How-To: VTCS Removal and Porting
- Thread starter flat_black
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Black_Protege_5
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- Mazda Protege 5
Basically. All it really does is restrict a lot of airflow. On start up its not too different than before.But once it warms up and you hit the 5000k mark you can feel it. I won't say it pulls hard since its N/A but with turbo I am sure it will.
And yea I can help you remove it. Do you have an extra IM or you are just leaving your car there.
And yea I can help you remove it. Do you have an extra IM or you are just leaving your car there.
PlatinumMSP
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- Blazing Yellow 03.5 MSP
Black_Protege_5 said:
yeah i'll probably have to leave my car there for a week.... are you free this weekend?
Black_Protege_5
Member
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- Mazda Protege 5
Not sure. I think so like in the late afternoon this sat.
Alright, I did it this weekend and I have a quick question for those who've also done this. Has anyone else notice an overall drop in idle RPM? My idle is by no means erratic, nor does my car stall out but the RPMs do drop low at times before the car seems to "catch itself" and bring the RPM back up to 500 or so. For example, after driving about 15 miles with the A/C on, etc. the idle would drop to the 200-300 RPM range or lower at idle. It felt like the car was going to stall but it would just magically fix itself and bump up the RPM. The car did the same thing with VTCS still in there but just not as low. Just wondering if anyone else has noticed anything like this. I may just try to retorque some bolts while it's warmed up as I guess heat expansion could be causing a small vaccum leak - although I figure if it were a vacuum leak I would be stalling out...
Seems like ur having an EGR problem
go there
http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=94788&highlight=rough
this should help
the problem is not caused by the porting, by having it ported u prolly became more cautious about ur car so thats maybe one factor why it has increased. maybe also increasing the air volume makes the egr stick more also.
anyways u should be able to fix it easely.
go there
http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=94788&highlight=rough
this should help
the problem is not caused by the porting, by having it ported u prolly became more cautious about ur car so thats maybe one factor why it has increased. maybe also increasing the air volume makes the egr stick more also.
anyways u should be able to fix it easely.
You're probably right about the being conscious about my car more but I'm not sure if it's an egr thing. The idle isn't rough or erratic which I thought were symptoms of egr problems. It's just like my idle is lower by 100-200 RPM than what it used to be. Like it used to idle between 500 and 700 RPM but now it's more like 300 and 500 but it is smooth - oscillates up and down like normal, just lower. I just figured I either had a small vacuum leak (which doesn't seem so likely since I don't stall) or just the larger amount of air getting in is somehow causing it. I think I'll just check all my bolts when the engine is heated up since I torqued everything down after the car was down for 6 hours. Either way, I'm not too worried until I start stalling out - I guess I'll find out tonight in rush hour traffic...DarKrID3r said:Seems like ur having an EGR problem
go there
http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=94788&highlight=rough
this should help
the problem is not caused by the porting, by having it ported u prolly became more cautious about ur car so thats maybe one factor why it has increased. maybe also increasing the air volume makes the egr stick more also.
anyways u should be able to fix it easely.
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Black_Protege_5
Member
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- Mazda Protege 5
magnumP5 said:
Ha yea. It happened to me at first. Check all of the lines and make sure there are no leaks. Mine was coming from the throttle body. If everything is fine try removing the Neg terminal to reset everything then when you start up the car turn on almost every electical item. Turn your air full blast, headlights and anything else that uses power for about 5 mins. What this will do is make your ecu learn to the point that when you have your headlights and everything it nows hows to proper distribute power so it won't effect your idle. Plus when everything is off your car will stay around a perfect 800rpm and with air and lights it will be around 700 instead of the 200-300 you are getting now. If you need help with anything just pm me and I can help you out.
Black_Protege_5
Member
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- Mazda Protege 5
Also did you clean the egr while it was out?
No, I didn't. I had originally planned on it but it took over 6 hours to get it off and the other on - I was done with it. I just don't see how it would an egr issue if it ran fine before. Either way, from the egr fix thread I guess I can get the egr off without taking the IM off again? I guess this might be something I will be doing next weekend.Black_Protege_5 said:
For all those who did the vtcs removal, did you have to clean the egr afterwards as well? If so, how hard was it?
Black_Protege_5
Member
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- Mazda Protege 5
You don't have to but ppl say it helps. I did mine but my idle only improved a little. My only guess is a slight leak. The egr wouldn't cause that low of an idle.
Heh, I didn't catch this post. Well I never removed the lower IM so I shouldn't have a leak around the TB. I tried to make sure every bolt was tightened but I was afraid I would over torque one and then be screwed so maybe some have a little bit they can still go in. Is that wast caused your leak - just a bolt or nut that wasn't completely tight?Black_Protege_5 said:
For vacuum lines I'm pretty sure I checked everything and I even had two other people there to make sure. I figure that if a vacuum line were loose it probably would be stalling out a lot and I've yet to do so.
Also, about your "fix" how long has it been since you've done that? I have heard people have had their ecu's "reset" back to the lower idle rpm after a while.
Also, did you remove and clean your egr? Did it seem like it needed it because I thought that was mainly for the MSP guys. If you did it, did it seem to help?
EDIT: Anyone have torque specs for the IM bolts, both to the head and the bolts connecting the upper and lower halves?
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Black_Protege_5
Member
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- Mazda Protege 5
My EGR was dirty as hell. It took about 5 mins for the carb cleaner to stop coming out black.
I had one Vac line not connected and actually it didn't effect the idle at all. I did this about 3 months ago and the idle never lowered and it has actually been stable surprisingly.
Make sure all of the bolts are hand tight. They should be around 20lbs I believe (don't have my book with me). But you did use a new gasket for the lower tank?
My first leak was because I used silicone for my tb and there was a gap. So I put more of it and then it was fine.
I had one Vac line not connected and actually it didn't effect the idle at all. I did this about 3 months ago and the idle never lowered and it has actually been stable surprisingly.
Make sure all of the bolts are hand tight. They should be around 20lbs I believe (don't have my book with me). But you did use a new gasket for the lower tank?
My first leak was because I used silicone for my tb and there was a gap. So I put more of it and then it was fine.
I got a new gasket for the IM/head connection but I re-used the metal gasket between the upper and lower halves because it looked like it was fine (unlike the original head/Im gasket which was stuck to the upper half when I removed it). I guess I'll just have to check all my torques and then do that ecu reset thing and if it persists I guess an egr cleaning and maybe a new metal gasket down the road when my hands are healed...Black_Protege_5 said:
Black_Protege_5
Member
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- Mazda Protege 5
lol. Try removing the whole intake mani. Will make things a lot easier. If you need anymore info let me know.
Cool thanks. I looked up the manual at protege5.ugly.net and the torque specs look like 19-25 N m or 14-18 in lbf, those seem right? I guess I'll just check all the bolts and lines and then do the ecu thing you mentioned and hopefully that will help because I don't have the time to remove the whole thing again. Also, just to make sure, with the gasket, the side that has the little bump/ridge on it faces the IM and not the head, right? Thanks for all the help.Black_Protege_5 said:
Black_Protege_5
Member
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- Mazda Protege 5
Yea that is right with the gasket. And the torques seem right. Put them around 18lbs since its the old gasket to make sure it fully seals. If its not working after all of this let me know.
Small update. I checked all the bolts I could (without completely taking everything apart) and all bolts were torqued to 18 in lbf or more and I also did the ecu reset with all the accesories on. Unfortunately neither of these seemed to help so I am guessing I probably have a gasket issue. I tried power water all around the IM to see if I could locate any leaks (didn't have carb cleaner or anything) but I did not see any bubbling nor did the engine try to stall or anything. I think the leak is either where the upper IM connects to the lower IM or at the bottom of the IM where it connects to the head (places I could not test). I am going to stop by Mazda and buy a new metal gasket and replace the IM/head gasket again as well just in case I managed to rip it (some bolts were over-torqued). I'm going to try to clean the EGR as well although that shouldn't be the issue. I am also going to go to a shop and have them check it out once I have all the gaskets and hopefully they can help out with this.
The only other thing I think could be wrong is maybe I messed up the throttle cable or something when trying to put the upper half back on. It's funny because some times the idle runs fine and others it doesn't. Yesterday morning I thought it was going to stall out but yesterday afternoon it seemed almost normal. When I went out last night it barely stayed at 200 RPM with the clutch in but this morning it stayed right around 600 the whole time. I hate to say it but this might be something I'll have to take to Mazda (oh God)...
The only other thing I think could be wrong is maybe I messed up the throttle cable or something when trying to put the upper half back on. It's funny because some times the idle runs fine and others it doesn't. Yesterday morning I thought it was going to stall out but yesterday afternoon it seemed almost normal. When I went out last night it barely stayed at 200 RPM with the clutch in but this morning it stayed right around 600 the whole time. I hate to say it but this might be something I'll have to take to Mazda (oh God)...
flat_black
Member
200 rpm? Are you sure you're reading the tach right? The first tick mark, just above 0 rpm is actually 500 rpm, and your engine will stall below that, nearly without fail.
For that matter, the carb cleaner is done to see if there are any vacuum leaks. When you go over the manifold spot that may have a vac leak, the idle should jump up. Really, the gasket should be cleaned off, a new one should either be procured, or just use gasket sealer. Preferably copper or red. I used red personally.
For that matter, the carb cleaner is done to see if there are any vacuum leaks. When you go over the manifold spot that may have a vac leak, the idle should jump up. Really, the gasket should be cleaned off, a new one should either be procured, or just use gasket sealer. Preferably copper or red. I used red personally.
