout amp (for a deck) and should produce a fair amount of volume with relatively efficient (and fairly bright) speakers like infinity refrences.

As far as amplifying things, that's never a bad idea, and I support that, however, you'll quite likely be needing to get some form of bass re-enforcement (subwoofer) read through the $1k challange thread, etc ideally I'd say get a decent 4ch amp and amp your fronts, then use the rear channels for a sub either now or down the road. let your rear speakers stay on deck-power (trust me that's all you need, especially in a sedan) Due to positioning it will take about 2-3times the output from your front speakers to even balance them out volume-wise with your rears that have such an easy straight shot to your ears. And that's assuming you even want a "balanced" sound. The audiophile way is a very strong front stage, and very minimal to no rear "fill" sound. My life's hectic lately, and one of our local gurus is jumping ship here, so while you can feel free to ask more questions, I cannot garantee any kind of rapid or detailed responce. If you're curious about a whole new world of sound quality please atleast skim the stickies and do a couple of searches, this site's honestly one of the best for true enthusiasts, but you'll have to accept that it might be a different world than what you once believed.

I've come a LOOONG ways with the help of the minds in here, you'd be astounded by how good a car stereo can sound. You do happen to have some good solid clean equiptment as a starting point, and coming from a guy who owns a $1k pair of front speakers that came in their own briefcase, that's saying alot.

 

[slvrProLX01]

Thanks for the input guys, I really appreciate it. What really boggles my mind is that when i first put my speakers in everything sounded great, but recently it just seems that the rear 6x9s arent hitting as hard or something. Theyre probably out of phase like Poseur said. What would cause the speakers to do that? Also i was thinking about just sticking with speakers because ill be going to college next year and i probably wont even have a car at college so whats the point, but maybe when i graduate I'll explore this world of sound quality

 

[Poseur]

glad to assist, let us know if the phase-trick helps. I'm 99% sure that'll atleast get you to a better baseline, and perhasp it'll achieve all you're looking for, but if you still feel you want to spend those 2 bills on your tunes, evaluate where you're at, and where you want to be and we can go from there. as I said, you'e got some decent speakers and a nice deck to start with. Probobally about exactly what I'd do (sans the rear speakers) with the same general budget.

 

[slvrProLX01]

Do you know what could cause speakers to become out of phase?

 

[Poseur]

they dont become out of phase, they would've jsut been hooked up incorrectly when they were installed. It's a quite common thing, did you install yourself or was it done at a shop?

Oh, and BTW, aim=poseurp, MSN=poseurp@hotmail.com, icq#2250996 if you want to try to catch me thatway. My yahoo's been hacked recently...

 

[slvrProLX01]

o ok thanks alot

 

[ChrisWinsor]

i have the infinity refrence 6X8's up front and the kappa 6X9's in the rear... it is being ran off a sony 500W 4ch amp ( for now cus i got it cheap)... the speakers can handle more... but that amp drives them very well. i would suggest maby the MTX 4004 or the 6004 (if you want the extra power but it is deff not needed.) but as it is i can drown out my sub with my speakers... and my sub is a infinity 1230W in a sealed box running off of a mtx 4001 amp... and the sub can shake the s*** outa the car if you want it to

 

[Hughes412]

I also have the refs up front and Kappas in back. I also have 2 of the ref 12in subs. The speakers run off of a 4ch P4004 RF amp. The speaks rate at 60w rms @4ohms. The amp I have gives out these numbers, which many feel is way under rated.

Rated Power 50 W x 4 @ 4 Ohms RMS
100 W x 4 @ 2 Ohms RMS
200 W x 2 @ 4 Ohms bridged RMS

I have it set at the 50w x 4 @4 so that the ohms are the same. I tryed the 100w x4x2 but blew the tweeters with in a week. The 50w is more then my ears can take and it sounds clear.

The subs are ran off a p5002 and it's putting
125 W x 2 @ 4 Ohms RMS
250 W x 2 @ 2 Ohms RMS
500 W x 1 @ 4 Ohms bridged RMS

 

[Poseur]

Okay, so if we REALLY If we wanna play mine's bigger with power numbers, my SS56.2components are getting 110w RMS each, and my SSMB8 in-door 8" midbass's are getting about 140 (same amp but 3ohm load) My old borrowed 12"eclipse alum that's had the surround reglued about 5times is recieving a beating of about 800wrms at 2ohms. I was loading my other sub to 1ohm at 1100. Oh, and my STOCK rear speakers are getting a healthy 15w or so from my deck whenever I turn that amp on which is basically never.

Grand total 110x2+140x2+800+15x2. I've got 1330many watts RMS. THIS IS ALOT. and have been running somewhere in the 1.5kw range for about 3years now. Do I ever use allof that? HELLNO. to be quite honest I don't think I could tolerate it. I likely listen to music quieter than 90% of the ppl in here. my power is all about headroom. Honestly numbers and brands and what you've got is only as good as the installation and tuning. Realistically mine is entirely overkill. All of that said, that all really means nothing, I'm not a guru, simply a guy who likes music, and likes to hear it as cleanly and true-to-life as I can possibly manage. Sound is a very subjective thing, and what's good to one may be wretchid to others. Working at a shop, and having the setup I have I very regularly have ppl want to "showoff" their "systems" to me at which point I generally cringe and wish I could pull off wearing earplugs.

After a couple chats with Phil, Changing his phase (reversing the polarity of one speaker) helped immensely. He's now pleased with is sound again, and not sure he needs anything more. Which is noble and a place I wish I could be at.

 

[Hughes412]

Noones trying to say mines bigger. I hope you didn't think I was. Actually I was trying to do the oposit. I've spent very little on my system and it sounds very good. You don't need a lot of power when you match the ohms and rms watts from amps to speakers. That's what I was trying to get at.

 

[Thug541]

Okay, so if we REALLY If we wanna play mine's bigger with power numbers, my SS56.2components are getting 110w RMS each, and my SSMB8 in-door 8" midbass's are getting about 140 (same amp but 3ohm load) My old borrowed 12"eclipse alum that's had the surround reglued about 5times is recieving a beating of about 800wrms at 2ohms. I was loading my other sub to 1ohm at 1100. Oh, and my STOCK rear speakers are getting a healthy 15w or so from my deck whenever I turn that amp on which is basically never.

Grand total 110x2+140x2+800+15x2. I've got 1330many watts RMS. THIS IS ALOT. and have been running somewhere in the 1.5kw range for about 3years now. Do I ever use allof that? HELLNO. to be quite honest I don't think I could tolerate it. I likely listen to music quieter than 90% of the ppl in here. my power is all about headroom. Honestly numbers and brands and what you've got is only as good as the installation and tuning. Realistically mine is entirely overkill. All of that said, that all really means nothing, I'm not a guru, simply a guy who likes music, and likes to hear it as cleanly and true-to-life as I can possibly manage. Sound is a very subjective thing, and what's good to one may be wretchid to others. Working at a shop, and having the setup I have I very regularly have ppl want to "showoff" their "systems" to me at which point I generally cringe and wish I could pull off wearing earplugs.

After a couple chats with Phil, Changing his phase (reversing the polarity of one speaker) helped immensely. He's now pleased with is sound again, and not sure he needs anything more. Which is noble and a place I wish I could be at.

Ha...i feel that. I thought I was perfectly happy with my setup (Infinity Kappa's fronts and backs and infinity perfect sub running of JL amps with an AVIC-N1 and ipod adaptor) buut of course, I want to upgrade haha. I want to get new subs and try out maybe some boston acustics speakers (infinity tweeters get harsh around the higher end of the spectrum.

Man ur system sounds pretty nice. I tried the no rear sound for a bit but I don't know...sounded to hollow for my tastes. So i use my rear speakers basically as fill(they are faded 4 to the front), tho they are still being amped...i may eventually just run them off my radio power....and power my fronts fully. Not sure yet.

 

[ChrisWinsor]

i wasent trying to play "the mine's bigger game" either... i was just giving my 2cents

 

[1sty]

Do you know what could cause speakers to become out of phase?

You caused it actualy in one of 2 ways both unintentionaly

1. you blew something out. Alot of people don't realize that when a speaker blows that it can have a host of issue. Lack of volume is one of them. Sometimes a speaker have burns up and becomes a major resistance, limiting its output. Othertimes the tinsel lead jsut wasn't on right and loosened up enough to make a problem occur. A multimeter a a listening test to each speaker individualy will tell you if these are the problem.

2. Its all in your head. Seriously. As human beings we get used to our surroundings. I remember the the first system I had for subs which was a tiny 120 watts rms on 2 kicker competition subs. They ROCKED! for about a week then they losed something, the something was just me getting used to them. Now its tought for me to be impressed like that now that my reference is set much higher.

So rule out the basic stuff and accept that as you upgrade a car stereo, you will ALWAYS want more.

 

[ChrisWinsor]

You caused it actualy in one of 2 ways both unintentionaly

1. you blew something out. Alot of people don't realize that when a speaker blows that it can have a host of issue. Lack of volume is one of them. Sometimes a speaker have burns up and becomes a major resistance, limiting its output. Othertimes the tinsel lead jsut wasn't on right and loosened up enough to make a problem occur. A multimeter a a listening test to each speaker individualy will tell you if these are the problem.

2. Its all in your head. Seriously. As human beings we get used to our surroundings. I remember the the first system I had for subs which was a tiny 120 watts rms on 2 kicker competition subs. They ROCKED! for about a week then they losed something, the something was just me getting used to them. Now its tought for me to be impressed like that now that my reference is set much higher.

So rule out the basic stuff and accept that as you upgrade a car stereo, you will ALWAYS want more.

you are 100% right in saying that you get used to ur system and it doesent seamas good or as loud anymore... go get in another car and you will then realize the difference

 

[4GIVEN]

I have Pioneer rev series components up front, and I have the stock kenwoods that were in the front doors now in the back dash. They are being pushed by the Panasonic CY-PA4003U. It sounds wonderful. It has plenty of power to match all the bass that my subs are making which is very important. I have the high pass filter set at 50hz which is perfect. I found the amp on etronics.com for $99. You cant beat this amp for that price.
http://www.etronics.com/listproduct...414542911A247B236197B5&image1.x=11&image1.y=6

 

[ChrisWinsor]

I have Pioneer rev series components up front, and I have the stock kenwoods that were in the front doors now in the back dash. They are being pushed by the Panasonic CY-PA4003U. It sounds wonderful. It has plenty of power to match all the bass that my subs are making which is very important. I have the high pass filter set at 50hz which is perfect. I found the amp on etronics.com for $99. You cant beat this amp for that price.
http://www.etronics.com/listproduct...414542911A247B236197B5&image1.x=11&image1.y=6

thats pritty cheap for a 4 ch 1000W amp!!!!!!!!!1

 

[1sty]

The Real Specs although not CEA rated and with only 24 amps to work with, 64 watts per channel is probably unrealistic:
<TABLE cellSpacing=2 cellPadding=2 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top>Power Output (maximum)</TD><TD>225W x 4</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top>Power Output (at 4Ω and ≤ 1% THD+N)</TD><TD>64W x 4</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

 

[Hughes412]

The Real Specs although not CEA rated and with only 24 amps to work with, 64 watts per channel is probably unrealistic:
<TABLE cellSpacing=2 cellPadding=2 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top>Power Output (maximum)</TD><TD>225W x 4</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top>Power Output (at 4Ω and ≤ 1% THD+N)</TD><TD>64W x 4</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

I wasn't gona say anything. But yea I with him.