200hp naturally aspirated. Is it possible?

[jonlong]

I am considering getting a turbo, but I was also wondering if it is possible to get a P5 (5spd manual) to 200hp without forced induction or nitrous. What do you think?

 

[Mike R]

Yes, but it won't be very streetable, or last long. There was a Loooooong thread about it not too long ago.

FYI, it's been done many times....Speed Channel Touring Cars....250Hp~8000rpm

 

[twilightprotege]

yeah there was a long thread a little while ago, but 200hp at the engine shouldnt be that difficult. 200whp, that's another story.

i hope to be the first 150whp NA P5 shortly....stay tuned...

 

[akhilleus]

damn i got to get that cam and header + dyno so i can be there first

 

[Turbo Matty P]

you guys may be the first.....but I've got plans of my own.....here's a hint (although an easy one) 2.4L 10.1:1......see you guys at the track.

 

[Replica]

A stroker would be fun.

 

[Turbo Matty P]

all I'll need is fuel/timing controll. I hope to pick up the AEM this month and then I'm going to have wagner build the shortblock for me. Once it's done I'm going to start tuning the piss out of the stock block.....see what it'll hold before blowing.

 

[Replica]

I've heard nothing but bad things about AEM EMS from the Honda guys...Speed Pro or Haltech is what everyone seems to like.

 

[Turbo Matty P]

The hardware is universal across the board. The tuning is what makes or breaks EMS. From my own independent research the AEM is one of the best I've seen as far as amount of control and total options available (can you say "built in dyno"?)

Also, for what I'm doing I'm really only going to need fuel control, ignition control, VICS control, traction control, continuously variable ignition timing (not cam timing) and possibly n20 retard.

I'm thinking that if this motor is strong enough for it I'll give it some squeeze to help it along. My goal is a 13s NA Protege. I should mention full interior also.

 

[AZDriftR]

like twilight said "at the engine" but a 200 WHP n/a protege is just a grenade!
so if u wanna really move...go F/I...cuz if u aint blowin, u aint goin..

 

[Turbo Matty P]

You don't think a stroker motor with high compression can yield 200whp?? wow. I come from the 2.3L ford circle and there are guys there running stock displacement with forged internals and high compression (11:1) and they are easily hitting over 200whp. I figure with my stroker/forged motor and a full host of bolt-ons (wagner header/exhaust, perfworks cams, intake, AEM ecu) I'll be running near 220hp. This is only about 91.6hp/liter which is very attainable. My 1990 Ford taurus had a stock motor making 78hp/liter. I think the S2K makes something like 100hp/liter...it can be done.

 

[Replica]

You don't think a stroker motor with high compression can yield 200whp?? wow. I come from the 2.3L ford circle and there are guys there running stock displacement with forged internals and high compression (11:1) and they are easily hitting over 200whp. I figure with my stroker/forged motor and a full host of bolt-ons (wagner header/exhaust, perfworks cams, intake, AEM ecu) I'll be running near 220hp. This is only about 91.6hp/liter which is very attainable. My 1990 Ford taurus had a stock motor making 78hp/liter. I think the S2K makes something like 100hp/liter...it can be done.

Even with a high compression stroker, I don't think you'll see 200whp. The FS-DE head flows like ass....(sssh)

 

[Mike R]

Even with a high compression stroker, I don't think you'll see 200whp. The FS-DE head flows like ass....(sssh)

I'd think the FS has a good bit of potential. There just hasn't (from what I've seen) much being done with the FS in the aftermarket and tuning. It's just recently that a few people are actually trying to push this motor and find out what it can do.

Wow, the Ford 2.3L OHC turns 30 this year. Neat. It was my favorite motor until I met P*&^ B3@&$% and purchased one of his projects....the rest, as they say it history!

 

[Turbo Matty P]

the 2.3L OHC ford motor is amazing....stock bottom end is bullit proof and can handle boost like crazy.

I think the FS-DE head is a limiting factor but not at 200hp. The problem with this motor is the weak internals and the poor tuning. Just bumping the displacment should be good for 30hp. Also, I'm only trying to get 90hp or so over a stock 2.0L....add in the intake, full exhaust, stage 2 cams, AEM ecu, and an extra 20% displacement and 200hp is EASY.

 

[Replica]

the 2.3L OHC ford motor is amazing....stock bottom end is bullit proof and can handle boost like crazy.

I think the FS-DE head is a limiting factor but not at 200hp. The problem with this motor is the weak internals and the poor tuning. Just bumping the displacment should be good for 30hp. Also, I'm only trying to get 90hp or so over a stock 2.0L....add in the intake, full exhaust, stage 2 cams, AEM ecu, and an extra 20% displacement and 200hp is EASY.

90hp is ALOT to ask of cams, exhaust and tuning!(sssh)

 

[Mr. Win]

matty your crazy!

 

[Turbo Matty P]

Crazy like a fox dude! I just want it to look like a stock motor with intake and exhaust, but turn times like an STi on the track. I'm not asking much am I?


90hp isn't a lot when you take into consideration the LARGE increase in displacement (20% larger engine....20% more power thats an automatic 26hp), the huge increase in CR from 9.1:1 to 11:1, removal of the entire emissions system and loss of all tuning to keep the protege a ULEV (ultra-low emissions vehicle), and the cams will be a LARGE gain. I don't think cam profiles have been changed on this motor since 1995.

 

[Mr. Win]

yea the tuff part is the money, whats its going to cost you? Theres alot of money to get where you want to go trust me ive done the cost. The only way to run those piston is to get the motor to 2.3 and those custom ground cams are gonna make you car so loud i hope that its streetable and that the aem has two diffrent setting for day time to race track i dunno. one thing that may help is wagners endless resources with je and pauter and so on.

 

[Replica]

Crazy like a fox dude! I just want it to look like a stock motor with intake and exhaust, but turn times like an STi on the track. I'm not asking much am I?


90hp isn't a lot when you take into consideration the LARGE increase in displacement (20% larger engine....20% more power thats an automatic 26hp), the huge increase in CR from 9.1:1 to 11:1, removal of the entire emissions system and loss of all tuning to keep the protege a ULEV (ultra-low emissions vehicle), and the cams will be a LARGE gain. I don't think cam profiles have been changed on this motor since 1995.

The more displacement, the less power per cubic inch it makes. I'm not sure I understand this 20% bigger engine = set amount of power. Also, isn't one full point of compression only like 4% gain?

 

[Turbo Matty P]

Senor, I don't think volume will be aproblem...I think the loping idle may be a give away though. Also, I plan on going to 2.4L using specs from the SRT-4 motor. it started it's life as a 2.0L with a long stroke added to it. I want to check their specs first. Rods and pistons will cost me the same as generic forged pieces. I'm worried about having to change the crank. I'm hoping not though.

Replica, I saw an equation somewhere that .1 displacement increase (on a 2.0L motor) was worth about 5% of the total HP. So for us a .4 increase would yield about 32hp. This sounds about right.