Injen CAI, Tornado, AEM Bypass

[jcilforever]

I have had my P5 for a week and finally got around to installing my Injen CAI. I had to cut a section off the 90 that comes off the throttle body to make room for the extra length that the bypass added to the assembly. The Tornado fit nicely into the section of Injen tube after the MFS. I had to hollow out the grommets on each side of the AEM bypass with a dremel to accomidate for the larger O.D. of the Injen tube. Make sure to put padding between the bracket and the A/C line also around the hole above the filter. Could someone tell me how to paste a picture on to a message Anyway the Tornado took care of the loss in torque. As for the supposed problems with the ECU if you add a CAI ,I have not seen any yet all I here is Vroom and my wheels grab the pavement, next stop turbo/ or supercharger!

[ 01-14-2002: Message edited by: jcilforever ]

 

[P5]

<The Tornado fit nicely into the section of Injen tube after the MFS>

Tornado?

Thanks

 

[Steve]

does the tornado really do that much? i think there was a thread on this board a while ago...i've seen the infomercial a couple of times...

 

[Jester999]

I know this isnt a great sorce, but since i dont own a tornado and i dont have a dyno, all i can give you is a car and driver review summery. They had ran ads for it for a while, and finally did a test on it. They found a loss in torque and hp, and no gain in MPG. After they did thier test they pulled the ads form their mag... I think it was car and drivewr but it may have been another car mag. Anyway they really disliked the tornado and they wouldnt put the ads in their mag, so they thought it was all a scam. But this was only one magazine that i was reading at the time. So thats my $.02

 

[jcilforever]

Well placement is esential, also the magazine tested with the stock airbox I believe Inceased airflow less restriction now I placed mine right after the MAS inside the flared Ingen tube. I could send someone the pics to post. I have a much better response around 3000 to 6000 RPM, I also have a custom scoop to the filter. I tested it with and without. (not to be a ) I do not care what anyone has to say about the performance blah blah blah I am just passing on to help, although I would not have done it without the CAI. I did the CAI because I am going to add a supercharger or turbo in the future so it makes sense for me.

 

[jcilforever]

email for pics is lafforthun&earthlink.net

 

[Greg S]

I would recomend taking the tornado out. Al it does is block the airflow path. Most likely the reason you gained the torque back is that the Tornado is blocking and slowing the air down. Pull it back out and see what difference you get.

 

[jcilforever]

Already have when I installed it I have tessted it during various conditions with and without, placing it in different places etc and it does perform better with it. The turning vanes do not block air flow just redirect the path. I used to work on industrial equpment which used the same theory. If they are in the wrong place they screw up everything but in the right place they can make vast improvments

 

[YellowMP5]

I am a little skeptical about the tornado and the fact that you felt the difference. Sure they might be a difference but it would not be enough to feel it. But i could be wrong too.

 

[<Buck Rogers>]

The whole Tornado thing always sounded hokey to me, unless you had a big V-8 where you needed to get huge amounts of incoming air to turn a 90 at the carb/TB throat. Kind of like what the toilet does when you flush. I know different things work for different people, but come on "vast improvement"? If it were that good every OEM would be using them. Remember the magnets you could put on your fuel lines? They too incresed power and economy. Same idea - get rich quick.

 

[<Shawn>]

Tornado seems bad to me for this reason. Monsterflow Intake systems spent a lot of $$$ in R/D to make a filter that elliminates all air turbulence with the air going into the throttle. The filter has all these fancy blades in it to calm the air completely. A tornado does the exact opposite Monsterflow is very large and reputable. Whoever mades Tornado is more of an infomercial company where you see some cheezy commercial on TV.
It makes sense to me that calmer air will enter all the cylanders in equal amounts and thus give a smooth and equal combustion for every stroke of each cylander.

Also, if I strap on a hairblower to my intake and truely think it will make more power. I guarantee that I will "feel" more power when I drive. It is a simple psychological thing. Especially if you spent $75 on it.

 

[jcilforever]

To all of you who are unregistered Next time please read the whole post and feal free to ask questions.

 

[Shawn]

From work I don't log in so I must be unregistered. I', positive I read the whole post. I don't think where you position the unit will matter too much. I'm the magazine that tested it was very thorough. Using stock and aftermarket intakes. Regardless, my question still stands. Why does one company want to cease all turbulent air movement and another want to create it?

 

[<Buck Rogers>]

I read the whole post and I fully understand the concept of the CAI and Tornado, and really don't have any questions. But, I can speak from a pure engineering stand point with 20 years experience, and know in every situation you will get a greater volume of gas through a pipe if the flow is laminar. Under laminar flow conditions the viscous boundary layer along the walls of the pipe are minimized, and with that so is friction. Reducing friction increases velocity, and the higher the velocity the greater the volume flowed. Turning vanes are often used to redirect a gas flow around corners, just to maintain laminar flow downstream of the corner. But that's not the case with the Tornado. I’m sure you noticed the vanes on your mass air sensor when you put the CAI in, they’re there to ensure laminar flow across the sensor element. Also, notice how straight and “flowing” the bends are in the pipe work of the CAI to reduce turbulence.

Maybe in some cases, a big V8 for example, a vortex flow may reduce static pressure drop at the TB. But without flow bench testing it is truly a shot in the dark.

At any rate if you’re happy with a Tornado, that’s great. You’re a believer and have the faith. I just hate to see others, that may not know better, run out and get one for those “vast improvements”. Also, I can highly recommend statusing the MAP sensor before and after intake modifications. It will tell for sure if you managed to increase manifold static pressure or not. I too have an Injen CAI installed, it looks great, sounds good and reduces pressure drop at high RPMs. But the Pro5 doesn’t make much power at those RPMs (yet), and at normal driving speeds the Injen actually seemed to increase pressure drop as seen at the MAP. The OEM intake used resonance chambers to take advantage of the intake shock waves and maintain higher static pressure at normal RPM.

Would registering make me more creditable?

 

[jcilforever]

Buck
Sorry you have 10 years on me(5 in office and 5 in field) but, the whole issue is if it created a torque gain,in order to do this it would have to redirect airflow, also the turning vanes can create some resistance which can increase the static pressure. As you know the bends in the pipe can cause a Biased vector (crowding effect) and bring a non-uniformity to the flow. So when the flow stikes the 45 degree elbow from the pepindicular it will have a sizable flow slide. When you create a 45 or 90 degree tubular path flow can be greatly flawed in the way of distribution. Thus causing areas of lower density. For this reason I do not put that much emphasis on volume as much as ditribution.As far as the design of the Tornado uniformity is the key for proper distribution. Buck is right about wanting to get a laminar flow across the sensor element because as he knows you can not get a dependable reading with a non-stratifide flow, that is why the Tornado is mouted down stream to the sensor. (I cant believe I am going into this much detail about this). As for the pipe work it is not done for turbulence only, for the reason of the sensor, but actually for the greater reason of providing less resistance to airflow throught the whole travel.The effect of restrictivity of the vanes in the Tornado is minimal. Anyway I do agree that people should not just go out and buy something just because they saw a post, because who knows why they are posting and what there motives are. Mine were just purely for information and if anyone wanted to test it for themselves they would only lose 10 minutes of there time as the product comes with a money back guarantee.I did not taunt vast improvement, but who knows when I add a turbo or supercharger (some mods will have to be made to the CAI). As far as being registered it just shows a level of commitment to others about the cars we have chosen to own and spend time on improving! Also so we can get to know others that share the same interest.(the comment was more directed towards those who blast others). Thanks for the stimulated conversation

 

[twa]

With either addition of Supercharger or Turbo I'm afraid that the Tornado will only restrict performance from that point and you're more than likely going to need a completely new intake design as your intake manifold will be feeding from the intercooler and not the outside air with your Injen.

Thom

 

[jcilforever]

when I add a turbo or supercharger (some mods will have to be made to the CAI) That is what I posted. It is highly likley that the placement will have to be adjusted also mods will have to be made to the CAI.

Thom that's what is great about testing! and troubleshooting!

 

[Matt]

please jcilforever could you send a pic of what you did with the intake to
zx-2nr@superstreetonline.com

 

[jcilforever]

Sure but it might be a couple of days I have to take new pics as mine were deleted. I hope you like the other ones I sent you. Some positive feedback would be appreciated.

 

[Steve]

i undersand the whole concept of less turbulence=smoother flow...but don't you think you need some turbulence for proper ionazation of the fuel when it enters the cylinder? i mean, i hear thats part of the reason why people don't port&polish the last inch or so of the intake and exhaust port, you know, so the fuel can mix well with the air and burn easier and faster.