GI : Intake Manifold for NA

[twilightprotege]

well a mate and I have been thinking that along with the brake ducting and front tray downforce (see my sig for the link), that another possible in-demand item would be a intake manifold.

I wont go into too many details yet, but it will be designed for NA (can be used for FI, but primarily NA), will keep the VICS setup and convert into a true dual runner design and will be designed to enhance peak power greatly from 6000rpm-6500rpm. other ranges can be calculated and made as a special request.

hopefully a price wont be too expensive as it will be designed to use stock fuel rail, injectors, intake, throttle body etc...

Early in the new year I will be designing it and starting to play around with it.

 

[scorch70]

well a mate and I have been thinking that along with the brake ducting and front tray downforce (see my sig for the link), that another possible in-demand item would be a intake manifold.

I wont go into too many details yet, but it will be designed for NA (can be used for FI, but primarily NA), will keep the VICS setup and convert into a true dual runner design and will be designed to enhance peak power greatly from 6000rpm-6500rpm. other ranges can be calculated and made as a special request.

hopefully a price wont be too expensive as it will be designed to use stock fuel rail, injectors, intake, throttle body etc...

Early in the new year I will be designing it and starting to play around with it.

Im interested Twilight, if it can show measurable gains. And it isnt too expensive (4-500 bucks maybe?). Keep us posted.

 

[Super Matty P]

only a 500rpm powerband? I'd LOVE to see this come out but you have to make a better rpm range than just 500rpms.

Put me down as heavily interested, pending price and gains....

p.s. this will also be used on my supercharger kit if that affects anything....it shouldn't since the supercharger compresses the air in itsself.

 

[Dimitrios]

What's your initial manifold material thoughts? I've seen very, very few manifolds that were made of sheet metal and didn't suck ass.

Plan to keep all the VTCS and other items or modify those at all?

 

[ogsp5]

Good luck! What type of design are you guys thinking of? Log (tri-piont racing) or the one that is shown on Essential Speed. Keep us up dated(cool) (birthday)

 

[twilightprotege]

i hope it wont be too expensive either...i'd like to get it on my car for cheap and beable to sell it cheap too!

matty - that's just where the power will be focused. I will be keeping the VICS so there should be a power increase from around 4000 to redline, but will hopefully (with testing) yield a greatly improved 6000+ figure.

material - 100% aluminium. gotta save weight! and ALL manifold items will remain. this will be a straight bolt on mod and NO CEL's

style - log style, however, it'll be nothing like what you've seen before for our cars. my brain has been ticknig away with this for ages! with me wanting to keep the VICS, i'll actually be saving a lot of money and development time! i have two main designs in mind, testing will determine which style is used

in terms of testing. obviously 1 will be on my car, so that will probably show more gains than most. one will be on my mate's car - a 1.8L with obx, injen cai and full exhaust. hopefully a further one will be on a 2L with injen, awr header and 2.25" exhaust. that should give a good range of what to expect. we will be testing various pipe work sizing so we can be sure we're getting the best results. also, that'll allow us to do slightly more custom jobs...ie if someone wants all the power from 6500 and up we can do that. if someone wants a torque monster, we can do that too.

the only downside to the design that i'm thinking of is the VICS activation point. the model sold will be designed to work with the stock cross over point as closely as possible, but if you're wanting something different, you will need to be able to adjust the vICS.

 

[flat_black]

Awesome, man. =) I've got some layover ideas from around before I was starting the IRTB setup, so if you want some suggestions, or anything, I'd be glad to try and help, too!

 

[xelderx]

Keep us posted Twilight. I'm getting ready to port and do the VTCS removal on my spare manifold. If it looks resonable I might try and do the dual runner mod that was talked about in other threads where the VICS is changed to a true runner setup. i'd be interested to see what you come up with here.

 

[twilightprotege]

as soon as i start to develop it and test it out i'll be more than happy to show it off. i'm just really curious now as to which degisn that i'm thinking of will yield the most power, and where...

i'm excited!

 

[twilightprotege]

update - i have two designs in mind at the moment. i have the figures worked out for the runner length and diametre etc. at present, around 5 manifolds will be made up for testing and dyno work to see which design works best and where. that will lead on to design tweaking and into 2 manifolds for final testing and dyno work.

at the moment its just a matter of taking the stock manifold off, doing some measurements, then all the details will be fed into a CAD program and the fun will begin shortly after.

 

[wagonwhatmp5]

im deff intrested keep us posted

 

[xelderx]

update - i have two designs in mind at the moment. i have the figures worked out for the runner length and diametre etc. at present, around 5 manifolds will be made up for testing and dyno work to see which design works best and where. that will lead on to design tweaking and into 2 manifolds for final testing and dyno work.

at the moment its just a matter of taking the stock manifold off, doing some measurements, then all the details will be fed into a CAD program and the fun will begin shortly after.

I have an extra stock manifold laying around if you want me to get you some measurements so you don't have to remove yours.

 

[twilightprotege]

thanks for the offer, i may take you up on that. i'll see how well i can get measurements for the room available and i'll let you know.

my no 1 priority at the moment (not power wise) is the location of the stock TB. I want it to be in the same position as stock so we dont have to get new intake pipe work. also, i'd like to utilise the stock intake manifold mounting bracket for extra strength if possible.

 

[flat_black]

Spacing, from head to the firewall in a straight (diagonal, since that's how the manifold mates to the head) line is 12.5", the stock manifold is aproximatly 10.5"-11" long, and that's about how long I'm going to make my ITB's... 11.5", so I'm really stretching it. We'll see how that works, though. Any way you can post basics of your ideas? =)

 

[gino]

Andrew, great interest here. Way to go, mate! Looking forward to progress.

 

[mp3moose]

Always up for NA fun. And 4K-6k is just where I need power.

 

[twilightprotege]

yeah the interest is really promising! looking good!

now i'll explain 1 of the ideas i am thinking of. it will sound very simple, but you will all realise just how much potential it has...and because of it's design...will be much cheaper than a complete IM. the other idea will remain a secret at the moment as its even more simple, yet appears to have more benefits.

so.

the stock manifold is in two parts, an upper and lower half. both plans are to replace the bottom half of the IM.

design 1 is a true dual runner design (well below the top half of the IM). the low rpm runner (primary) will be basically the same as stock. same length, diam and sort of shape. the high rpm runner (secondary) will be what the VICS controls (which is why i want to keep the VICS). VICS will open the butterflys and the seconardy pipes will go directly to the plenum. it will not be a chamber like the stock setup. this has many benefits as you can guess. far more oxygen above the vics activation point, much shorter air path from the plenum to the engine, more power!. obviously there will be velocity stacks inside the plenum to help increase air speed. as an offshoot to this, i will try as small runners as possible on the primaries and lower the vics activation point so the seconardy runners are used sooner, ie below the rpm point where you change gears when going to redline in every gear. this is all in the testing. the plenum volume will require a fair bit of testing too. i will try as small as physically possible and up.

i have so many questions which all require answers only testing can answer. and i wont give up when i have a resonable gain to show. i want the most gain possible which i'm sure all of you do as well! there is certainly a lot of testing and devel to go on here, but i hope to have the IM ready for your summer at the latest.

 

[twilightprotege]

comments?

 

[mp3moose]

I thought the longer, stock runners were long and decreased in diameter as they got closer to the head in order to produce a vortex inside each runner. Is this correct? and if so, why would shorter runners allow more air?

 

[twilightprotege]

yes the stock runners are long which is good for low rpm power, which is why i'm wanting to keep the VICS system in place. in terms of more air, instead of the current system where the air still travels on the same path when going to the engine, it will be made shorter, direct from the plenum, through the VICS butterflys and direct to the head. this will yield more air as there will be velocity stacks on the runners in the plenum and also, traveling along a far less restrictive path (until the top half of the plenum...see below) will yield more air. also, the runners will be a specific length to take advantage of sound wave ram air effects which can in some engines and designs act like 1-2psi of boost! i dont think i'll be able to get it that good, but i certainly will try my hardest! attached is a very simple design so you can see what i mean. the new IM part is the black, the old is the red. you can see on the old setup, the VICS butterflys only opened a chamber and went no where. I intend to have that path going directly to the plenum. you'll see just how long the stock runners are, not forgetting they are this long for high rpm too! the shorter runners should give a very decent gain when the VICS butterflys open.

so why am I wanting to only replace the bottom half of the IM? VICS & cost. you'll have a stock IM feel engine below the VICS activation point then you'll have a rocket.

an assumption of this IM idea is that you have a port matched with the head top half of the IM (pretty easy to do)