Engine Differences...

[JrTekSilverP5]

whats the difference between the MSP, MP3 and P5 engines... i know they have differences with the computers but... im talkin str8 engines... whats the difference... are there any internals in the MSP engine...

 

[ATLskate]

MSP: Turbo charged(obviously), larger injectors

MP3: advanced timing

P5: same engines, just no perfomance advantages

That's about all i can think of w/o the ECU other than that it's pretty much the same engine

 

[Action Jackson]

It might be interesting to see if blueprinting the engines can make any significant gains.

 

[perfworks]

MSP: Turbo charged(obviously), larger injectors

MP3: advanced timing

P5: same engines, just no perfomance advantages

That's about all i can think of w/o the ECU other than that it's pretty much the same engine

sorry this is not all correct
They are completely and utterley the same engines in side and out
The injectors are ALL the same. 280cc's
Your right the MSP has a turbo charged set up and the MP3 has silghtly more aggresive timing

 

[Mackdaddy]

sorry this is not all correct
They are completely and utterley the same engines in side and out
The injectors are ALL the same. 280cc's
Your right the MSP has a turbo charged set up and the MP3 has silghtly more aggresive timing

Not to get off subject, but does the MP3 ECU (opposed to a P5) use a more aggressive fuel map? Or is it strictly ignition timing?

Thanks,
Jim

 

[twilightprotege]

mackdaddy, if you're thinking of swapping ecu's, dont bother with the mp3 ecu. spend a little more money and get a haltec, motec etc ecu and then you'll really get the full benefit out of the engine.

and perfworks is right, all engines are the same (except mine because i'm in australia - we get 9.4:1 comp pistons)...the mp3 gets advanced timing through the ecu

later

 

[blackp5ca]

I believe the MP3 Engine has no VTCS system in the intake manifold...although I could be wrong. This offers no perf increase just no cold rattle....I think?

 

[Mackdaddy]

I believe the MP3 Engine has no VTCS system in the intake manifold...although I could be wrong. This offers no perf increase just no cold rattle....I think?

You are correct. No VTCS in the MP3 (or MSP for that matter.)

Supposed to "tumble" the air charge for a better burn at cold start, add drivability as well. I've had mine disconnected for 5 months, no ill effects (perf wise.)

 

[Mackdaddy]

mackdaddy, if you're thinking of swapping ecu's, dont bother with the mp3 ecu. spend a little more money and get a haltec, motec etc ecu and then you'll really get the full benefit out of the engine.

and perfworks is right, all engines are the same (except mine because i'm in australia - we get 9.4:1 comp pistons)...the mp3 gets advanced timing through the ecu

later

This is my daily, so a stand-alone is out for now.... trying to keep it fairly tame for warranty's sake.)

An MP3 ECU would be great for the additional 10HP. I've already got catback/CAI, and should see my AWR header this week. Also have the J-spec intake cam yet to install. I think the MP3 ECU (or GReddy Emanage) would really bring these goodies alive.

Thanks,
Jim

 

[perfworks]

Not to get off subject, but does the MP3 ECU (opposed to a P5) use a more aggressive fuel map? Or is it strictly ignition timing?

Thanks,
Jim

more aggresive ignition timing to be used according to manufactures recomendations of premium fuel. the p5 and others like the dx 's can run low grade.
thats the only difference and yes except for the VTCS plates that took effect in 2002 for ALL models.

 

[perfworks]

You are correct. No VTCS in the MP3 (or MSP for that matter.)

Supposed to "tumble" the air charge for a better burn at cold start, add drivability as well. I've had mine disconnected for 5 months, no ill effects (perf wise.)

Mack every protege manufactured in 2002+ has the dreaded VTCS for emmision purposes , including the MSP

 

[perfworks]

It might be interesting to see if blueprinting the engines can make any significant gains.

the tolerances in the FS motor from my pro5 were very tight. on the mark actually when i took in apart with 6900 miles. All the way from the crank to the head

 

[Mackdaddy]

Thanks, Perfworks.

I didn't realize the MPS had the VTCS plates as well.

Amazing they get +10hp (albeit @ the crank) with just a bit of timing advance. I still want one!

Take care,
Jim

 

[Traveler]

They didn't get 10 HP at the crank with just the ignition timing. Flying Protege tested the ECU's back to back and only got around 3.5-4HP from the ECU swap. The rest is in the intake. It's actually more like 4 more HP for the intake. The motor is closer to 8 HP more than a P5. That was complained about by several members when they dynoed their MP3's.

 

[JrTekSilverP5]

You are correct. No VTCS in the MP3 (or MSP for that matter.)

Supposed to "tumble" the air charge for a better burn at cold start, add drivability as well. I've had mine disconnected for 5 months, no ill effects (perf wise.)

how do u disconnect it... and what is the difference of having it disconnected...

 

[Mackdaddy]

They didn't get 10 HP at the crank with just the ignition timing. Flying Protege tested the ECU's back to back and only got around 3.5-4HP from the ECU swap. The rest is in the intake. It's actually more like 4 more HP for the intake. The motor is closer to 8 HP more than a P5. That was complained about by several members when they dynoed their MP3's.

Well, if that be the case, I'd have to invest in both the MP3 ECU, and upper intake manifold. Still feasible, but pricey for the gain.

So much for that idea...

Thanks,
Jim

 

[Mackdaddy]

how do u disconnect it... and what is the difference of having it disconnected...

Disconnect the vaccum hose from the VTCS solenoid and plug both ends. No more cold engine rattle in the morning. AFAIK, the only negative effect is slighly higher cold start emissions.

Pic

 

[JrTekSilverP5]

uh... exactly which hoses r those... can u circle um or something...

 

[Mackdaddy]

uh... exactly which hoses r those... can u circle um or something...

The VTCS solenoid is the one on the left (as your facing the engine.) If you look at this pic, it's a bit easier to see. It's capped off with a black plastic plug (actually, two of them.)

 

[twilightprotege]

hey

ok you're gonna have to all help me on this one, but where exactly do those vacuum pipes go? i ask because my engine bay is different to that above....and if it's like that, yippy yippy yay, i dont have vcts...i dont have either solenoid on the back of the intake manifold, but i do have one off to the left where you guys dont. i'm guessing the aussie mp5 only have vics

later