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Premium or Regular Gas?
- Thread starter jimdogs
- Start date
I did the same test recently and switched to 87 to see what would happen. I drove until I had a half a gallon left in the tank and then filled it up with 87. The result? Much less power (the engine was droaning all the time because it was pulling timing big time to make up for the octane deficiency) and mileage dropped. On a tankful of 91, I usually get 350 miles and still have a half a gallon left in the tank. On 87, I only got 310 miles.
To me the debate is pretty worthless. If I really was such a penny pincher to forgo the 91 octane for 87, I would have bought a Mazda3 or a Prius, etc. I like the power the CX-7 offers and with that comes the costs associated with it.
Off-topic, but I remember folks on the STI forum bitching about how there STI's were noisy and the ride quality was not good, etc. I kept thinking, what did you expect? Did you think you were buying a Lexus?
The same can be applied, here, don't expect to save tons of money and get awesome gas mileage on a turbo powered not so small or lightweight SUV.
To me the debate is pretty worthless. If I really was such a penny pincher to forgo the 91 octane for 87, I would have bought a Mazda3 or a Prius, etc. I like the power the CX-7 offers and with that comes the costs associated with it.
Off-topic, but I remember folks on the STI forum bitching about how there STI's were noisy and the ride quality was not good, etc. I kept thinking, what did you expect? Did you think you were buying a Lexus?
The same can be applied, here, don't expect to save tons of money and get awesome gas mileage on a turbo powered not so small or lightweight SUV.
basunnyday
Member
- :
- CX7 GT AWD Copper Red
mikey1981 said:Did you look at the window sticker?
Actual not really, the salesman printed me out the inventory sheet on the one I test drove, it had all the options and msrp.
Whats your real point? That I'm an idiot and deserve to have a car I can't put the proper gas in. That car salesmans have no responsibility to inform buyers of anything?
My original question was, " anybody using 89 octane, and what is happening?
Go find somebody else to put down.
ok, if you go back to my original post, i said, DONT TAKE THIS THE WRONG WAY. by asking if you looked at the window sticker isnt a put down.
also, YOU BOUGHT THIS CAR, its not Mazdas fault if you found out details you should have known at the point of purchase. Yes, the salesman may have never brought up the issue, but its also your responsibility as the buyer.
to say, Mazda shouldnt sell this car if there isnt a pump arond is rediculous. I think for 1. Mazda doesnt look up gas statiosn in relationship to dealers, and 2.If i make and sell ice skates, and i sell them in Florida, should it be my fault if you mistakenly buy a pair and have no where to skate given your location?
I am 100% not poking fun at you, and like i said, maybe they should have been up front and informed you, but you should have known as well.
As far as the people putting in 87 and driving and thinking its ok, it may be fine now, just hope you dont have serious problems over time with this engine, given its extreeme sensitivity to low grade gas, cold weather issues, and obviously a very big downgrade in performance. I just dont get it, to save 10+ cents a gallon . . . (im not insinuating anyone is cheap! i just dont get the big deal about 2-4 bucks a fill up)
and im not trying to get on anyones bad side, but cmon. I could see if this was a V-6, but its a turbo and it needs better fuel.
also, YOU BOUGHT THIS CAR, its not Mazdas fault if you found out details you should have known at the point of purchase. Yes, the salesman may have never brought up the issue, but its also your responsibility as the buyer.
to say, Mazda shouldnt sell this car if there isnt a pump arond is rediculous. I think for 1. Mazda doesnt look up gas statiosn in relationship to dealers, and 2.If i make and sell ice skates, and i sell them in Florida, should it be my fault if you mistakenly buy a pair and have no where to skate given your location?
I am 100% not poking fun at you, and like i said, maybe they should have been up front and informed you, but you should have known as well.
As far as the people putting in 87 and driving and thinking its ok, it may be fine now, just hope you dont have serious problems over time with this engine, given its extreeme sensitivity to low grade gas, cold weather issues, and obviously a very big downgrade in performance. I just dont get it, to save 10+ cents a gallon . . . (im not insinuating anyone is cheap! i just dont get the big deal about 2-4 bucks a fill up)
and im not trying to get on anyones bad side, but cmon. I could see if this was a V-6, but its a turbo and it needs better fuel.
mikey1981 said:ok, if you go back to my original post, i said, DONT TAKE THIS THE WRONG WAY. by asking if you looked at the window sticker isnt a put down.
also, YOU BOUGHT THIS CAR, its not Mazdas fault if you found out details you should have known at the point of purchase. Yes, the salesman may have never brought up the issue, but its also your responsibility as the buyer.
to say, Mazda shouldnt sell this car if there isnt a pump arond is rediculous. I think for 1. Mazda doesnt look up gas statiosn in relationship to dealers, and 2.If i make and sell ice skates, and i sell them in Florida, should it be my fault if you mistakenly buy a pair and have no where to skate given your location?
I am 100% not poking fun at you, and like i said, maybe they should have been up front and informed you, but you should have known as well.
As far as the people putting in 87 and driving and thinking its ok, it may be fine now, just hope you dont have serious problems over time with this engine, given its extreeme sensitivity to low grade gas, cold weather issues, and obviously a very big downgrade in performance. I just dont get it, to save 10+ cents a gallon . . . (im not insinuating anyone is cheap! i just dont get the big deal about 2-4 bucks a fill up)
and im not trying to get on anyones bad side, but cmon. I could see if this was a V-6, but its a turbo and it needs better fuel.
I know people are not trying to pick fights, just share opinions. In that spirit, I'd like to add my perspective.
Yes we all need to be informed consumers, but I think dealers have a responsibility as well. Not all of us are car savvy enough to know, when we see that a car is turbo, that it needs at least 91. I have never owned a turbo and don't really understand how it works, all I know is that it gives me more horsepower and zoom.
I felt a bit blindsided when on my first attempt to fill up, I realized that there is no such thing as 91 in Alaska. My salesperson told me the car needed premium fuel and that was fine with me. I had never had to buy premium fuel up here before but I had seen the signs at the stations showing 3 levels of gas - one called super premium and costing more so I assumed I would be ok. After visiting every brand in town and calling some independents, all I could find was 90. Then I called my dealership to ask them if there was 91 somewhere in Alaska and they said no, just 90. I asked about the directions in the manual and they said not to worry, it will be fine.
It seems to me that at some point during the several hours that I was at the dealership the day of my purchase, that they should have told me that they were selling me a car that I had no hope of properly fueling. That to me seems like a material omission on their part. If I was taking a risk, I should have been told that and allowed to make an informed decision. Instead, they played hide the ball. To me that is not right, and not good business practice. I may have erred, but so did they.
(In Florida, there are indoor ice rinks.)
The main issue is whether the original poster can get away with 89 or if he should try to get out of the contract. It was good advice to have him ask Mazda.
mikey1981 said:hhah i know, and there are fuel pumps as well, just not near by.
Yep, I've got plenty of ice but I'd need to drive for days to find any 91 octane. (canada) has some I hear. and they have ice too. I feel gypped.
basunnyday
Member
- :
- CX7 GT AWD Copper Red
I agree with you on if premium is readily available, it is not worth the savings to use a lower grade. However some may just get along fine, depending on where they live, temperature, elevation etc.. Since octane is based on Sea level, people in Denver may get along fine on 89.
However beware when you travel the backroads of Central US, (off major interstates) you will find yourself in the situation where it is either run out of gas or use regular. All of the premium tanks have been replaced by the 10% ethenol (89 octane.) Which by the way is really rated 89.5 when it leaves the refinery, it is then up to the station to rate it 89 or 90.
What really gets me is that I live only 45 miles from one of the largest refineries in Kansas and Nebraska. I called them to see if any local distributers were hauling out the premium, trying to locate a station. They confirmed that it was not available at stations in my area at this time. However I could get some delivered with a 2,000 gal minimum order. Now all I need to do is buy me a 2,000 gallon tank. They did a nice job of giving information on octane etc.
Their current spread on the difference on the cost of regular vs 91 today was 14 cents, but can change almost daily.
However beware when you travel the backroads of Central US, (off major interstates) you will find yourself in the situation where it is either run out of gas or use regular. All of the premium tanks have been replaced by the 10% ethenol (89 octane.) Which by the way is really rated 89.5 when it leaves the refinery, it is then up to the station to rate it 89 or 90.
What really gets me is that I live only 45 miles from one of the largest refineries in Kansas and Nebraska. I called them to see if any local distributers were hauling out the premium, trying to locate a station. They confirmed that it was not available at stations in my area at this time. However I could get some delivered with a 2,000 gal minimum order. Now all I need to do is buy me a 2,000 gallon tank. They did a nice job of giving information on octane etc.
Their current spread on the difference on the cost of regular vs 91 today was 14 cents, but can change almost daily.
basunnyday,
To answer your question, yes I have been using 87 octane in my turbocharged CX-7 and I have had no problems whatsoever. When I hit the gas it gets up and goes, fast! So I do not see any problems with using 87 or 89 which is available to you. I have tried both 93 and 87 with very little noticeable power difference. They recommend 91 and you want to use 89, 2 octane points less should not be a problem as I am jumping 6 octane points and feel very little difference. I also own an 86 porsche 944 turbo so I do know a little bit about powerful cars and see no problem with the power my CX-7 is putting out by using 87. And yea, its a couple bucks a fill up but try filling up 3-4 and even sometimes 5 times a week, it adds up, quick. Last month I saved $60 by using 87 instead of 93. Is a few horsepower worth $60 a month to me? No way. I say enjoy your CX-7 with 89 octane, it really is an awesome vehicle!
To answer your question, yes I have been using 87 octane in my turbocharged CX-7 and I have had no problems whatsoever. When I hit the gas it gets up and goes, fast! So I do not see any problems with using 87 or 89 which is available to you. I have tried both 93 and 87 with very little noticeable power difference. They recommend 91 and you want to use 89, 2 octane points less should not be a problem as I am jumping 6 octane points and feel very little difference. I also own an 86 porsche 944 turbo so I do know a little bit about powerful cars and see no problem with the power my CX-7 is putting out by using 87. And yea, its a couple bucks a fill up but try filling up 3-4 and even sometimes 5 times a week, it adds up, quick. Last month I saved $60 by using 87 instead of 93. Is a few horsepower worth $60 a month to me? No way. I say enjoy your CX-7 with 89 octane, it really is an awesome vehicle!
do you own or lease your cx-7?
Theoretically, yea if i leased this thing, then maybe i would not care as much in terms of gas and other things, but since i own mine, i dont want a damaged engine down the road and that is worth 10+cents a gallon more everytime i fill up.
all im saying is, if down the line your car develops problems, and Mazda says its gas related (denying warranty work), u r going to own the cost of whatever that problem is. how big of a gamble is that to you? who knows, its a roll of the dice. your car may in fact be perfectly fine.
I would take a car salesmans opinion about whether its safe to use lower than 91 with a grain of salt. He wants a sale. This should be a non-dealership issue and you should take it directly to Mazda like other posters have said. And your question should not be, if i put in 89, will I be ok? It should be, WHEN i put in and use 89, because that is all thats available to me, and if this car has a problem, tell me what happens ie Warranty repair, engine repair, etc etc. I can guarantee you they will deny repair/service work as warranty work due to lower than recommended grade gasoline that MAzda says is required.
best of luck.
Theoretically, yea if i leased this thing, then maybe i would not care as much in terms of gas and other things, but since i own mine, i dont want a damaged engine down the road and that is worth 10+cents a gallon more everytime i fill up.
all im saying is, if down the line your car develops problems, and Mazda says its gas related (denying warranty work), u r going to own the cost of whatever that problem is. how big of a gamble is that to you? who knows, its a roll of the dice. your car may in fact be perfectly fine.
I would take a car salesmans opinion about whether its safe to use lower than 91 with a grain of salt. He wants a sale. This should be a non-dealership issue and you should take it directly to Mazda like other posters have said. And your question should not be, if i put in 89, will I be ok? It should be, WHEN i put in and use 89, because that is all thats available to me, and if this car has a problem, tell me what happens ie Warranty repair, engine repair, etc etc. I can guarantee you they will deny repair/service work as warranty work due to lower than recommended grade gasoline that MAzda says is required.
best of luck.
- :
- MP5T / 944
Dude, Yer gonna kill that ******* SUV on Low-Test.
It will run like s*** because the ECU will dumb down the performance to offset the s*** Gas.
It will foul the O2 sensors, It will bung up the Cat-Converter.
It will run like s*** because the ECU will dumb down the performance to offset the s*** Gas.
It will foul the O2 sensors, It will bung up the Cat-Converter.
giddyup said:basunnyday,
To answer your question, yes I have been using 87 octane in my turbocharged CX-7 and I have had no problems whatsoever. When I hit the gas it gets up and goes, fast! So I do not see any problems with using 87 or 89 which is available to you. I have tried both 93 and 87 with very little noticeable power difference. They recommend 91 and you want to use 89, 2 octane points less should not be a problem as I am jumping 6 octane points and feel very little difference. I also own an 86 porsche 944 turbo so I do know a little bit about powerful cars and see no problem with the power my CX-7 is putting out by using 87. And yea, its a couple bucks a fill up but try filling up 3-4 and even sometimes 5 times a week, it adds up, quick. Last month I saved $60 by using 87 instead of 93. Is a few horsepower worth $60 a month to me? No way. I say enjoy your CX-7 with 89 octane, it really is an awesome vehicle!
That's like drinkin Schlitz when you could drink I don't know, insert your favorite brand of beer ___________ for pennies more. Sure, it may not kill you, but you won't feel too smooth in the morning. I bet you're getting s*** gas mileage, too because the knock sensors are constantly dialing back the timing filling your combustion chambers with unburnt s*** gas that passes into your cat con and will eventually foul up everything. I am also no stranger to high performace cars and turbos.
People who use premium when their car doesn't need it are foolish. People who need it and don't use it are ignorant. Not trying to be rude man, I just really disagree. (screwy)
exactly.
Now i know why i was accused by the shop foreman of using low grade gas for the reason why my engine was misfiring.
Mazda knows people are trying to cheat the engine, the dealers were put on notice across the country, and they have a punch list of "problems" for service apts made by customers claiming something is wrong with the car, when in fact its the customer using low grade gas. Mazda isn't going to service your car when you have a problem.
I had to fight for 3 weeks before Mazda would 1. authorize a warranty repair (replace the fuel pump) and 2. realize that it WAS NOT low grade gas (after i had them go fill up with shell v power 93 and my engine still misfired.) Putting in anything less than 91, if you can that is, as long as 91 or greater is avail, your just asking for a situation.
Now i know why i was accused by the shop foreman of using low grade gas for the reason why my engine was misfiring.
Mazda knows people are trying to cheat the engine, the dealers were put on notice across the country, and they have a punch list of "problems" for service apts made by customers claiming something is wrong with the car, when in fact its the customer using low grade gas. Mazda isn't going to service your car when you have a problem.
I had to fight for 3 weeks before Mazda would 1. authorize a warranty repair (replace the fuel pump) and 2. realize that it WAS NOT low grade gas (after i had them go fill up with shell v power 93 and my engine still misfired.) Putting in anything less than 91, if you can that is, as long as 91 or greater is avail, your just asking for a situation.
You guys are saying I should be getting s*** gas mileage and having engine misfires for using 87 octane? When are these problems going to start happening? I have not had any misfires and yes, I know what they feel like and I am getting exactly the same gas mileage while using 87 that I did when I was using 93. I actually had 1 tank of all highway miles that I got 23.5 MPG and that was with 87. I'm just not sure what you mean by all these problems that I should be having, cause I used 87 for almost 5000 miles and had no problems at all. I did just switch back to 93 now that my engine is broken in and am going to see if I get a big power increase and better gas mileage.
Mikey, what are these punch list of problems that would come about by using low octane fuel? Where are you getting this info from? I'm not trying to be a smartass, I would really like to know a little more on this and get some more info on all these gas issues. Thanks
And Platonium, I really dont appreciate being called ignorant. If you want to contribute some info into this matter thats fine but the next time you feel the need to insult someone I suggest you shut the f*** up!
Mikey, what are these punch list of problems that would come about by using low octane fuel? Where are you getting this info from? I'm not trying to be a smartass, I would really like to know a little more on this and get some more info on all these gas issues. Thanks
And Platonium, I really dont appreciate being called ignorant. If you want to contribute some info into this matter thats fine but the next time you feel the need to insult someone I suggest you shut the f*** up!
- :
- MP5T / 944
^^^ Perhaps your not getting "misfires" because you don't know what it feels like to actually have the power you are supposed to have..
It could all be in the Operator Housing Reciever... Not in the motor..
It could all be in the Operator Housing Reciever... Not in the motor..
My dealer. they were prepared with a troublshooting list straight from Mazda on mechanical problems due to low grade gas. They were also prepared to deny warranty service work/labor due to such issues. My car was one of many at my dealer for misfiring, bucking, detonation issues. (most of the customers however had admitted it was low grade gas in their tank, thus the foreman just assumed I was one of the many idiots)
Giddyup, refer to my ^%$%^$today thread in this same section and you can read all about it.
You may be just fine with 87, i have no problem with that as do you, all im sayin is that just beware if/when you have some major mechanical probs starting to happen. Its gonna cost you some cash. when and or if your engine misfires and maybe you are on the highway and the computer shuts your car off becuase it wants to prevent damage to your engine (happened to me twice in the same day, i almost got in a few accidents because of this) then good luck.
all these hypothetical situations we are discussing are possible reprocussions of using minimum grade octane. For the small diff in price per gallon, I would consider it more than wise to just put in the 91 and follow the rules of the game. if saving 4 bucks a week on a fill up makes you happy, then more power to ya.
Giddyup, refer to my ^%$%^$today thread in this same section and you can read all about it.
You may be just fine with 87, i have no problem with that as do you, all im sayin is that just beware if/when you have some major mechanical probs starting to happen. Its gonna cost you some cash. when and or if your engine misfires and maybe you are on the highway and the computer shuts your car off becuase it wants to prevent damage to your engine (happened to me twice in the same day, i almost got in a few accidents because of this) then good luck.
all these hypothetical situations we are discussing are possible reprocussions of using minimum grade octane. For the small diff in price per gallon, I would consider it more than wise to just put in the 91 and follow the rules of the game. if saving 4 bucks a week on a fill up makes you happy, then more power to ya.
I wanted to share the information I got back from Mazda on this issue. As some of you may recall, I live in Alaska and learned after my purchase that the best premium gas up here is 90. It seems to do well with the 90 and my dealership's service dept told me it would be OK when I asked them about having the CX-7 on a steady 90 diet.
With this debate, I decided to contact Mazda. Their response is pasted below. (I hope they don't mind.)
_____
Thank you for contacting Mazda.
For of all, congratulations on your recent purchase of a Mazda CX-7!
As you already know, the CX-7 will best perform when using Premium unleaded fuel with an octane rating of 91. You may use a regular unleaded fuel with an octane rating from 87 to 90, but this will slightly reduce performance, such as reduced engine output, and engine knocking. For additional assistance, please contact your local authorized Mazda dealer.
Again, thank you for contacting Mazda.
Regards,
T R.
Specialist, Customer Assistance E-Business
With this debate, I decided to contact Mazda. Their response is pasted below. (I hope they don't mind.)
_____
Thank you for contacting Mazda.
For of all, congratulations on your recent purchase of a Mazda CX-7!
As you already know, the CX-7 will best perform when using Premium unleaded fuel with an octane rating of 91. You may use a regular unleaded fuel with an octane rating from 87 to 90, but this will slightly reduce performance, such as reduced engine output, and engine knocking. For additional assistance, please contact your local authorized Mazda dealer.
Again, thank you for contacting Mazda.
Regards,
T R.
Specialist, Customer Assistance E-Business
Had your inquiry included what if the car develops problems from the lower octane rating?
they make it sound all peachy and nice that you can use lower gas grade, the flip side of this question needs to be answered.
It was told to me through Mazda that repairs required as a result of using lower than 91 is not covered by Mazda.
they make it sound all peachy and nice that you can use lower gas grade, the flip side of this question needs to be answered.
It was told to me through Mazda that repairs required as a result of using lower than 91 is not covered by Mazda.
mikey1981 said:Had your inquiry included what if the car develops problems from the lower octane rating?
they make it sound all peachy and nice that you can use lower gas grade, the flip side of this question needs to be answered.
It was told to me through Mazda that repairs required as a result of using lower than 91 is not covered by Mazda.
I was disspointed by the level of generality of their response as well as their brushing aside my concerns. I very specifically asked about the long term consequences of never using 91 and my concern that I would be faced with large repair bills down the road (probably after my warrantee runs out).
My fear is that my dealer telling me using 90 will be "fine" means fine for them because they're going to make some money off me later. But I'm trying to interpret things more generously and give them the benefit of the doubt. They have been just great about making things right when things don't go as intended, so hopefully they'll step up if I develop fuel related problems later.
It may be that Mazda told them 90 is ok in Alaska, because lets face it, it is cold and stays cold, at least where I live. I called the local BMW dealership about the lack of true premium gas up here and they said BMW gave them the green light to sell cars requiring 91 because of our colder climate.
I realize (though can't claim to understand) that turbos are different and have different issues, but maybe the cold is enough to make 90 ok.
In any event, my Alaska angle doesn't in any way jusitfy or excuse the rosy general response Mazda sent.
I really love driving this car and wish I could give it 91 and not have to worry about all this.
- :
- MP5T / 944
Octaine Additive.
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