Amp with stock speakers?

[sss37]

It has been discussed many times before on this forum, but I have searched and haven't found my question asked specifically:
I have the non-Bose 4 speaker stock stereo. Would sound quality improve if I added a 4x60W amp without upgrading the speakers? I've read all of the other posts discussing speaker upgrades, but I'm really not interested in changing the speakers. For my use, the stock speakers have good enough quality when the volume is low, but if the volume goes up much there is a lot of distortion. Would simply adding an amp help allow for more volume with less distortion on the stock speakers?
Thanks

 

[dtarlo]

YES, and to set the record straight, for everyone out there, adding an amplifier to a stock radio with stock speakers is a BETTER investment than new speakers. Distortion kills speakers not volume. The order you should upgrade is, Amp, Head Unit, Speakers. The reasoning (before i get a bunch of questions is this) if you upgrade speakers you are still using the same low powered, minimal control radio to power nicer speakers, if you add a new radio it is still a better investment than speakers because it gives you a higher amplifier (in the radio) and more control over your sound. Now if you add an amplifier which you need for nicer sound in the long run it gives you a much finer control and power for your speakers, as I mentioned in another post, OEM still make paper cone speakers because they DO work, beleive it or not they sound very nice if powered correctly. Sorry to ramble on, I'll shut up now.

 

[tsunami]

i would suggest a 4ch amp and sound deadening in the doors... on my 04 i just deadened the doors (preparing for my install) and with completely stock system (non bose) it made a world of difference my roomate even said my new "system" sounded good....

 

[sss37]

Thank you!

 

[chuyler1]

If you have a very tight budget, you will notice the greatest improvement in sound and volume by upgrading your head unit. The factory unit puts out about 5w RMS. An aftermarket will put out 15-20w RMS of clean sound. This is more than enough to clean up the messy sound response you've been hearing while not being too much for your factory speakers.

You will notice an immediate increase in bass as well as smother midrange. The highs will still be dull lifeless and often harsh but that is because factory speakers use a whizzer cone to produce highs instead of a separate tweeter....and they're made out of cheap paper.

Now you could also go the route of installing an external amp but in most cases this will be too much for your factory speakers AND you need to account for installing the wiring kit and getting the signal from the factory deck to the amplifier. Many amps have speaker-level inputs which are nice, but you will be amplifying a signal that has already been amplified by the crappy stock headunit chip amp. It will be louder...but it won't sound better.

 

[tsunami]

my 2004 2.3s had 6 speakers... 2 tweets mounted where the mirrors are and 4 door speakers i never took a look at the seperate tweeters i just disconnected them when i put in my own speakers, are these paper whizzers as well??

 

[chuyler1]

No, they are mylar or something cheap. They help out with the high frequencies but get very harsh when turned up.

I was actually happy with my stock Protege5 6-speaker stereo for about 3 months. Then I sat in a car that had a real system (my wife's car...which I installed). After being without my aftermarket gear for 3 months that was all it took to rip all the stock gear out and do a complete upgrade.

 

[voiceKoil]

I agree its all in what your used to. Factory sound isnt bad until you hear something better.....Thats basically how everything in life is come to think of it......You will have to be carful amplifing the stock speakers....They dont handle much power at all, the rear speakers in the speed3 are marked 25w, I dont know about the fronts yet but thats not a good sign....If anything just getting a small amp and also an external crossover would be your best bet so you could atleast tune it to sound its best. An amp that you can tune great by itself will most likely have too much power and fry your speakers, but you could turn it all the way down. You could try though and buy new ones if they do blow...and atleast you would have an amp to power the new ones, and it wouldnt be hard to install them, the wire is the hard part to install, 4 screws to take out the speaker is the easy part...and youll need a Line Output Converter to run Rcas to your amp from the factory Headunit. You dont want to run high level inputs from the speakers all the way to your amp, then back to your speakers, too many wires and it wouldnt sound great.

 

[dtarlo]

again as someone who installs every day, an amp is a better investment than a head unit. A aftermarket head unit DOES NOT put out 15-25w continuous (read the package even of the one you have) a good unit, Eclipse, Alpine, Pioneer, etc. will put out between 8.5-14A continuous and the upper range only in optimum conditions. As far as the tweeters, as long as you used the stock wiring behind the radio (not in the doors) the tweeters will most likely be in use as they are in line behind or parallell with the mids in the door.

 

[chuyler1]

I disagree. For a single point upgrade (lets say $150-200 or less total cost), an aftermarket head unit provides more than enough power to improve the output of stock speakers without destroying them and it has a frequency response much greater than the stock unit while also outputing a flat signal throughout its volume range. You also get a cleaner signal to work with when you add amplifiers later (assuming the unit has at least one set of pre-outs).

Adding just an amp IMO is a close second. You get more power but your stock speakers cannot handle it. Hopefully you get one that has speaker-level inputs and a high-pass crossover so that you can quickly connect it to the factory system and cut out the stock-speaker-damaging low frequencies. But even with the added power and flexibility you still have to deal with the poor signal quality and frequnecy response that you get from speaker-level-outputs and/or a line out converter paired with the factory stereo. Additionally, your volume control is funky because the factory system usually incorporates some sort of EQ/boost at low levels but doesn't really increase in output at high levels. The result is a very sensitive volume range where at low levels you get poor frequency response and at high levels you get harsh distorted sound. You basically have to put the head unit volume dead center and then set the amp gain at the level you usually listen at. So adding the amp is only beneficial if a) you just want more bass and plan to connect it to a subwoofer or b) you plan to upgrade the head unit and speakers eventually...but if you are going to do that...just buy the head unit first and save the amp for later.

 

[dtarlo]

Amps do not increase volume, they clean signal and distortion. Speakers are killed by distortion not volume. Stock speakers can easily handle the power and volume, in fact they are paper coated with mylar in most cases, same as most cheap (low end) speakers, this includes kenwood, pioneer, etc.

 

[chuyler1]

stock spekaers can easily be destroyed by over excursion...which is easily caused by too much power being sent to them. You won't melt the voice coil..but you'll end up with flapping bass in no time. Sometimes the surround breaks free and sometimes the cone itself will rip apart.

 

[voiceKoil]

again as someone who installs every day, an amp is a better investment than a head unit. A aftermarket head unit DOES NOT put out 15-25w continuous (read the package even of the one you have) a good unit, Eclipse, Alpine, Pioneer, etc. will put out between 8.5-14A continuous and the upper range only in optimum conditions. As far as the tweeters, as long as you used the stock wiring behind the radio (not in the doors) the tweeters will most likely be in use as they are in line behind or parallell with the mids in the door.

The Rated Power for the Alpine CDE-9852 is 16w @ 4ohms x 4 @14.4v Figure your car runs at about 13.2v, You should have about 12-14watts of continous power @ a typical 4ohms, which the stock speakers run at, its a decent cd player for a Msrp of $200, so anything else in that area should run about the same, not 8.5, unless your running at 12v, then you need a new battery or alternator I dont install "everyday" but I know my $hit, and everytime I go into bestbuy or circuitcity and talk to an "installer" about a part, they dont know dickweed, I had to ask 3 different installers for a line out converter alone, I had to talk to the head of the install bay to have someone understand what I was talking about. Not saying you dont know anything, but because you do it everyday doesent mean you know everything.


But Its a good idea because it will clean up the sound...and you are also right about Distortion killing speakers.. But who would want to power the stockers, They cant respond like a decent pair of speakers, and LOOK AT THE DIFFERENCE in my components vs stock.....Do what I did, replace the speakers and get an amp for them....Im running a stock HU and it sounds great with NO distortion, but that has to do with how you wire it aswell...

Arc Audio 5150 5ch Amp
Kicker Ks6.2 rear, havent decided on fronts yet
Kicker L5 10 kicker ported box installed, might swap with my sealed Eclipse.

It is a great improvement over stock....In dash Nav and Dvd down the road.

 

[amsgator]

alright i'm thinking about gettin the pioneer deh-p6800mp but what is a good amp. How many watts will i need for an amp if i dont hvae subs yet?

 

[jeffhawn]

Amps

Phoenix Gold - which is out of business [kind of] makes solid high end amps..

PPi is another one that I have had great success with.

Clarion is another brand to look out for...

If you are running you mids and highs from the amp - look for frequenct and gain adjustment on both front and rear channels.

RUN from Sony and Kenwood and the likes.

If you happen to come across a "Linear Power" amp [it will be used] DON'T buy it! Call me and let me know where it is. [*insane laughter*]

As far as watts are concerned - get the whatever the max rms your speaker can handle is...!

 

[dark3]

i had the stock speakers with a db drive 4 channel 300watt amp and it sounde kick ass, i just spliced the wires that went to the wire harness to four wires and ran them straight to the amp but gonna have to adjust the equalizer on the amp and have to be careful also when splicing, dont want to connect a negative with a positive, and or get feedback

 

[clos561]

jsut get a 80wx4 head unit.....stock output is usually garbage.....

 

[Mocoso]

Three questions:
1. Does anyone really know what the stock power output is? in RMS
2. All the quotes about the "higher end" head units putting out 14 Watts, etc.. is that peak or RMS? (Im still of the camp that an amp, then speakers, then head unit)...
3. How many speakers does the MS3 have - I thought it was 6 (including the tweaters in the side mirror area) or are those just there for looks and reserved for the grand touring bose upgraded system? (or rather downgraded depending on your love/hate of bose)

 

[amsgator]

#2. it says which it is. it usually says RMS and the Peak. I know most of the pioneers are 22W RMS, not sure about peak.

 

[Az Mazda Driver]

to answer ur third question there are 4 speakers and 2 tweeters. however when i was replacing my speakers and tweeters they werent much more than cardboard so the tweeters dont do a whole lot, but the speakers were alright.