Al Sharpton will invade China for this
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Apologies to Iboost, I know he's quite the religious sort. 
But a final shot at the Senor. Nothing angry about the word fascist. The economic elements of fascism are just as you describe: Means of production is privately owned but tightly controlled by the state. From the wiki on fascism: You have to read more than the first few lines.
And on religion as business, the famous examples I gave are the most obvious, but it holds for the smallest community chapel to the largest mosque in Iran.
Economic planning
Fascists opposed what they believe to be laissez-faire or quasi-laissez-faire economic policies dominant in the era prior to the Great Depression. People of many different political stripes blamed laissez-faire capitalism for the Great Depression, and fascists promoted their ideology as a "third way" between capitalism and Marxian socialism.<sup id="_ref-26" class="reference">[28]</sup> Their policies manifested as a radical extension of government control over the economy without wholesale expropriation of the means of production. Fascist governments nationalized some key industries, managed their currencies and made some massive state investments. They also introduced price controls, wage controls and other types of economic planning measures.<sup id="_ref-27" class="reference">[29]</sup> Fascist governments instituted state-regulated allocation of resources, especially in the financial and raw materials sectors.
Other than nationalization of certain industries, private property was allowed, but property rights and private initiative were contingent upon service to the state.<sup id="_ref-28" class="reference">[30]</sup> For example, "an owner of agricultural land may be compelled to raise wheat instead of sheep and employ more labor than he would find profitable."<sup id="_ref-29" class="reference">[31]</sup><sup id="_ref-30" class="reference">[32]</sup> According to historian Tibor Ivan Berend, dirigisme was an inherent aspect of fascist economies.<sup id="_ref-31" class="reference">[33]</sup> Fascists were most vocal in their opposition to finance capitalism, interest charging, and profiteering.<sup id="_ref-32" class="reference">[34]</sup> Some fascists, particularly Nazis, considered finance capitalism a "parasitic" Jewish conspiracy (see anti-Semitism).<sup id="_ref-33" class="reference">[35]</sup> However, fascists also opposed socialism and independent trade unions.
According to sociologist Stanislav Andreski, fascist economics "foreshadowed most of the fundamental features of the economic system of Western European countries today: the radical extension of government control over the economy without a wholesale expropriation of the capitalists but with a good dose of nationalisation, price control, incomes policy, managed currency, massive state investment, attempts at overall planning (less effectual than the Fascist because of the weakness of authority)."<sup id="_ref-34" class="reference">[36]</sup> Politics professor Stephen Haseler credits fascism with providing a model of economic planning for social democracy.<sup id="_ref-35" class="reference">[37]</sup>
But a final shot at the Senor. Nothing angry about the word fascist. The economic elements of fascism are just as you describe: Means of production is privately owned but tightly controlled by the state. From the wiki on fascism: You have to read more than the first few lines.
And on religion as business, the famous examples I gave are the most obvious, but it holds for the smallest community chapel to the largest mosque in Iran.
Economic planning
Fascists opposed what they believe to be laissez-faire or quasi-laissez-faire economic policies dominant in the era prior to the Great Depression. People of many different political stripes blamed laissez-faire capitalism for the Great Depression, and fascists promoted their ideology as a "third way" between capitalism and Marxian socialism.<sup id="_ref-26" class="reference">[28]</sup> Their policies manifested as a radical extension of government control over the economy without wholesale expropriation of the means of production. Fascist governments nationalized some key industries, managed their currencies and made some massive state investments. They also introduced price controls, wage controls and other types of economic planning measures.<sup id="_ref-27" class="reference">[29]</sup> Fascist governments instituted state-regulated allocation of resources, especially in the financial and raw materials sectors.
Other than nationalization of certain industries, private property was allowed, but property rights and private initiative were contingent upon service to the state.<sup id="_ref-28" class="reference">[30]</sup> For example, "an owner of agricultural land may be compelled to raise wheat instead of sheep and employ more labor than he would find profitable."<sup id="_ref-29" class="reference">[31]</sup><sup id="_ref-30" class="reference">[32]</sup> According to historian Tibor Ivan Berend, dirigisme was an inherent aspect of fascist economies.<sup id="_ref-31" class="reference">[33]</sup> Fascists were most vocal in their opposition to finance capitalism, interest charging, and profiteering.<sup id="_ref-32" class="reference">[34]</sup> Some fascists, particularly Nazis, considered finance capitalism a "parasitic" Jewish conspiracy (see anti-Semitism).<sup id="_ref-33" class="reference">[35]</sup> However, fascists also opposed socialism and independent trade unions.
According to sociologist Stanislav Andreski, fascist economics "foreshadowed most of the fundamental features of the economic system of Western European countries today: the radical extension of government control over the economy without a wholesale expropriation of the capitalists but with a good dose of nationalisation, price control, incomes policy, managed currency, massive state investment, attempts at overall planning (less effectual than the Fascist because of the weakness of authority)."<sup id="_ref-34" class="reference">[36]</sup> Politics professor Stephen Haseler credits fascism with providing a model of economic planning for social democracy.<sup id="_ref-35" class="reference">[37]</sup>
thewrench said:Apologies to Iboost, I know he's quite the religious sort.
But a final shot at the Senor. Nothing angry about the word fascist. The economic elements of fascism are just as you describe: Means of production is privately owned but tightly controlled by the state. From the wiki on fascism: You have to read more than the first few lines.
And on religion as business, the famous examples I gave are the most obvious, but it holds for the smallest community chapel to the largest mosque in Iran.
Economic planning
Fascists opposed what they believe to be laissez-faire or quasi-laissez-faire economic policies dominant in the era prior to the Great Depression. People of many different political stripes blamed laissez-faire capitalism for the Great Depression, and fascists promoted their ideology as a "third way" between capitalism and Marxian socialism.<sup id="_ref-26" class="reference">[28]</sup> Their policies manifested as a radical extension of government control over the economy without wholesale expropriation of the means of production. Fascist governments nationalized some key industries, managed their currencies and made some massive state investments. They also introduced price controls, wage controls and other types of economic planning measures.<sup id="_ref-27" class="reference">[29]</sup> Fascist governments instituted state-regulated allocation of resources, especially in the financial and raw materials sectors.
Other than nationalization of certain industries, private property was allowed, but property rights and private initiative were contingent upon service to the state.<sup id="_ref-28" class="reference">[30]</sup> For example, "an owner of agricultural land may be compelled to raise wheat instead of sheep and employ more labor than he would find profitable."<sup id="_ref-29" class="reference">[31]</sup><sup id="_ref-30" class="reference">[32]</sup> According to historian Tibor Ivan Berend, dirigisme was an inherent aspect of fascist economies.<sup id="_ref-31" class="reference">[33]</sup> Fascists were most vocal in their opposition to finance capitalism, interest charging, and profiteering.<sup id="_ref-32" class="reference">[34]</sup> Some fascists, particularly Nazis, considered finance capitalism a "parasitic" Jewish conspiracy (see anti-Semitism).<sup id="_ref-33" class="reference">[35]</sup> However, fascists also opposed socialism and independent trade unions.
According to sociologist Stanislav Andreski, fascist economics "foreshadowed most of the fundamental features of the economic system of Western European countries today: the radical extension of government control over the economy without a wholesale expropriation of the capitalists but with a good dose of nationalisation, price control, incomes policy, managed currency, massive state investment, attempts at overall planning (less effectual than the Fascist because of the weakness of authority)."<sup id="_ref-34" class="reference">[36]</sup> Politics professor Stephen Haseler credits fascism with providing a model of economic planning for social democracy.<sup id="_ref-35" class="reference">[37]</sup>
First Wiki is a joke and I never use it.
Second calling it fascist and only siting what you've pasted is a poor attempt to discredit what I have said. Considering your only argument has been that religions are a business. Which I never disagreed with... you are fine example of what many Americans are lacking (which includes continuous judgments from small pieces of the puzzle) and very much apart of the system you continuously complain about. Until we open our eyes/ears will we never get off this see-saw of certainty.
Economic fascism is one part of the complete philosophy of fascism that absolutely can be used, just like socialized healthcare can be a part of our system without the government being socialist. BTW, I used it to reinforce what you said not discredit it. If you had claimed to be a capitalist and then cited what you said as an example, then I would have been discrediting what you said. You, sir, are who first started this on post 43. The rest of your statement above seems to be just politico-babble which really says nothing of substance. Since this seems to be turning to flaming instead of intelligent debate, I'll just say this and be out. I expend at least a little effort to proofread and make sure that I use words correctly, I'm sure I'm not perfect, but I try. If you are going to try to set yourself up to be my intellectual superior, I expect the same from you.
Edit: You seem to presume to know a lot about me, have we ever met?
And geez, I'm surpised and delighted that this didn't make it to the dumpster or get locked. Thumbs up to the mod for allowing what was mostly a good debate to go on, even if it strayed from the topic so far.
Edit: You seem to presume to know a lot about me, have we ever met?
And geez, I'm surpised and delighted that this didn't make it to the dumpster or get locked. Thumbs up to the mod for allowing what was mostly a good debate to go on, even if it strayed from the topic so far.
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I say discredit b/c of the admitted jab with Communism and considering fascism is often linked to Nazi party. I don't agree with labeling anything.
Polictio-babble? No... same points still being made, more of a motif.
I am no superior just someone engaging in conversation, hearing your perspective and responding with my own. I have no excuse for proofing besides admitting I did not.
Polictio-babble? No... same points still being made, more of a motif.
I am no superior just someone engaging in conversation, hearing your perspective and responding with my own. I have no excuse for proofing besides admitting I did not.
Well I had unsubscribed, but I could see this coming, so, other than the joke about communism, please cite where I did anything other than respond to items that you posted, I made no assumptions as to what you think or especially believe. You'll say the c fascist remark, yet what I posted as to economic fascism IS what you described, so please find something else.
And please, please explain what this means:
Ack another edit: Wait, am I a part of the system or "apart" of the system, because those are opposites. And if you are saying this then how am I either? Do I vote, not vote? Maybe I'm an elected offficial, maybe a drug dealer, you seem to know...
And please, please explain what this means:
Americans lack fat old men? They lack "continuous judgements from small pieces of the puzzle"? What puzzle? WTF is a seesaw of certainty?Mr. Win said:
Ack another edit: Wait, am I a part of the system or "apart" of the system, because those are opposites. And if you are saying this then how am I either? Do I vote, not vote? Maybe I'm an elected offficial, maybe a drug dealer, you seem to know...
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Whose making the assumptions now... while some of the ideas may be similar, the major pieces of the puzzle are not. I'm suggesting changes to the current political system.thewrench said:
If the only definition you have of yourself is a "fat old men" then yes.
Jigsaw Puzzle: [SIZE=-1]A jigsaw puzzle is a tiling puzzle that requires the assembly of numerous small, often oddly-shaped, interlocking pieces. Each piece has a small part of a picture on it; when complete, a jigsaw puzzle produces a complete picture. (This is in fact from wiki - I trust them for this definition)
Certainty: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]The degree to which we are sure that some result is significant; that is, not due to chance.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]
[/SIZE]
"a part" This implies you could be a player or a pawn... its unimportant which one you are.
Motif: [SIZE=-1]A recurring element, such as an image, theme, or type of incident.
[/SIZE]
FunkyBuddha
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Lady wants people to own up. Kingsoft just did!!! What a dumbass.
Rally Ninja
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Looks like she wants money now. Bad translation happens all the time. Anything for a quick buck I guess.
