Hands Down...Which ECU Mod is BEST???

[Speedy3]

Money isn't the issue. I want to buy the best controller I can buy to control boost, fuel, timing and possibly throttle. I want GUI's on my laptop and plug and play if possible. Which one is the best????

A guy at my local tuning shop told me HALTEC? was the way to go, but he was talking V6 and V8's. It looks like XEDE won't be PnP, but it still shows great results. I keep hearing about Cobb PnP coming soon, but know nothing about it. It seems everyone is using the CPE Standback right now, but I don't want to buy one then buy another later; I can wait.

Which is best, money aside?

 

[Falconx84]

cobble cobble.... completely rewrites the ECU.... do some searching on subie forums or read the 70 pages over @ mazda 3 forums under "latest info from cobb"

 

[numbnuts22715]

yeah, cobb will be my choice too.
probably one of the cheaper options as well... 700 bucks
You wont be able to tune it using your laptop until they release their streettuning software, should be at the end of this year or so... and itll be around 400 dollars i believe.

 

[Mid_Life_Crisis]

Definitely Cobb. With our cars you can't put a price on the ability to go in and change the maps in the CPU instead of faking it out. I can't wait to see what the accountant comes up with for our returns this year. I really want one of these.

 

[clos561]

wait for cp-e plug and play, the second gen is going to be for ms3 with throttle control

 

[laloosh]

wait for cp-e plug and play, the second gen is going to be for ms3 with throttle control

ive said it before and ill say it again.
reflash>piggy back

 

[subparpunk03]

Cobb is gonna be the best... but you can't just throw money at the problem... you're going to have to be a little patient until Cobb releases their tuning software for us. Its coming, you just have to wait!

I'm know people are seeing good gains with the cp-e piggyback system, but on an adaptive ecu, piggyback controllers are a pain in the ass.

Cobb is essentially a standalone ecu that just reuses the factory hardware... no wiring stuff in, and super easy to flash from stock to a different tune...

Its an incredibly badass unit with a LOT of neat features, just go read about it on subie forums or cobbs webpage.

CP-E is good, but seriously it won't hold a candle to the AP once all is said and done IMHO. Notice I said in my opinion. I just hate the idea of trying to tune something when there are constantly changing parameters.

 

[Mid_Life_Crisis]

Cobb is essentially a standalone ecu that just reuses the factory hardware... no wiring stuff in, and super easy to flash from stock to a different tune...

This is misleading for people unfamiliar with the AP. It is not a unit that is left connected to your car. You temporarily connect it to the car's ECU through the OBDII port and it saves the stock program to memory. Then it overwrites the factory settings with new ones. Disconnect the AP and put away someplace safe. You're done at that point. I think it has datalogging capabilities as well, but I'm not positive, so you might leave it connected to see exactly how well the new map is working, but you don't need to.
This is why the AP is so superior to interceptor type units. You aren't faking out the ECU, you are rewriting it, with the abilty to go back to stock at any time.

 

[subparpunk03]

Yup, thanks for the clarification.

I know it sounds like theres a lot of us cobb fanbois on this forum, but they really do make some pretty outstanding stuff.

It may not necessarily be the absolute best if you are looking for every single ounce of horsepower, or if you are looking for the absolute stiffest, most track ready suspension...

however if you want a daily driver with some BALLS to it that stays reliable... cobb FTW.

 

[Speedy3]

One other clarification to my original post. I already have datalogging software, so that function isn't part of my criteria for a tuning package. I currently use Auterra's Dyno-scan.

 

[mrlilguy157]

ive said it before and ill say it again.
reflash>piggy back

 

[Falconx84]

This is misleading for people unfamiliar with the AP. It is not a unit that is left connected to your car. You temporarily connect it to the car's ECU through the OBDII port and it saves the stock program to memory. Then it overwrites the factory settings with new ones. Disconnect the AP and put away someplace safe. You're done at that point. I think it has datalogging capabilities as well, but I'm not positive, so you might leave it connected to see exactly how well the new map is working, but you don't need to.
This is why the AP is so superior to interceptor type units. You aren't faking out the ECU, you are rewriting it, with the abilty to go back to stock at any time.

you can be done at that point, or you can keep it hooked up and run real-time maps, too. Theres so many possibilities with real time maps.... custom tune, valet mode, gas saver, anti-theft, factory map - the list goes on. And you can change them on the fly w/o a reflash.

Also, there's some talk about possibly adding launch control and flat-foot shift. They've done it for the subie crowd and are going to try to do it with the ms3. For those not familiar, it basically adds 2 extra rev limiters. You still have the reg limit, then you have one with the tranny in neutral and another when the clutch is in. And the last 2 you can set yourself.

Last, but not least, the ECU will still maintain the ability to learn, so this will help with altitude and temp variances. Instead of learning with factory settings, it will learn within cobb-defined settings

cobble

 

[Haltech]

Here is my experience...

First of all, ive never been impressed with anything Haltech has ever released. Infact, they stoled my name, but none the less, their ECU managment is so-so.

For a complete stand alone unit, you cannot beat the DFI. It is the preimo standard as a management system. However, this isnt an option for a daily driver. SO, that now goes out the window.

Than you have the piggy back systems. You have the CPE or Xede. Neither can take control of the computer. They are bandaid solutions to our tuning issues. Before someone tried to come in here and slam me for saying this, ill give you an explantion.

When the computer adds timing when you are specifically requesting it not to do so, you dont have control. Not only is that dangerous, but adds a false sense of security to the situation. There are other minor issues covered in many threads about each of the systems that dont need to be posted here. Bottom line, its not the correct course to take when you decide to go for higher power levels and expect the engine to live.

Lastly, Reflashes. In my experience, this is the best alternative. You are taking the original program, modifiying the values, and uploading it back into the ECU. There is no interception of any signals and the cpu pretty much does exactly what you tune it for. Its easier to install and uninstall and generally, leaves no traces of its exsistance. Most companies offering these reflashes have some kind of pro-racer software so you can do your own personal tuning instead of using lightly modded ones. Either way, its win win for the beginner, to the heavy modder.

 

[SPEED305]

^^^makes sense

 

[palerider]

Im using my standback as a boost controller. Plus... for basically one car payment, I get to adjust a little here and there in the meantime.

An interesting question would be this...

What if we bought the Cobb and reflashed the ECU. could we still reasonably adjust things here and there with the standback down the road as well?

The Cobb reflashes are going to be VERY basic initially and I'll bet its months or another year before we can actually do our own tuning with the street tuner. protuners will be hard to find in some areas and expensive as well. there really is no gaurantee that we'll ever get a street tuner as long as the AP has taken anyway....

I see no reason why a Cobb tune with a second generation CPE unit for tweaking....wouldnt be the best longterm solution.

 

[mrlilguy157]

not a bad idea randy. i have thought of this, and i don't see why it wouldn't work. i would run stock CP-E maps and get used to what the COBB AP does and feels like, before toying with anything.

it could work really well, or really terribly.

 

[subparpunk03]

intriguing....

I'm very curious now

 

[Mid_Life_Crisis]

I'm thinking it would have the same problem we have with the stock maps in place. If all they change are the maps, the AP won't work. The AP is going to have to change ALL the values stored in the computer. This means the "target" levels it expects to see at the various sensors, as well as the baseline maps. I doubt you can stop the ECU from "learning" and adapting. To make it work, you'll need to change what it thinks is correct, the targets. After that, to get it capable of generating those results, you need to change its base maps. So if you reload with the AP, and then try to change things with a piggyback, the ECU should do exactly what it does now, and try to change things to produce what it wants to see, which is the new Cobb values.

 

[killerMS3]

Im using my standback as a boost controller.
I see no reason why a Cobb tune with a second generation CPE unit for tweaking....wouldnt be the best longterm solution.

i have thought about this as well. CP-E is going to be doing some other things with their standback as well, which should be very interesting and awesome. I understand the limitations of using a piggyback, but there are limitations as to what a flash can do as well. so why not marry the two solutions together?

and if i'm wrong about this, please correct me. but if my buddy buys a COBB AP, can i use it too to flash my car?

 

[laloosh]

each ap unit is married to an ecu and only that ecu. lol its not that easy