Now with the CX-70 "revealed", what is everyone buying?

[markfm]

I was a little torqued when the CX-70 dropped as it necessitated the X5 40i MSport which cost me probably $16K more than I would have spent otherwise. But after life with the BMW B58 3.0l inline 6 all I can say is I'm glad it worked out this way. This think can be quite pedestrian if you choose, but once you put your foot down it scoots bringing 400HP and 398lb-ft of torque to bear through a lighting quick ZF 8 speed (even though it is a torque converter instead of a dual clutch). 0-60 is 5.3s.

I am so engaged by this motor I am trying to decide if I will add to my Supercharged ND Miata with a M340i with the same B58 at 1200lbs less weight or replace my ND with a 2025 6SP Manual Z4 with that same B58 at 1650lbs less weight than the X5.

Yes, it sounds like you have exactly the right car for you

We should be test driving a Nautilus tomorrow. Honestly it looks like it addresses the things I had hoped would be in the CX-70, but weren't (a bit shorter while having about the same cargo capacity, more rear legroom, couple hundred pounds lighter, 20 more HP than the base engine while still running on regular gas as normal [manufacturer recommended]), with the better warranty and concierge service type things being typical of a luxury/premium brand).

DW wasn't impressed with the Gen 5 350, really disliked the door handles.

 

[GTEyes]

Yes, it sounds like you have exactly the right car for you

We should be test driving a Nautilus tomorrow. Honestly it looks like it addresses the things I had hoped would be in the CX-70, but weren't (a bit shorter while having about the same cargo capacity, more rear legroom, couple hundred pounds lighter, 20 more HP than the base engine while still running on regular gas as normal [manufacturer recommended]), with the better warranty and concierge service type things being typical if a luxury/premium brand).

DW wasn't impressed with the Gen 5 350, really disliked the door handles.

I’m interested in hearing how it goes

 

[ataraxia]

Went back and looked at the MDX one more time. Decided it's too big and has too many weird things for the price.

Test drove the Volvo XC60 Recharge Ultimate today. Half way through the test drive, the Mazda was eliminated. Volvo has more power, smaller exterior size (but feels comparable inside in the two rows) and very smooth transition between electric motor and the engine kicking on.

Down to the X5 40i or the Volvo for me and I'm leaning toward the Volvo. 455hp, 523lbft torque. There are no better seats and it's super quiet inside. Wife isn't sold on the X5 because it's at least $5k more than the Volvo. I didn't like the steering on the X5 as much. There are pros and cons to both but the Volvo dealer is 3 miles from my house with loaners available.

 

[markfm]

We didn't do the test on the '24 Nautilus today, DW wanted to go to a festival.

We did stop by for a quick look, though, in the showroom. Fit and finish looks up to snuff, headroom and legroom is excellent as expected, and plenty of cargo capacity (much roomier than the RX). A big plus is normal interior door handles (Gen 5 RX has funky interior electronic door "handles").

Looking forward to getting that test drive in.

 

[dwswager]

Went back and looked at the MDX one more time. Decided it's too big and has too many weird things for the price.

Test drove the Volvo XC60 Recharge Ultimate today. Half way through the test drive, the Mazda was eliminated. Volvo has more power, smaller exterior size (but feels comparable inside in the two rows) and very smooth transition between electric motor and the engine kicking on.

Down to the X5 40i or the Volvo for me and I'm leaning toward the Volvo. 455hp, 523lbft torque. There are no better seats and it's super quiet inside. Wife isn't sold on the X5 because it's at least $5k more than the Volvo. I didn't like the steering on the X5 as much. There are pros and cons to both but the Volvo dealer is 3 miles from my house with loaners available

BMW X3 is probably the model to compare with the Volvo XC60. Both are 186"ish. X5 is 194.3" long, 4 inches wider and 4.5" taller than the XC60. You can do a X3 M40i about $8-$10K cheaper than the X5 and it will fly being 600lbs lighter than the X5. Same B58 motor as the X5 40i with a slightly different tuning setup for more hp and less torque. The current generation X3 (G01) is not as refined as the X5 (G05), but that changes with the highly anticipated 2025 model update (G45 chassis). It basically brings it up to current X5 levels of sophistications. It will also be a mild hybrid like X5. Goes into production in starting in August 2024 as 2025 Model.

UPDATE X5 (1000Miles): We just did a round trip Huntsville to Nashville to Lebanon to Nashville to Huntsville. Average 27.6MPG. X5 has 4 modes ECO-Pro, Comfort, Sport and Sport Plus which change transmission shift points/speed, engine map and M Adaptive Suspension. I drove first leg up in Comfort mode and that is the base mode. My wife drove home on the highway using ECO-Pro and Comfort mode once we got off the I65.

Still getting used to having power and handling. Cruise holds exact speed set. My wife's 248HP, 4400lb minivan deviated +/- 2.5mph around the mean which sucks for you and those around you. Wife said she notices she drives faster in town LOL. When you flick your foot to maneuver the moving obstacles on the highway it is not as much effort and it is easy to start flying if you are not paying attention. The SuperWife is ever the nag and I got "I think 93mph is a little much don't you?" a few times. Though the X5 is almost 5000lbs and 194" long it drives smaller. I like remote engine start and it will be nice for both winter and summer. It technically has 3 key types. The 2 fobs you get, plus you get a keycard (can have multiples) which is a credit card size card that my wife keeps in her purse and a master digital key that can be shared that turns your phone into a key to unlock and operate the vehicle. Both my wife and I have the digital key on our phones. On the downside, the X5 rear seats do not reline. They used to and the X3 does. And you only need a couple inches. My daughter commented they were not as comfy for sleeping as the reclining seats in the van. Fine for sitting, but not for sleeping.

OBTW, the auto start/stop (ASS) mandated by the U.S. government is no automaker's fault. Our X5 is ever configurable, but you cannot configure it to start in Sport mode or even remember the last mode because the U.S. government mandates that ASS has to be enabled by default. Old BMWs were programable with BimmerCode and you could code it to off by default. Now the only trick is to put it in "Sport Individual" mode and set the transmission, engine and suspension to "Comfort." Then to go to sport or sport plus you just push the button once or twice on the console to rotate through sport, sport plus and back to sport individual which is really your comfort mode.

 

[EWL5]

BMW X3 is probably the model to compare with the Volvo XC60. Both are 186"ish. X5 is 194.3" long, 4 inches wider and 4.5" taller than the XC60. You can do a X3 M40i about $8-$10K cheaper than the X5 and it will fly being 600lbs lighter than the X5. Same B58 motor as the X5 40i with a slightly different tuning setup for more hp and less torque. The current generation X3 (G01) is not as refined as the X5 (G05), but that changes with the highly anticipated 2025 model update (G45 chassis). It basically brings it up to current X5 levels of sophistications. It will also be a mild hybrid like X5. Goes into production in starting in August 2024 as 2025 Model.

View attachment 327136UPDATE X5 (1000Miles): We just did a round trip Huntsville to Nashville to Lebanon to Nashville to Huntsville. Average 27.6MPG. X5 has 4 modes ECO-Pro, Comfort, Sport and Sport Plus which change transmission shift points/speed, engine map and M Adaptive Suspension. I drove first leg up in Comfort mode and that is the base mode. My wife drove home on the highway using ECO-Pro and Comfort mode once we got off the I65.

Still getting used to having power and handling. Cruise holds exact speed set. My wife's 248HP, 4400lb minivan deviated +/- 2.5mph around the mean which sucks for you and those around you. Wife said she notices she drives faster in town LOL. When you flick your foot to maneuver the moving obstacles on the highway it is not as much effort and it is easy to start flying if you are not paying attention. The SuperWife is ever the nag and I got "I think 93mph is a little much don't you?" a few times. Though the X5 is almost 5000lbs and 194" long it drives smaller. I like remote engine start and it will be nice for both winter and summer. It technically has 3 key types. The 2 fobs you get, plus you get a keycard (can have multiples) which is a credit card size card that my wife keeps in her purse and a master digital key that can be shared that turns your phone into a key to unlock and operate the vehicle. Both my wife and I have the digital key on our phones.

The X3 M40i has been a mild hybrid since the MY22 LCI and the 4 cylinder gets it for the first time for the new gen MY25. If anyone's serious about an X3, you can either wait for the new gen w/almost no buttons (this summer as you pointed out) or the current gen that still has buttons for HVAC, preset shortcuts, etc. Either gen will have still have the rotary dial for infotainment control, which is important since I think touchscreen-only is too dangerous.

Glad you're enjoying the X5! Let me know what you think of the Harman Kardon audio!

 

[dwswager]

Glad you're enjoying the X5! Let me know what you think of the Harman Kardon audio!

The HK system is good not great. Certainly, better than most BMW people whine about. The cabin is quiet enough and the system good enough to demonstrate the difference between high quality digital files played from USB versus FM or other broadcast including Bluetooth from a phone. Still playing with the equalizer. All automotive noise is in the 900hz to 6khz range so I'm experimenting to determine if that has been already accounted for in the settings or if I need to work adjustments. The hard part is you have to adjust and listen at speed, not in your driveway. They apparently offer a Bowers & Wilkins system on select configurations of select models. But I've never been partial to HK or B&W sound. Sound is very individual and what I might like might sound like crap to the next person. I am a lyrics guy so I want to hear the voices in my music clearly so the 500hz to 1000hz part is important to me.

 

[EWL5]

The HK system is good not great. Certainly, better than most BMW people whine about. The cabin is quiet enough and the system good enough to demonstrate the difference between high quality digital files played from USB versus FM or other broadcast including Bluetooth from a phone. Still playing with the equalizer. All automotive noise is in the 900hz to 6khz range so I'm experimenting to determine if that has been already accounted for in the settings or if I need to work adjustments. The hard part is you have to adjust and listen at speed, not in your driveway. They apparently offer a Bowers & Wilkins system on select configurations of select models. But I've never been partial to HK or B&W sound. Sound is very individual and what I might like might sound like crap to the next person. I am a lyrics guy so I want to hear the voices in my music clearly so the 500hz to 1000hz part is important to me.

I have the fairly mediocre HiFi system in my X3 (slim pickings on the lot due to supply chain issues) and would have loved the HK audio package, especially since it can play the multichannel FLAC files I've accumulated over the years (HiFi can't play them discretely)!

 

[ataraxia]

BMW X3 is probably the model to compare with the Volvo XC60. Both are 186"ish. X5 is 194.3" long, 4 inches wider and 4.5" taller than the XC60. You can do a X3 M40i about $8-$10K cheaper than the X5 and it will fly being 600lbs lighter than the X5. Same B58 motor as the X5 40i with a slightly different tuning setup for more hp and less torque. The current generation X3 (G01) is not as refined as the X5 (G05), but that changes with the highly anticipated 2025 model update (G45 chassis). It basically brings it up to current X5 levels of sophistications. It will also be a mild hybrid like X5. Goes into production in starting in August 2024 as 2025 Model.

I've researched just about everything that's come into view in this range (under 195" long, >300hp, non-CVT transmission, ICE/mild hybrid/PHEV, two row, et. al.) and eliminated the vehicles that don't cut it. My short list was the Mazda CX70/CX90, Acura MDX S Type, BMW X5, Volvo XC90/XC60. I eliminated several manufacturers for various reasons. For example, based on my current ownership experience - I'll never buy another Ford product.

The X3 - to your point - didn't feel as refined as the X5 which is why I eliminated it early on. The X5 is on the larger side of what I want but considered it because of other attributes (many of which you've gone over in review of your own vehicle). I do not like the dash on the 2024 BMW X3/X5 vs. the 2023 but 2023's are tough to find with low miles/in good shape with the options I want.

I won't wait until August for a replacement to my Explorer - May is my deadline - I've already held on to it too long. This generally eliminates the 2025 models of most manufacturers.

I'll admit, I've looked far further into the Volvo than the BMW. The Volvo is attractive right now - there are $10k in lease incentives as well as cash/finance incentives to clear out the remaining 2024 stock. Combining that with the ability to apply 10 MSDs drives the cost down a little more.

I wouldn't normally lease a vehicle but with the incentives and the new-ish PHEV technology, I wouldn't be stuck with it after three years if it changed significantly. Like BMW, Volvo's scheduled maintenance is very expensive - and technology changes quickly these days. Residual values are rough for all three models I'm looking at (BMW X5 40i @ 51%, X3 M40i @ 55%, Volvo @ 53%).

I've got more digging into the BMW side to be 100% sure in the coming weeks.

 

[youri]

I see a lot of people here are looking to lease their next car (especially for higher end cars). I looked into the numbers and I am considering it to get a BMW X3 and I honestly don’t understand the logic. I created a new thread to keep this one on topic. I would love to hear your logic and why you chose to or are looking to lease.

I understand the: after three years I am not stuck with it, but in my mind after three years you can still sell it. Where in a lease you are forced to get into something else with no residual value at all.

Thread 'Leasing vs buying'
https://mazdas247.com/forum/t/leasing-vs-buying.123881009/

 

[TimelessMazda]

The GH is a humongous car! Do you really need the 3rd row?

I did not and would have much preferred a bench second row situation.

However the higher performing models all came with three rows.

 

[dwswager]

Off Topic and out of price but someone, somewhere mentioned the Mazda 6 Wagon. BMW is apparently bringing the 600hp M5 Touring to the U.S.

 

[ataraxia]

Off Topic and out of price but someone, somewhere mentioned the Mazda 6 Wagon. BMW is apparently bringing the 600hp M5 Touring to the U.S.

View attachment 327162

I saw this and wondered how much more it'll be against the RS6. I hear that MB is discontinuing the E63 AMG soon (if not already). It's nice to see wagons making a tiny comeback.

I looked at the Volvo V60 Recharge Polestar - they've changed something in the car since my 2015 - I can't get into the front seat without hitting my head on the roofline. Same power as the XC60 - 455hp and 523 lbft torque.

 

[EWL5]

We didn't do the test on the '24 Nautilus today, DW wanted to go to a festival.

We did stop by for a quick look, though, in the showroom. Fit and finish looks up to snuff, headroom and legroom is excellent as expected, and plenty of cargo capacity (much roomier than the RX). A big plus is normal interior door handles (Gen 5 RX has funky interior electronic door "handles").

Looking forward to getting that test drive in.

Found this awesome review on the SavageGeese site:

2024 Lincoln Nautilus | Screen Gimmicks and Much More

We review the new 2024 Lincoln Nautilus, Ford's brand-new attempt to bring Lincoln into the next generation of modern luxury. We discuss the trade-offs and p...

www.youtube.com

My guess is if you're used to Mazda handling, you may not be too thrilled w/the Nautilus. It definitely looks the part as the interior is praised in the video but it still falls short of being a "total luxury experience" like the Germans or even Genesis.

I'm curious if you got that test drive in and what did you think?

 

[markfm]

We did the Nautilus Premiere 1 Hybrid test drive Tuesday, I liked it a lot.

Steering is solid, noise low, acceleration good, fit/finish very nice, ride very comfortable, the 48" screen quite nice. The 48" screen has the classic driving information in the normal location, with map display just to the right of that grouping, and the screen is set back from the driver sufficiently so focusing on it is pretty much the same as for distance.

Very smooth acceleration for both city street driving (from a stop) and on the highway (passing). The eCVT transmission in the Hybrid does a good job

Overall the Hybrid version build quality/luxury factor/drive feel is on par with a Lexus RX350 (better in some areas), with the power/torque what I wished the Gen 5 RX350 would have had. The ability to use regular gas as normal (vs. Premium) is a plus, and the cargo space and occupant legroom/headroom/... is way up there (especially given it's only 193" long).

It turns out that the Ford X-Plan pricing can be used, to get a hassle-free price that's pretty close to Invoice.

Now to convince DW

 

[EWL5]

We did the Nautilus Premiere 1 Hybrid test drive Tuesday, I liked it a lot.

Steering is solid, noise low, acceleration good, fit/finish very nice, ride very comfortable, the 48" screen quite nice. The 48" screen has the classic driving information in the normal location, with map display just to the right of that grouping, and the screen is set back from the driver sufficiently so focusing on it is pretty much the same as for distance.

Very smooth acceleration for both city street driving (from a stop) and on the highway (passing). The eCVT transmission in the Hybrid does a good job

Overall the Hybrid version build quality/luxury factor/drive feel is on par with a Lexus RX350 (better in some areas), with the power/torque what I wished the Gen 5 RX350 would have had. The ability to use regular gas as normal (vs. Premium) is a plus, and the cargo space and occupant legroom/headroom/... is way up there (especially given it's only 193" long).

It turns out that the Ford X-Plan pricing can be used, to get a hassle-free price that's pretty close to Invoice.

Now to convince DW

Sounds like you found what you wanted!

Don't know if Mazda's listening but this could be a very popular thread once the CX70 hits the streets!

 

[markfm]

Sounds like you found what you wanted!

Don't know if Mazda's listening but this could be a very popular thread once the CX70 hits the streets!

Yes, basically the Nautilus ended up achieving all the things I mentioned in the "what would you like to see in the CX-70" thread.

I'd still have rather gotten the larger Mazda I6 engine, but based on my test drive I have no concerns about the Nautilus engine/tranny combination being plenty good enough for my driving style. The basic engine has been around for some time, solid, and the eCVT is an update (to handle higher HP) of a prior one with a good track record.

 

[GTA-CX9]

The new 4 runner has been revealed.

While it seems like the polar opposite of the CX70 (and realistically it is), there is a part of me that sees a 4 runner as an option. Reason being both have something to stand out, the Mazda has the big engine and the RWD architecture, the 4 runner has the rugged side and legendary rep. Both have some chops to brag about, neither is vanilla as far as mainstream brand SUVs go.

Many shoppers in the segment just want sensible easy family transportation, the kind that when someone asks about it, they answer with how big the screens are, or how much crap goes in the back, or how it's easy to get in and out, or cupholders.

The target for the CX70 and 4 runner IMO are people looking for something different, a bit of wow factor or a bit of cool. I'd consider them both, but I'm a buyer more impressed by HP than mpg or cooled seats or automated this and that.

Both are a lot of things, but they aren't boring.

 

[ataraxia]

Did more digging into the X5 and decided it is too big for what I need/want. The X3 definitely lacks the refinement that may be coming in the 2025 model - the current version strikes me as the 'economy car' version of the BMW SUV range. The minimalist interior of the Volvo appeals to me more than the BMW interior. The XC60 definitely drives nicer than the X3.

Reserved an XC60 Recharge Ultimate today for delivery in 2 weeks.

 

[Bulldog Dad]

Mazda is starting to tease the CX-80. 2025 Mazda CX-80: New SUV teased ahead of imminent reveal
It definitely gives me some CX-50 vibes with the way that rear window chrome trim looks. Time will tell if it is the CX-70 some of us wished Mazda delivered. Either way, Mazda is giving me some strong reasons these days to date other automakers.