Turbo "Truths / Myths" dispelled

GTXT23

GTXT23

LightFoot
To start ( a pun ) - I went thru a sczhophrenic fit trying to decide on a Turbo or Premium ( Plus ) CX5 . My ownership of vehicles goes back to the 70s and consider myself a full fledged Mazda person ! I purchased 2 CX5s and on both recent decisions went NA over Turbo - #1 reason ...not what many might think ...Ive had many fast vehicles and had to come to grips with the fact , I just dont need the power , or want it anymore. There was a time when it would have required about 1 second to decide - Turbo - done - So Ive read and watched many articles and known many T owners ( self ) as well - and Turbos have changed big time - Yet I saw a Toyota Master Tech recently , that I feel summed up Turbos exactly as I believe they are today , the good, the bad and the ( whatever ) - So im posting this for ONE reason and its NOT to bash turbos ot disway potential Turbo buyers away from Ts , yet , quite the opposite - That if owners were more educated on fundamental ownership habits, the experience will just be that much better and experience far fewer problems ...as well know when they hear bs thats inaccurate or dated turbo info which will perpetuate flase myths about Ts-
I will say ...these things which will get pushback - but watch the whole short video , then reply - if you care - So here it is :#1 You can run your CX5 on regular or mid-grade fuel and dont " need " to use premium fuel --/ FALSE / - low grade non-premium fuel destroy turbo engines . #2 Turbo engines dont burn oil / FASLE / all turbos will burn oil . #3 Turbos last as long as NA engines / FALSE / they do not
#4 You can drive a Turbo just like an NA engine without any problems- / FALSE / - #4.5 -Turbos dont require that the engine oil is at full operating temp before you start using the turbo and you can just shut the car off after driving and dont need cool down time /. FALSE-FALSE / slap in face / NO - The turbo is lubricated by the engine oil and for optimum life , wear and performance ..should be at full temp ( not the coolant gauge ..the oil temp ) and since turbos use engine oil to cool ...that oil goes thru the turbo which can get red hot ...if you drive it agressively using the turbo and then just shut it off in the parking lot - it cooks the engine oil around the turbo and gunks it up big time - wait a few minutes ( hence old turbo timers ) - #5 Just change the oil per the owners manual ...FALSE /. the oil in any turbo engine is critical and most reccomendations by the top engine builders / techs is 6 mos / no matter what miles and 3-5 k ( 5 at the longest ) - Remember , that oil is not only lubricating , cooling a 4 cyl engine thats working hard ..its going thru an often piping hot Turbo as well . - So be aware of these things to make your turbo experience the best possible / For many the trade off from N A is worth the extra - for some not - Heres the " word " from the Master :
m.youtube.com

How To Make Your Modern Turbo Engine Last Longer | Are They Less Reliable?

A Master Automobile Technician Shares 5 Tips on Making Your Modern Turbo Engine More Reliable Long Term.In this video I share with you 5 tips to prolong the ...
m.youtube.com m.youtube.com
 
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1. Incorrect - CX5 (Skyactive in general) does not require premium. His statement is that if your car requires premium, use it otherwise engine damage could occur.

2. Technically all engines burn some oil

3. Debatable - what does it mean to last as long? Internal engine, bearings, rings? Turbos?

4. Under what conditions?

4.5 It's amazing what you can find in the manual. Even the manual states racing the engine just after starting or when cold is bad. Who stated that engine oil does not need to be up to temp? That goes for any engine really. Also, the turbo is liquid cooled as well, so shutting down right after driving isn't as much of an issue. Yes, beating on it or bombing down the freeway should be followed by a short cool down period before turning off, but you don't need to let it idle for 5 minutes like the old days.

5. I agree it's better to change more frequently.
 
Odrapnew said:
1. Incorrect - CX5 (Skyactive in general) does not require premium. His statement is that if your car requires premium, use it otherwise engine damage could occur.

2. Technically all engines burn some oil

3. Debatable - what does it mean to last as long? Internal engine, bearings, rings? Turbos?

4. Under what conditions?

4.5 It's amazing what you can find in the manual. Even the manual states racing the engine just after starting or when cold is bad. Who stated that engine oil does not need to be up to temp? That goes for any engine really. Also, the turbo is liquid cooled as well, so shutting down right after driving isn't as much of an issue. Yes, beating on it or bombing down the freeway should be followed by a short cool down period before turning off, but you don't need to let it idle for 5 minutes like the old days.

5. I agree it's better to change more frequently.
Click to expand...
On#1 - Correct...ion

He says verbatim :
" IF your Turbo takes premium fuel , the sure fire way of destrorying the engine is not using premium "

#2 Its the Turbo itself that loses oil ..per his info

#3 Factual Historical evidence

#4 The engine oil should be at full operating temp before using the turbo - as well cool down is not needed on an NA - but is on a Turbo after heavy or high demand turbo use due to heat destroying the oil around the hot turbo and corroding the galleys - which is the engine oil

#5 Watch the video ...
 
Unless he's a master tech for Mazda and his video is specifically for the skyactiv, I don't think this is "good" Cx-5 info as he's speaking in a general sense with nothing specific to the Mazda turbo engine. The thread title is a bit misleading.
 
Silly Wabbit said:
Unless he's a master tech for Mazda and his video is specifically for the skyactiv, I don't think this is "good" Cx-5 info as he's speaking in a general sense with nothing specific to the Mazda turbo engine. The thread title is a bit misleading.
Click to expand...

That's a good point. Thread title changed.

I also moved the thread to the Lounge as this info is not specific to the CX-5.
 
#1 You can run your CX5 on regular or mid-grade fuel and dont " need " to use premium fuel --/ FALSE / - low grade non-premium fuel destroy turbo engines .

Non-premium does not automatically equate to low grade fuel and it's certainly not going to destroy your engine. Using non-premium will certainly reduce performance but it ain't gonna break anything. That said, if I owned a turbo, I would use 93 octane for sure. If I'm spending the extra money on a turbo, I'm gonna use it!

#2 Turbo engines dont burn oil / FASLE / all turbos will burn oil .

Agreed. How much more is the question.

#3 Turbos last as long as NA engines / FALSE / they do not

Agreed, they're more complex than an NA and the higher performance can take its toll.

#4 You can drive a Turbo just like an NA engine without any problems- / FALSE / -

I don't agree, see below.

#4.5 -Turbos dont require that the engine oil is at full operating temp before you start using the turbo and you can just shut the car off after driving and dont need cool down time /. FALSE-FALSE / slap in face / NO - The turbo is lubricated by the engine oil and for optimum life , wear and performance ..should be at full temp ( not the coolant gauge ..the oil temp ) and since turbos use engine oil to cool ...that oil goes thru the turbo which can get red hot ...if you drive it agressively using the turbo and then just shut it off in the parking lot - it cooks the engine oil around the turbo and gunks it up big time - wait a few minutes ( hence old turbo timers ) -

You're saying that a turbo CX needs to come up to full operating temp before driving the car? How are you going to come up to full operating temp while idling there in the driveway when it's really cold outside?

As for turbo cooldown, that's true IF you've been flogging the thing just prior to shuting down. If you drive sanely 5 mins before you park it, you'll be fine. If you're flogging it just prior to shutting down, idle for a couple of mins before you shut it off.

#5 Just change the oil per the owners manual ...FALSE /. the oil in any turbo engine is critical and most reccomendations by the top engine builders / techs is 6 mos / no matter what miles and 3-5 k ( 5 at the longest ) - Remember , that oil is not only lubricating , cooling a 4 cyl engine thats working hard ..its going thru an often piping hot Turbo as well . - So be aware of these things to make your turbo experience the best possible.

You don't believe that the engineers at Mazda took the extra heat generated by the turbo into consideration when they made their recommendations? Modern synthetic oils can handle the punishment.
 
cxha said:
Agreed, how many more times will he post this video?

Best advice: RTM and follow your manufacturers' recommendations.
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Well, I do take issue with the manual on oil change intervals. They recommend the minimum, not what's optimal.
 
12 months. My car is driven between 4-5K / yr so it works out for me.

I just read the manual again and it states that the "max interval" is 12 months, 7500 miles. I agree with the term "max" and owners should understand what that means.

But we have enough OCI threads already :)

Oil grade is easier. The turbo always gets 5W-30. The NA motor can use either, with a bias towards 0W-20 for very cold to normal climates and 5W-30 for very hot climates.
 
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Silly Wabbit said:
Unless he's a master tech for Mazda and his video is specifically for the skyactiv, I don't think this is "good" Cx-5 info as he's speaking in a general sense with nothing specific to the Mazda turbo engine. The thread title is a bit misleading.
Click to expand...
Well , then I believe that since you have dismissed the infomation for reasons you didnt support with facts- You have a responsibility to state specifically which points he makes which are not applicable to the " Mazda " engines with turbos-( the CX5 which I used ) and why ? - Frankly Mazda makes combustion engines with 100+ year old technology at its core -and a turbo is a turbo these days ...all pretty much the same fundamentally - unless ive been living under a rock - please re-educate us all - thanks
 
GTXT23 said:
Well , then I believe that since you have dismissed the infomation for reasons you didnt support with facts- You have a responsibility to state specifically which points he makes which are not applicable to the " Mazda " engines with turbos-( the CX5 which I used ) and why ? - Frankly Mazda makes combustion engines with 100+ year old technology at its core -and a turbo is a turbo these days ...all pretty much the same fundamentally - unless ive been living under a rock - please re-educate us all - thanks
Click to expand...

Silly Wabbit has a responsibility to you/us? :ROFLMAO:

Frankly Mazda makes combustion engines with 100+ year old technology at its core
Click to expand...

As does EVERY other vehicle manufacturer. Until the Dr. Emmett Brown's flux capacitor is perfected, we'll be forced to use the old technology.
 
GTXT23 said:
Well , then I believe that since you have dismissed the infomation for reasons you didnt support with facts- You have a responsibility to state specifically which points he makes which are not applicable to the " Mazda " engines with turbos-( the CX5 which I used ) and why ? - Frankly Mazda makes combustion engines with 100+ year old technology at its core -and a turbo is a turbo these days ...all pretty much the same fundamentally - unless ive been living under a rock - please re-educate us all - thanks
Click to expand...

If you want to further this discussion, you should quote specifically what in the video applies to Mazda's 2.5 turbo engine. You're the one reposting this video over and over again. If something in it applies to the 2.5 turbo engine and concerns you, point out what it is and anyone interested in replying can engage in conversation with you.

Or you could just accept that people disagree with whatever point you're trying to make, and move on.
 
One problem with these discussions is that they tend to happen in terms of absolutes. You do/don't "need" to run this kind of fuel, XYZ "will" damage your engine, ABC "will" make your turbo last the life of the car, etc. Reality, as always, is more complicated.

What a turbo does is introduce variables that increase the odds of problems. You can't eliminate those variables no matter what fuel/oil/habits/practices you use. What you can do is mitigate their effect.

E.g., it's not that a turbo engine "needs" premium fuel and "will" blow up if you use a lower grade. Using premium fuel will reduce the odds of certain problems. So will using good oil, changing it frequently, making sure you don't shut down the engine when the oil is too hot, etc.

If you do all the right things, your turbo or engine might still have premature problems. But you're less likely to see those problems.

If you don't do those things, your turbo or engine might still last as long as you need it to. But it's a crapshoot.
 
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Odrapnew said:
4.5 It's amazing what you can find in the manual. Even the manual states racing the engine just after starting or when cold is bad. Who stated that engine oil does not need to be up to temp? That goes for any engine really. Also, the turbo is liquid cooled as well, so shutting down right after driving isn't as much of an issue. Yes, beating on it or bombing down the freeway should be followed by a short cool down period before turning off, but you don't need to let it idle for 5 minutes like the old days.
Click to expand...
I'm quoting my own post to clarify.
I do not agree that you need oil to be at full operating temp before driving the vehicle gently.
I do agree that it should be at operating temp before you really start ragging on the engine and that goes for any engine really.

Also, just because the coolant is up to temp doesn't mean the oil is. My old Golf R had an oil temp gauge and it took a good 5+ miles more for oil to reach operating temp than it did coolant.
 
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