Mazda Service problems - Help!!!

[adragonfly]

I took my car to the Mazda dealership this morning because my check engine light came on. I had just taken it there three days ago for an oil change, so I suspected that maybe they had knocked something while they performed the service. Anyway, when I dropped the car off this morning, I told the guy that I had just been in for an oil change and now my light was on. He took the keys and said the check engine light was covered under warranty, so it was going to be free. I signed the slip that he gave me and agreed that I would pick up my car after work...

An hour later, the guy calls me up and says that the problem was that my vacuum hoses were changed. (I used a vacuum hose dress-up kit). Anyway, the hoses were "failing" he said, and they wanted to charge me $300 to put stock ones back on. I said, "No, forget it. I can do that myself." To which he replied, "That's fine, but we're going to have to charge you $70 for looking at the car since you modified it. That voided your warranty for that service." I asked him why they didn't call me before they did the diagnostic since it was obvious that the car was modified the second that they popped the hood. I don't think they should have continued any further without contacting me to tell me that I was going to be charged, but the guy said that $70 was the minimum amount charged for any work done by the mechanic. So I asked him, "You mean that you're charging me all that money for basically popping my hood?" and the guy said, "Unfortunately, yes."

He said I should have told him that I had modified the hoses when I dropped off the car, but I've had those on for at least 3 months and had no problems. I didn't know I had to bring that to his attention since the car was already there just three days before. I don't think I should be charged the $70 fee for looking under the hood, at least not without having been consulted first.

What can I do? I'm at work right now and am going to pick up the car tonight. Does anyone work for Mazda or know of a complaint department? I swear, every time I go to this particular dealership for something, I have a terrible experience. They're a bunch of a$$holes! :mad:

 

[BK's black P5]

Since you are here in So Cal, I think I can offer a suggestion. California laws for automotive repair require that customers approve any cost for work performed on their vehicles, and that estimates are provided in writing upfront. If other problems are found after the initial estimate that will increase the cost of the repair, the mechanic is required to call the customer and get verbal approval to exceed the dollar amount of the original estimate. THIS IS THE LAW. If your original estimate did not include any amout for diagnosis, I suggest you contact the manager and ask why they are attempting to charge you for work that was not approved by you.

Hope this helps.

By the way, which dealership are these a$$holes working for?

 

[big_ben]

What BK's black P5 said is right, but here is my suggestion. Wait till about 2am and go to the gas station. Fill up about 8 gallon size gas cans. Take them to the dealer that is trying to screw you. Procede to pour the gas all over the outside of the building. The light it on fire. I gaurantee your problems will be solved.

 

[adragonfly]

Thanks for the tip... Is there any place I can find that specific law? These guys are Star Mazda in Glendale.

They're a bunch of jerks... every last one of them (well, except Jack Farmer, who was my original salesman and who always tried to help me even after he got my sale)... Here's another example of their service...When I went in for my oil change, they ran out of cups at the coffe machine, so I went up to a guy that worked there who was just standing around. I asked him politely if he knew where I could find more cups, and the guy looked at me rudely and said "I'm not in charge of cups." I couldn't believe how rude he was and so, dumbfounded, I walked away. Two minutes later the idiot went and got cups anyway. He just wanted to be a jerk for no reason.

Sorry for being long-winded, but I have such a strong dislike for these guys.

 

[Sir Nuke]

as soon as the "coffee cup" comment was made...I would have gone DIRECTLY to the owner/ president/manager of the dealership and ENSURED he knew how his people were representing HIS/HER dealership, and if he was worth a grain of salt....he would ABRUPTLY put a total end of treatment of his/her customers like that.

 

[adragonfly]

I just called the service manager and he said he'd call me back. This guy sounded a lot nicer than the idiots who I've been dealing with, but then, they always start off that way. If he doesn't resolve this problem with me today, I'm going to just pay the 70 to get my car back, but I'm filing a complaint with Consumer Affairs Bureau of Automotive Repair. I do have a lawyer if it goes that far, but I'd rather not got through the trouble.

 

[Silver2002P5]

If your car was in 3 days ago, and they are demanding $70, get your money's worth and get them to go pop the hood and show you exactly what failed.

You paid them for an hour anyway

My dealer always states upfront that there is a diagnostic charge if warranty does not cover it. But I don't live in CA.

 

[gene in cincinnati]

Let MazdaUSA know what is going on.

http://www.mazdausa.com/contact/contact_ns.asp?zip=&did=&state=

 

[redwagon02]

Talk to a manager. Explain your situation and tell him/her that you will not pay the $70.

 

[adragonfly]

I finally talked to the Service Manager again, and he might just be that dealership's single saving grace. He was entirely polite, knowledgeable, and fair - even said he thought my hoses looked good! Turns out that a couple of my aftermarket hoses were slightly loose. But, since I bought my car there just three months ago, and that was important to them, he wasn't going to charge me the $70. He even offered to show me which ones needed to be fixed so that I could replace them. I figured I'm better off just putting the stock hoses back on and wrapping wire looms around them instead. Makes me think twice about tinkering with my car now, at least until my warranty is expired anyway.

I'm writing Mazda a letter to tell them how rude most of their people have been but also to tell them how helpful their service manager was.

 

[Antoine]

I can't begin to express my hatred for dealers and especially sales...In light of this thread...what would you guys think about having a "dealer review" forum in the new Marketplace section?

Let me know...thanks

adragonfly...I hope everything works out...hate to see a fellow site member distressed.

 

[gene in cincinnati]

Antoine,

I think that is an excellent idea.

 

[adragonfly]

I think that's a great idea as well!!! So people who come onto this site and are thinking of getting a new car know where to go and where to avoid!

 

[BK's black P5]

Antoine - great idea. Would give us all a heads up on which dealers and service managers to avoid and which we should address our concerns to.

 

[frankd53]

I don't really blame a dealer for trying to recover their costs for diagnosing a problem that is not caused by a defect in the vehicle, but by a modification of yours. But they should have gone about it in a different way.... they should have offered to install the original hoses and refund the cost of that service if that did not resolve the problem... I give the dealer credit for making a proper diagnosis, and then in the end letting you off the hook totally for your mods that caused the problem.

 

[Syzygy]

I don't really blame a dealer for trying to recover their costs for diagnosing a problem that is not caused by a defect in the vehicle, but by a modification of yours...(snip)...

That's funny, I do. I won't do business with any garage, shop, dealership, or pet store, that insists on trying to charge for any diagnostic that results in a "no-fix" result.

Beyond that, I think you're missing the point: she brought the car in on a warrantee issue. To compound this, she had just gotten service done at their dealership. They had already indicated they would replace the "light malfunction" for free. adragonfly was effectively tendered an "offer" to fix the "light problem" for free.

"What's the issue?", you may ask. "Wasn't the problem associated with her modification?" Yes, it was (or maybe the oil-changing mechanic bumped the hoses while he was under the hood). However, in order to work on the light she was quoted $0.00 on, the mechanic raised the hood (probably to check for the problem he assumed was created by the numb-nut who did her oil change, maybe to pull the battery cable, however unlikely) and immediately knew that she had aftermarket hoses.

At this point:

1) he was overstepping the parameters of his quote. He realized that this job then may involve a problem beyond the sloppiness of his mechanic and/or outside of the umbrella of warrantee coverage.

2) he was on his own. Legally, adragonfly had a very strong leg to stand on. Charging for "opening the hood" made no sense. Either he had to to fix the light, or he had to find out what the real problem was (his choice).

3) he should have called her and told her that he would likely proceed troubleshooting on her tab. At this point, the original offer would have been retracted and a new one offered.

adragonfly was working from a position of good business sense and common sense practices. She was also expecting the dealership's employee to treat her with the same respect. He did not. He decided to perform tasks outside the parameters of the original agreement and therefore proceeded on a track that bordered on poor business practices.

This is why the Service Manager was so accommodating. He understood that adragonfly had an excellent case for litigation, if they "forced" her to pay.

As I mentioned before, I only do business with folks who understand these premises of good business sense. It's a sad state of events when the dealership that you purchased your car from proceeds to intentionally rake you over the coals. Mazda needs to hear about these practices, along with strong words of how word-of-mouth is likely to destroy any chance they have of selling many more automobiles in the future.

Having a business has many liabilities. One of them is that the customer is both the source of initial income and the potential loss or gain of future monies. Business execs know this. Most mechanics working on commission for a business do not.

I, personally, only take my cars to the dealership for warrantee work. Anything else, I take to a qualified, fair mechanic.

Nuff said.

 

[20ESGUY]

Ok, been here before, many times honestly. Yes all dealerships charge a minium fee for diagnostic work...usually 1 hour of labor. That covers the mechanics time he spent on it...be it test driving using the OBD scanner, or whatever; it also covers the cost of the equipment...even though all dealers are required to have any special tool needed to work on a vehicle they still gotta pay for em. Unfortunately, in your defense dragonfly, he should have told you that from the get go...but if you read the repair order they had you sign it should be on there about the minium fee for diag work, most dealers do that to cover themselves. On the other side of the coin, your's, even though you modded the car if it was the first time you'd had it in for warranty work they should've given you a gimmie on it and covered it...yes mazda does give two freebies outside of the standard warranty, I can't remember what they're called excatly. When you talk to the service manager that's probably the best approach to take...if you signed the repair order and it stated the minium fee you don't have much of a leg to stand on...most techs won't pop the hood straight off for a CEL, although on our cars you do have to to get to the diag plug so evidently he wasn't paying much attention. Sorry for the long post, but having been on both sides I'd like to clarify a few things.

 

[frankd53]

Like I said above, I agree they could have handled it better. First of all they never should have said they were doing anything for 'free' without knowing whether the problem was truly covered by warranty. After they said the repair was 'free' , they were obligated to advise before doing anything chargeable. If, instead, the problem was something more clearcut like front end vibrations with aftermarket tires/rims, would they not have been in their right to warn this may not be covered by warranty and labour charges may apply from the get-go? In this case they could have said 'we'll check it out, but if it turns out it's a problem not covered by warranty we'll need to charge you 1 hour labour for the diagnosis". As for the suggestion that may "the oil-changing mechanic bumped the hoses while he was under the hood", this is ridiculous. Hoses properly secured would not come loose like that.
In the end they did diagnose the problem properly, and expeditiously, and were trying to get recovery for that time... I see why they would try to do that , althogh you can be sure I would have been having the same chat with the Service Manager to get this waived as 'goodwill' on their part.

 

[adragonfly]

I picked up my car last night and wasn't charged for the diagnosis. The Service manager waived the fees.

I know about the minimum diagnosis fee, and agree that machanics have a right to charge that. They should, however, notify you of it. When I took the car in, I was told specifically that the check engine light was covered under warranty and that the service would be free. That was our agreement. The moment they saw the hoses, they should have stopped working in the car, called me up, and asked me if I wanted them to proceed with any disagnosis work. At that point, they still would not have known whether my hoses were the cause of the problem or if it were something else. Even if my hoses weren't the actual cause of the problem, their very existence automatically voided the free service on my check engine light. They didn't need to continue to find out if the hoses really were the problem until they called me to inform me they would charge for that extra work.

People can't just do work on your car without telling you about the charges. What if I didn't have the money? I wouldn't have been able to get my car back until I came up with it. And, if I was told immediately that they were going to charge me, I wouldn't have left the car there. I would have taken it to me mechanic friend who would have looked at it for free. I only took it to the dealer because I try to avoid imposing on my friends and thought that it was covered under warranty anyway.

Enough rambling... it's taken care of, which is all I'm concerned about. Just have to write my letter to Mazda, and a thank you card to the service manager.

 

[redwagon02]

And They lived happily ever after.............................yeah right! we'll just to wait till your next service.