FS-DE Oil System

[MP3racer]

the needed slot int he bearings I assume or the rods?

Edit: just to give a general idea what is the cost of those bearings?

The needed slot is in the rod cap. The tang that holds the bearing in place in the rod on the race bearings is on the opposite side of the OE bearings so another slot is needed.

The last time we purchased these (1.5 yrs ago) the price was around $100/set for the rod bearings. Prices change quickly in race products so I would need to check for accurate pricing.
They are expensive but work!!

 

[03.5MSP]

Yes, we have found a true race bearing for the rods that we use in our motors. Requires recutting the rods for the bearing notch on the opposite side but otherwise have been great! I can supply for anyone interested but are pricey. I'll have to check current price.

What other specs are you interested in??

Great posts Tom.. I was pretty much looking or any major changes that you guys have done to the FSDE, like the external oil pressure regulator and fixed oem pump, and the info about the rod bearings.. Any other info like that would be awesome, and much appreciated.

 

[Matt V]

Well since my car is a daily and I'm always on a budget, I'll probably just get the pump work done for $100. How do you recommend cleaning a pump before sending it to you?

And I'm gonna get a used one locally, does the mileage on it matter?

 

[MP3racer]

Well since my car is a daily and I'm always on a budget, I'll probably just get the pump work done for $100. How do you recommend cleaning a pump before sending it to you?

And I'm gonna get a used one locally, does the mileage on it matter?

Most used pumps are okay. For every pump we receive it will be opened and I will PM you the initial specs before any work is done. Then you can decide if you want to proceed with the specific pump or not.

To clean a pump any degreaser (orange stuff, fantastik, simple green, etc.) will work. A brush to scrub, and some towels to wipe it down afterward. Try not to spray too much liquid into the passages as you won't be able to get it out without disassembling the pump.

 

[Matt V]

Gotcha, I'm gonna try to get this done in December. Will the deal still be $100 in a few months if I can't get it in by then?

 

[Alamo1]

Got my pump today.... only $45 in duties.... looks good, Thanks a bunch Tom. There is something rattling around in the old PRV port... is that normal?

 

[Maxx Mazda]

Well since my car is a daily and I'm always on a budget, I'll probably just get the pump work done for $100. How do you recommend cleaning a pump before sending it to you?

And I'm gonna get a used one locally, does the mileage on it matter?

Not a good idea. Getting it without the external regulator almost defeats the purpose of getting it at all. The clearances will be tighter, but after any sustained driving, even just on the highway at 3500 RPM, you'll still have the exact same problem as before. Get the external regulator too, or just get a replacement TOGA high volume pump. That's what I ran before.

 

[CustomMSP]

Not a good idea. Getting it without the external regulator almost defeats the purpose of getting it at all. The clearances will be tighter, but after any sustained driving, even just on the highway at 3500 RPM, you'll still have the exact same problem as before. Get the external regulator too, or just get a replacement TOGA high volume pump. That's what I ran before.

I don't think that we have an issue with oil volume?

 

[Alamo1]

Maxx... What made you change from the toga? I trust Tom with my parts and they look good now that I have them back, but why the change if the toga was sufficient?

 

[Circuit]

So I just got my new 0 miles replacement motor and I want to eventually send in the oil pump for the service and set up the external valve.

To make things easier, can the original post be updated with all the info/parts needed to get everything set up?

I am thinking about the AWR oil pan too, but if it only adds capacity, and does not aid in defending against oil starvation, I don't think I should need it. Let me know what you think

 

[Alamo1]

+1 on the pan question...

 

[shane02pro5]

The AWR pan definately defends against oil starvation keeping the oil pickup submurged no matter what, as it was designed. But without sufficient oil pressure it won't help...

 

[MP3racer]

Got my pump today.... only $45 in duties.... looks good, Thanks a bunch Tom. There is something rattling around in the old PRV port... is that normal?

The old PRV port has been altered to allow the use of the external PRV. The part we install to hold the old PRV piston in place allows a slight amount of movement in the piston when the oil pump is cold since everything expands once the engine comes up to operating temperature.

Long story short....yes it should have a slight rattle(iagree)

 

[MP3racer]

So I just got my new 0 miles replacement motor and I want to eventually send in the oil pump for the service and set up the external valve.

To make things easier, can the original post be updated with all the info/parts needed to get everything set up?

I am thinking about the AWR oil pan too, but if it only adds capacity, and does not aid in defending against oil starvation, I don't think I should need it. Let me know what you think

The system is fairly straightforward...if you send in a pump Doc B Racing will service it to bring it up to optimum specs and convert the pump for use of an external PRV.

pump service($100) + external PRV ($130) + average return shipping ($15) = $245

You source oil filter relocation kit and girdle with bung welded on for return line from the external PRV.

There are some pics of the system in #268 of this thread and a diagram of the system in #284. The oil filter relocation parts are available from Protege Garage, Jegs, Summit, and ebay. We may soon have an aluminum block adapter available (part of the oil filter relocation kit).


Regarding the pan...it really depends upon the type of driving you intend on doing with your car. If you expect mostly straightline driving with little g loading to either side or front/back then there is little chance the oil pick-up will get uncovered and the OE system will most likely be sufficient. If you intend mild g loading that may see minor movement of the oil in the pan then an AWR pan would help. If you expect moderate g loading then I would recommend a pan with a gate system built into it similar to what we run on our race motors to prevent uncovering the oil pickup as the oil sloshes inside the pan.



Hope this helps???

 

[Circuit]

Definitely does, I vote to add that to your first post so it doesn't get lost in replies.

She is just a daily driver, and does not see any super hard canyon runs since she is so low. So I can probably get away without the AWR pan?

Damn I forgot to check if the motor I got had the MSP girdle with the drain plug already installed... Even thought it is on the opposite side of the motor, I could find somewhere in the front to remote-mount the oil filter to make oil changes easy from the bottom of the car

 

[Alamo1]

I'm really excited to install this. How do you suggest tapping my P5 girdle since it has those concave sections along it's sides? Should I have someone fill it with weld and then tap it with my NPT or should I tap it first and then weld the fitting in?

 

[MP3racer]

I'm really excited to install this. How do you suggest tapping my P5 girdle since it has those concave sections along it's sides? Should I have someone fill it with weld and then tap it with my NPT or should I tap it first and then weld the fitting in?

Unfortunately, we have not tried this method so I don't have a lot of experience with it. On our race motors we have a bung welded to the pan but it requires adding some sheilding to the inside of the pan. If you can accomplish the fitting on the girdle it will be better than an OE pan because it will be above the oil level and allow better flow back.

The points I would keep in mind are that when having someone weld the aluminum girdle it will be prone to warping in that area (which of course is not good). I know some of the forum members have simply drilled and tapped the existing plate. I would think a competent machine shop should be able to do this without too much trouble?? (whistle)

 

[shane02pro5]

Can an awr pan be modified to accommodate this gate system? I wish the ext prv setup was available when I swapped in my motor. Still have some topend work to do in the future so when the time comes this is definely on the list.

The system is fairly straightforward...if you send in a pump Doc B Racing will service it to bring it up to optimum specs and convert the pump for use of an external PRV.

pump service($100) + external PRV ($130) + average return shipping ($15) = $245

You source oil filter relocation kit and girdle with bung welded on for return line from the external PRV.

There are some pics of the system in #268 of this thread and a diagram of the system in #284. The oil filter relocation parts are available from Protege Garage, Jegs, Summit, and ebay. We may soon have an aluminum block adapter available (part of the oil filter relocation kit).


Regarding the pan...it really depends upon the type of driving you intend on doing with your car. If you expect mostly straightline driving with little g loading to either side or front/back then there is little chance the oil pick-up will get uncovered and the OE system will most likely be sufficient. If you intend mild g loading that may see minor movement of the oil in the pan then an AWR pan would help. If you expect moderate g loading then I would recommend a pan with a gate system built into it similar to what we run on our race motors to prevent uncovering the oil pickup as the oil sloshes inside the pan.



Hope this helps???

 

[Alamo1]

Unfortunately, we have not tried this method so I don't have a lot of experience with it. On our race motors we have a bung welded to the pan but it requires adding some sheilding to the inside of the pan. If you can accomplish the fitting on the girdle it will be better than an OE pan because it will be above the oil level and allow better flow back.

The points I would keep in mind are that when having someone weld the aluminum girdle it will be prone to warping in that area (which of course is not good). I know some of the forum members have simply drilled and tapped the existing plate. I would think a competent machine shop should be able to do this without too much trouble?? (whistle)

Great! I am supposed to be a competent machine shop! (crazy)

 

[Maxx Mazda]

Maxx... What made you change from the toga? I trust Tom with my parts and they look good now that I have them back, but why the change if the toga was sufficient?

Anything but this is insufficient for my engine. I ran 24psi on the street last year, and over 30 on race gas.