What did you just buy?

[Woodys2718]

I prefer the streetfighter.

What kind of bike is that? Ya know if you enjoy it you'll want to go bigger and more power in a very short period of time... which leads me to my next question. How is the resale value on it?

 

[52804x4]

Canon 24-70 f2.8...this hobby of mine is going to be the reason I can't retire until 85!

 

[Srad600]

Okay I'm looking at bikes again (first bike). Any opinions on these two? One I had been looking at for a while (endure), the other (streefighter) is new. The endure is +100lb lighter which for me is a plus, but it also has 1/2 the fuel capacity as the streetfighter for the same motor. Both are $2000 250cc brand new.
Streefighter

Enduro

I was going to say as a first time rider, never buy a new bike (it will hit the deck at some point), but seeing that they have a "special" for $1999.00 on the streetfighter, I'd say grab that sucker before it goes back to regular price.

Take baby steps with bikes though, it's a lot easier to get in over your head than with a cage (and the consequences are greater). (2cents) Good luck and let us know how the scooter works out.

 

[Chris_Top_Her]

I prefer the streetfighter.

What kind of bike is that? Ya know if you enjoy it you'll want to go bigger and more power in a very short period of time... which leads me to my next question. How is the resale value on it?

Lol everyone keeps saying get a 600cc but i dont want something that could enable me to get in trouble too easily

 

[MikeM.]

Lol everyone keeps saying get a 600cc but i dont want something that could enable me to get in trouble too easily

Here's the deal:

If your self-restraint is lacking, you really shouldn't ride a motorcycle of any size. Otherwise you would be fine with a 400-650cc four stroke. While it's doable, I would not recommend a 250cc cycle for anything with a speed limit above 50 mph.

 

[Woodys2718]

Don't get me wrong, a 250 is a great beginner bike to boost confidence levels with new riders. But, either way... if you enjoy it and decide cycling is for you... you will want a larger displacement (guaranteed) or you will want to unload it. So I would consider researching the resale value of these bikes.

I know the ninja 250, 300's,cbr 300's and R3's hold there value quite well and are easy to offload when the time comes. Granted they are more out of the gate, but, you will recoop more of your $. I'm not sure this will be the same with the bikes you've chosen...

Circa fall of 2011. I talked my GF into getting her M license. She took the course, passed and received her license.

Spring of 2012 we purchased her a new ninja 250.




She rode the heck out of that bike for the 2012 season. In 2013 she wanted to upgrade already. While she could keep up and cruise with me... it was work.

We ended up waiting another year and in spring of 2014 we traded in the 250 for a new leftover 2013 ninja 650

Here she is last Friday with her 650. We took a 330 mile day trip around south western WI.



Here's the kicker. We paid $4199 for the ninja 250 in the spring of 2012. In the spring of 2014 we traded it in with ~5000 miles for the new 2013 ninja 650. We received $3729 in trade. Yes, no typo $3729. Now keep in mind I drive a hard bargain and have bought 5 new bike from this dealership but still. Just some food for thought for you to consider.

 

[Skorpio]

This brings back some memories! I have been riding since my first bike, a Honda CR50, at 9 years old. I still remember my 1st Ninja, that 250R, at age 16. Even though it didn't look as pretty as this current one(love the Kawi lime green), I loved that bike and it cruised at 60-70 mph no problem, and it revved to the moon (12,000rpm, huge for 1994). But, since I had been riding for 7 years at the time (dirt bikes and standards) I quickly outgrew it, and by the time I was 18 years old, 900-1000cc sportbikes were my playground for the road all the way up to my current first cruiser. But, for a 1st timer, a USED Ninja 250R, 500 or equivalent is a solid choice for a 1st bike from my experience.

 

[MikeM.]

I still remember my 1st Ninja, that 250R, at age 16. Even though it didn't look as pretty as this current one(love the Kawi lime green), I loved that bike and it cruised at 60-70 mph no problem, and it revved to the moon (12,000rpm, huge for 1994).

I agree with this (and the rest of your message) but I want to point out that there is a world of difference between a performance twin cyl. like your Ninja 250 and the Chinese made single cylinder low performance thumpers that Chris is considering. Flat out, in a tuck, near redline, they would be lucky to reach 60 on a flat road. And if there's a hill or slight headwind, forget it. Completely different beasts than your Ninja.

I should have qualified my statement about not recommending a 250cc cycle for roads with speed limits above 50mph (by adding low revving single cylinder).

Chris, you will not be happy with either of those bikes for your stated uses. They are made for town use and light trail use, that's it. Either buy used or save your money until you can get something that will be more suitable.

 

[Skorpio]

I agree with this (and the rest of your message) but I want to point out that there is a world of difference between a performance twin cyl. like your Ninja 250 and the Chinese made single cylinder low performance thumpers that Chris is considering. Flat out, in a tuck, near redline, they would be lucky to reach 60 on a flat road. And if there's a hill or slight headwind, forget it. Completely different beasts than your Ninja.

I should have qualified my statement about not recommending a 250cc cycle for roads with speed limits above 50mph (by adding low revving single cylinder).

Chris, you will not be happy with either of those bikes for your stated uses. They are made for town use and light trail use, that's it. Either buy used or save your money until you can get something that will be more suitable.

And I agree with your statement also. My point was also that the Ninja 250R >"Chinese" dual purpose bikes. My post was a recommendation for a used 250R or similar for a beginner.

 

[Srad600]

And I agree with your statement also. My point was also that the Ninja 250R >"Chinese" dual purpose bikes. My post was a recommendation for a used 250R or similar for a beginner.

Agree. Multi-cylinder 600cc+ 4ts are NOT beginner bikes. (A 600cc single might be ok, but still alot of torque for a beginner). It is worth it to learn the ropes on a smaller displacement bike, and move up later. If you're considering skipping that step, I'd ask you how much your life is worth? I have two new riders in my family and convincing them to stay below 500cc was(is) a chore. But the result is I'm more confident they will be around to enjoy riding for years to come.

 

[PatriotJeff]

This.

 

[MikeM.]

Agree. Multi-cylinder 600cc+ 4ts are NOT beginner bikes.

What is "4ts" supposed to stand for? Because it means nothing to me.

Seriously, there is absolutely nothing wrong with using recognized abbreviations but what is the point of using an abbreviation that has no recognized meaning and it just leaves most people scratching their heads? Great, maybe you saved a half second when you typed it but if you have 100 people stopping, pausing and trying to figure it out you may have wasted a minute or more of the collective time of the people you were trying to communicate with.

 

[Srad600]

Bike speak:
4t = 4 stroke motor
2t = 2 stroke motor

Surf any motorcycle forum and you will see those abbreviations used extensively. Just because you are not aware of it, does not mean it's not commonly used. So to break it down, I was saying that "4 stroke, multi-cylinder motorcycles are not suitable for beginners."

 

[MikeM.]

Bike speak:
4t = 4 stroke motor
2t = 2 stroke motor

Surf any motorcycle forum and you will see those abbreviations used extensively. Just because you are not aware of it, does not mean it's not commonly used. So to break it down, I was saying that "4 stroke, multi-cylinder motorcycles are not suitable for beginners."

I've been riding motorcycles since before you were born (both 2 and 4 cycle) and participating in multiple motorcycle forums for the last 15 years.

I'm aware of a couple of ways to designate engine type:

Two cycle, four cycle or two stroke or four stroke. But you wrote "4ts" (mystified) and claim 4t = 4 stroke. What, pray tell, does the small "t" stand for and what is it's history/origin? I'm not saying certain sub-cultures have not adopted this slang for their own use (I've heard of stranger things) but it is certainly not a good way to communicate to a wider audience outside a small clique if you want to be easily understood. And I've been an avid motorcyclist my entire life (currently have three 1000cc sport-tourers and one dual-sport).

 

[MikeM.]

So to break it down, I was saying that "4 stroke, multi-cylinder motorcycles are not suitable for beginners."

You do realize that all two cylinder motorcycles belong solidly in the multi-cylinder motorcycle family? Some of the best beginners motorcycles are multi-cylinder 4-strokes (like the Ninja 250 that three people have already recommended).


Also, none of my motorcycle friends (myself included) with literally centuries of combined experience (both riding and instructing) would recommend a 2-stroke over a 4-stroke for a beginner so I'm really confused where you are coming from. The four strokes are simply easier for a beginner to get the clutch modulation down. Most beginner crashes are from stalling the engine on take-off and a 4-stroke is less likely to do this. They are easier in terms of gear selection because of their power band which is more broad (and typically much less peaky) so the beginning rider is less likely to find themselves in too high of a gear with zero acceleration available. My first street bike was a 350cc Kawasaki triple 2-stroke. That was certainly not a beginners bike with it's power coming on suddenly and unexpectedly (like hitting a nitrous button) right before 6000rpms. I wheeled it, almost looped it, accidentally within the first three blocks of it's test ride before I even purchased it (simply by rolling on the throttle in 2nd gear). I survived but I am confused why you think a multi-cylinder 4-stroke is less suitable.

 

[Chris_Top_Her]

Thanks. I knew this would be a good place to ask because of the experienced rides here. I'll probably look for a used bike for <4k (not a street bike/crotch rocket).

 

[Chris_Top_Her]

Installed my LED rear fog lights today, along with my old curt trailer wiring from the old cx-5. Purchased from an independent seller on facebook, I think he took my advice and is selling them on ebay now. You can pretty much try any wiring combo you like, as (long as you ground to a black wire lol). I eventually went with brakes and running, running on top, brakes bottom.

 

[Srad600]

You do realize that all two cylinder motorcycles belong solidly in the multi-cylinder motorcycle family? Some of the best beginners motorcycles are multi-cylinder 4-strokes (like the Ninja 250 that three people have already recommended).

Yes, actually I do, that's why I said 600cc+ multi-cylinder motorcycles...see my original post.

Also, none of my motorcycle friends (myself included) with literally centuries of combined experience (both riding and instructing) would recommend a 2-stroke over a 4-stroke for a beginner so I'm really confused where you are coming from.

Uhh, huh...where did you see me recommend a 2t as a beginner bike? I'm pretty sure I never said anything like that.

I've been riding motorcycles since before you were born (both 2 and 4 cycle) and participating in multiple motorcycle forums for the last 15 years.
I'm aware of a couple of ways to designate engine type:
Two cycle, four cycle or two stroke or four stroke. But you wrote "4ts" (mystified) and claim 4t = 4 stroke. What, pray tell, does the small "t" stand for and what is it's history/origin?

Since you are such an expert on motorcycles, I'd think you would have looked this up yourself. But since that is not the case...
See this thread on thumpertalk (see posts #8, 14, 15, 20, 24)...http://www.thumpertalk.com/topic/580991-2t-and-4t-am-i-missing-something/
and Takt time explained...https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Takt_time

You're welcome.



I'm getting the impression you like to argue, about anything...so I'm going to let you have fun arguing with yourself. Thanks.

 

[MikeM.]

Since you are such an expert on motorcycles, I'd think you would have looked this up yourself. But since that is not the case...
See this thread on thumpertalk (see posts #8, 14, 15, 20, 24)...http://www.thumpertalk.com/topic/580991-2t-and-4t-am-i-missing-something/
and Takt time explained...https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Takt_time

You're welcome.

1st link: A 28 post count thread started because of the confusion created by one persons use of the symbol "2T" or "4T" to denote a 2 stroke or 4 stroke engine. The thread is filled with comments from motorcyclists who have never heard that being used to designate the number of strokes an engine has. But it is explained the "T" stands for "takt time"

2nd link: An lengthy article explaining that "Takt time" which is derived from the German word Taktzeit is translated best as meter, the average unit production time needed to meet customer demand. It goes on to define "take time" as a unit of time. The entire article does not even mention "engine", "stroke" or refer to any usage where "T" is used to denote engine type.

I cannot fathom why someone would use an obscure term that refers to a unit of time to denote the number of cycles an engine is designed to run on. That would be like using a unit of weight to refer to the number of inches an item had.

I'm not surprised that "T" is not more widely adopted in terms of using it to distinguish between 2 and 4 cycle engines

 

[Skorpio]

Agree. Multi-cylinder 600cc+ 4ts are NOT beginner bikes. (A 600cc single might be ok, but still alot of torque for a beginner). It is worth it to learn the ropes on a smaller displacement bike, and move up later. If you're considering skipping that step, I'd ask you how much your life is worth? I have two new riders in my family and convincing them to stay below 500cc was(is) a chore. But the result is I'm more confident they will be around to enjoy riding for years to come.

I have seen and read the term "4t" at some time or another, so I understood what you meant. I assume you were replying to the bike enthusiasts when you posted it. I also understand that "SRAD600" means Suzuki Ram Air Direct 600, so I also assume you have, had, or are some fan of Suzuki GSX-Rs. Especially quick, nimble handling, high revving 600s [emoji6]