Does anybody know the differance between the 16g and the T3/T4 hybrid? I was wondering what the size differance would be. I have been checking out both of these turbos but could not get this one question answered. I can get the T3/T4 about $100 less then the 16g. Which one do you guys think is better?
Turbo Question?
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Ok well I am fairly new here but I can give you a little bit of a better understanding of this.
16G and T3 are just two different manufacturers of turbo's if not then I am sorry I am not 100% on this.
To make your decision easier get the a/r ratings for both of turbo's. The turbine and the compressor side. Also if they are only oil or oil and liquid cooled. Most people like only the oil cooled as there is less work involved if you are doign the work yourself so you dont' have have to be tapping into any collant lines.... others prefer both as the turbo stays cooler.
Refer to the other post on A/R rating that I made... you will get a better idea there.... sorry if I can't be of more help but that's all I know for now....
I hope this doesn't confuse you more....
Jc
16G and T3 are just two different manufacturers of turbo's if not then I am sorry I am not 100% on this.
To make your decision easier get the a/r ratings for both of turbo's. The turbine and the compressor side. Also if they are only oil or oil and liquid cooled. Most people like only the oil cooled as there is less work involved if you are doign the work yourself so you dont' have have to be tapping into any collant lines.... others prefer both as the turbo stays cooler.
Refer to the other post on A/R rating that I made... you will get a better idea there.... sorry if I can't be of more help but that's all I know for now....
I hope this doesn't confuse you more....
Jc
The 16G is very close to the output of a Garrett T3. The T3/T4 uses a T3 turbin housing, and a T4 compressor housing. It will be slightly more laggy, but the hp will be huge after it kicks in. It's is more efficient that the 16G and T3. No one has use the T3/T4 yet so I say be different and try it out. Just let us know how it performs.
Get the t3/4!
Just dont plan on having a responsive turbo...............but hold on when that bad boy kicks in, you'll be shredding tires in 3rd gear
Just dont plan on having a responsive turbo...............but hold on when that bad boy kicks in, you'll be shredding tires in 3rd gear
5k huh!? Our redline is 7k, so I would only have 2k rpm worth of power!? Damn! I bet the power would be pretty crazy but I would like to have something I can drive on the street.
NC_MP3, how was your teg on the street? There was obviously a lot of lag but at what rpm did it start to make boost? I know that it wasn't just instant boost at 5k. And as the T3/4 started boosting, could you feel a differance in power? Sorry for all the questions but you are the only one that answered this post that has first hand experiance with it!
Spoolin and Ben got me all excited and I just might get the T3/4 just for the hell of it! After all, I can get the T3/4 for about $100 less then the 16g. I just don't want to be driving on the highways and byways and want to change lanes or merge and still for the most part have to downshift to get around somebody! I want to just mash on the gas and say c-ya!
But if nobody else has done the T3/4 thing to a Protege yet then I just might have to be the one to let you guys know how things turn out!!!
NC_MP3, how was your teg on the street? There was obviously a lot of lag but at what rpm did it start to make boost? I know that it wasn't just instant boost at 5k. And as the T3/4 started boosting, could you feel a differance in power? Sorry for all the questions but you are the only one that answered this post that has first hand experiance with it!
Spoolin and Ben got me all excited and I just might get the T3/4 just for the hell of it! After all, I can get the T3/4 for about $100 less then the 16g. I just don't want to be driving on the highways and byways and want to change lanes or merge and still for the most part have to downshift to get around somebody! I want to just mash on the gas and say c-ya!
But if nobody else has done the T3/4 thing to a Protege yet then I just might have to be the one to let you guys know how things turn out!!!
the hybrid sounds like a great idea!
civicsi had this unit when he made one of the longest threads over on the corvette forum by embarassing mitchell davidson in his c5 in multiple runs......
the other guys can chime in here, but about having boost from 5k - i reckon with a t3 turbine you'd have full boost well before that - specially if you get an a/r ratio not more than .63 but .49 is probably too small for top end bang. it sounds like NC_MP3 may have had an a/r ratio of .82 or more??? did you NC_MP3?
in case you didn't know, the a/r ratio basically determines how fast your turbo will spool. you can imagine it as the size of the hole the exhaust gas comes through to drive the turbine - ie smaller = spool faster but run out of flow earlier - larger = more lag but more bang due to less restriction. for our wee 4's an a/r of .82 or more is no real use cos you aren't trying to run 20psi.
anyway, i hope this helps. best of luck with whatever you decide.
civicsi had this unit when he made one of the longest threads over on the corvette forum by embarassing mitchell davidson in his c5 in multiple runs......
the other guys can chime in here, but about having boost from 5k - i reckon with a t3 turbine you'd have full boost well before that - specially if you get an a/r ratio not more than .63 but .49 is probably too small for top end bang. it sounds like NC_MP3 may have had an a/r ratio of .82 or more??? did you NC_MP3?
in case you didn't know, the a/r ratio basically determines how fast your turbo will spool. you can imagine it as the size of the hole the exhaust gas comes through to drive the turbine - ie smaller = spool faster but run out of flow earlier - larger = more lag but more bang due to less restriction. for our wee 4's an a/r of .82 or more is no real use cos you aren't trying to run 20psi.
anyway, i hope this helps. best of luck with whatever you decide.
Since we are on the subject of turbos, where do the oil lines that connect to the turbo tap into? The oil pan? If so, how does the oil get sent to the turbo? Is there something I'm missing? I always wondered about this but never asked!
The T3/4 I was looking at has an a/r ratio of .63! I am really starting to lean towards the T3/4!
The T3/4 I was looking at has an a/r ratio of .63! I am really starting to lean towards the T3/4!
you gotta have a can of oil in the passenger seat with a "squeezy" bulb which your passenger must squeeze every time your boost guage goes positive. you don't need a drain if you never look at the underside of your car.
when the can is empty, stop driving and switch the car off - you might like to carry blankets in case you're out in the wilderness when the oil runs out. :bs:
sorry i don't know squat about your p5 engine but you'll have to tap the sump for the drain at the very least.
i'll send a pm to WShade and get him to answer about the oil feed.....unless someone else beats him to it?
when the can is empty, stop driving and switch the car off - you might like to carry blankets in case you're out in the wilderness when the oil runs out. :bs:
sorry i don't know squat about your p5 engine but you'll have to tap the sump for the drain at the very least.
i'll send a pm to WShade and get him to answer about the oil feed.....unless someone else beats him to it?
We used a 'T' fitting at the oil pressure sensor for an oil feed and tapped the front of the oil pan for a return. Works great. To add my 2 cents on your turbo selection, just as Spoolin said with the T3/4 your turbo lag will be increased. I have a T3, Stage 2 turbine, .48 A/R, 60 trim compressor. It is oil and water cooled. Makes boost from 2500 - redline. Very little lag and makes enough boost for any application I plan to run. If your are building a race car, go T3/4. For a street reliable fun car, go T3. Have fun! 
aahhhh, the horses mouth.........much more than just a big set of teeth!
thanks will.
he's right of course, but if the hybrid is on offer for a good price it will surely do the job. you might find your boost with a .63 a/r starting closer to 3k.
do you have a hook up for those two turbos or were they just what you were considering? if its the latter you might look at something like will described - i can see any of the options being similar at low boost it just depends on the cost i guess.
thanks will.
he's right of course, but if the hybrid is on offer for a good price it will surely do the job. you might find your boost with a .63 a/r starting closer to 3k.
do you have a hook up for those two turbos or were they just what you were considering? if its the latter you might look at something like will described - i can see any of the options being similar at low boost it just depends on the cost i guess.
You guys are the best! I really appreciate all of your help and I will let you know what I decide.
stef_nz these are just the two turbos that I am considering, but if you know anyone that "gots da hook up" then by all means, let me know!
WShade thanks for the info! I always wondered how that works. By the way, where is the oil pressure sensor?
Again, thanks for all of your replies and I look forward to taking on the challenge of doing a custom turbo setup!
Dave
stef_nz these are just the two turbos that I am considering, but if you know anyone that "gots da hook up" then by all means, let me know!
WShade thanks for the info! I always wondered how that works. By the way, where is the oil pressure sensor?
Again, thanks for all of your replies and I look forward to taking on the challenge of doing a custom turbo setup!
Dave
sorry bro, i don't gots da hook up, i just wondered why you were only looking at those two turbos - thought you might've had a secret underground stash or sumthin'
you'll find the oil pressure sensor at the end of the two lines that connect to it
in other words i dunno.....thankyou, please drive through?!?!?!
you'll find the oil pressure sensor at the end of the two lines that connect to it
in other words i dunno.....thankyou, please drive through?!?!?!
It's not that you wont have any power until around 4000rpm, you just wont have "full" boost until then. Anytime you motor is running the turbo is working. As long as exhaust is flowing the turbo is pumping. You will have boost, but it will be going from the normal -psi or "hg" until you cross into the atmospheric pressure of 0psi, then you will go into boost around 1500 to 2000rpm. My turbo will have me at full boost at around 1500 to 1800rpm. It's all in the size of the turbine housing. That's why people like to use the T3/T4, it has a small T3 turbine side, and a LARGE T4 compressor side that is VERY efficient, meaning that it's boost will be much cooler than the T3's or the T28's boost. The cooler the air, the more power. But when I say cooler, I don't mean like 50 degrees. After the air is compressed, it is going to reach around 200 to 250 degrees before it goes through the intercooler. Then the intercooler is only going to cool it about 75 degrees at best. Then if you use water injection, it will cool another 50 to 100 degrees. Then if you use a spray of nitrous like me,....I don't even know what that is going to do yet. We will all have to await the results!
Boost started early with mine. I am not saying it didn't reach full boost until 5K, I am just saying at about 5K the wheels would light up. I would compare 1st gear w/ the T3/T4 to an Integra Type R, you ever driven one of those? Until about 5K it isn't that fast, but after that you better hold on. Just like the Type R, not fast until the VTEC kicks in, then it is like a whole new car. Once you shift to 2nd you are still in the power range, so 2nd and up is really strong. I was pleased with the T3/T4.
PRO 5 said:You guys are the best! I really appreciate all of your help and I will let you know what I decide.
stef_nz these are just the two turbos that I am considering, but if you know anyone that "gots da hook up" then by all means, let me know!
WShade thanks for the info! I always wondered how that works. By the way, where is the oil pressure sensor?
Again, thanks for all of your replies and I look forward to taking on the challenge of doing a custom turbo setup!
Dave
The sensor is located beneath the intake manifold and between cylinders two and three on the aft side of the engine near the oil filter. It is accessible from below the engine.
stef_nz said:oh god! stand back!!! everyone get behind me so we can watch big_ben from a safe distance.
okay ben, spray away dude! am i gonna need my "flash" goggles and my fire extinguisher?
No,
What Ben is saying is that he will have a Nitrous based cooling system for the Intercooler (Outside) , not inside the engine. I've heard of some cars getting close to 50 extra HP from the Intercooler Nitrous system.
