Does CX-5 always start in AWD?

[wbw]

I have read in several places that the CX-3 always starts up with AWD and then goes to front drive if no slippage is detected. Does the CX-5 work the same way, or does it use a different setup? Is the CX-3 system newer or the same as CX-5?

I will probably get a CX-5 as next car, but really like the CX-3 except that it's so small inside.

Thanks.

 

[wlong01]

I have read in several places that the CX-3 always starts up with AWD and then goes to front drive if no slippage is detected. Does the CX-5 work the same way, or does it use a different setup? Is the CX-3 system newer or the same as CX-5?

I will probably get a CX-5 as next car, but really like the CX-3 except that it's so small inside.

Thanks.

I think it's the other way around on the CX-5.

 

[Chris_Top_Her]

If you have the wheels up and car in d all wheels will spin at idle

 

[yrwei52]

I have read in several places that the CX-3 always starts up with AWD and then goes to front drive if no slippage is detected. Does the CX-5 work the same way, or does it use a different setup? Is the CX-3 system newer or the same as CX-5?

I will probably get a CX-5 as next car, but really like the CX-3 except that it's so small inside.

Yeah, CX-3 AWD is a newer system and has more sophisticated software to provocatively predict the needs of the rear wheels while CX-5 AWD is more traditional. The hardware setup should be very similar between CX-5 and CX-3. AWD in CX-5 is not as efficient as other AWD compact CUVs such as Honda CR-V, Nissan Rogue, or Toyota RAV4; and shows from EPA MPG differences between FWD and AWD. Although Mazda claimed they did some "enhancement" on CX-5 AWD system for MY 2016 to improve the real-world gas mileage, but from my own experience I just can't see the improvement, neither does the EPA.

 

[Lbear]

Yeah, CX-3 AWD is a newer system and has more sophisticated software to provocatively predict the needs of the rear wheels while CX-5 AWD is more traditional. The hardware setup should be very similar between CX-5 and CX-3. AWD in CX-5 is not as efficient as other AWD compact CUVs such as Honda CR-V, Nissan Rogue, or Toyota RAV4; and shows from EPA MPG differences between FWD and AWD. Although Mazda claimed they did some "enhancement" on CX-5 AWD system for MY 2016 to improve the real-world gas mileage, but from my own experience I just can't see the improvement, neither does the EPA.

The engineers did reprogram it. The CX5 system is a great system but like anything, bad tires won't work with a good AWD, therefore good tires and a good AWD like the CX5 = great traction.

https://youtu.be/4C8b6PHrVfQ

https://youtu.be/khYz8d5xY4o

https://youtu.be/_VrFAutcaig

I have AWD and Continental True Contact tires and I've gone on steep inclines with snow and ice with no loss of traction. The CX5 AWD is a great performer for a CUV. The above videos demonstrate that.

 

[wbw]

Thanks for the videos Lbear. That got me watching other CX-5 videos on youtube.

 

[yrwei52]

The engineers did reprogram it. The CX5 system is a great system but like anything, bad tires won't work with a good AWD, therefore good tires and a good AWD like the CX5 = great traction.

I have no doubts CX-5 AWD has good traction. But my complaint is on fuel efficiency. Apparently Mazda knows it hence they did some re-programming for 2016 AWD and supposedly improves the "real-world" fuel efficiency. But with average 26.5 MPG from our recent trip on interstate highways, I really can't see any improvement for highway fuel efficiency.

 

[Kedis82ZE8]

That spinning driveshaft at all speeds certainly doesn't help MPG. Similar penalty of an old part time 4WD system where transfer case is disconnected but hubs are left engaged.

Not sure what changes were made but it doesn't appear to me that it is the same system as the CX-3. Maybe some additional sensor points at most. I do agree tires make all the difference though.

CX-3 in same test.

 

[MikeM.]

Not sure what changes were made but it doesn't appear to me that it is the same system as the CX-3.

CX-3 in same test.

Looks like the same basic system in both the CX-3 and the CX-5 based on almost identical behavior on the diagonal test. In any case, the CX-5 works great for me off-road and in treacherous winter conditions. 95% of AWD performance is good tires and good driver skills.

 

[callphy]

they feel the same, one tire slip seconds later it transfer more torque to other non slipping wheels

 

[Anchorman]

It's amazing how much speculation and opinion there is on this subject.

I can assure you that the AWD system on the CX-5 is identical to that on the CX-3. It comprises of a constantly variable multi plate clutch that sits on the nose of the rear axle. To answer the OP, yes, the CX-5 ALWAYS sets off in AWD and then gradually backs off as the torque demand reduces. Imagine it being connected to the accelerator and the harder you press or poke it, the clutch responds accordingly. Eventually, the system settles down to FWD which provides better economy and a nicely balanced cruiser. It also virtually does away with the need for Traction Control and it will automatically engage if it detects a low friction surface like mud or snow.

The system is also linked to the VSC so it can bring in the rear drive as a means to control skidding as well as under and oversteer. It's a superb system which has proven virtually trouble free for Mazda and the other big user - Toyota RAV4.

 

[wbw]

Hey Anchorman, glad to see you over here. Welcome aboard. (2thumbs)

Anchorman is a very knowledgeable contributor over on the CX-3 forum. He is a great resource.

 

[Anchorman]

If I can fathom out how to attach a PDF, I'll find you one on the CX-5 drive system. Sit tight!

 

[Chris_Top_Her]

If I can fathom out how to attach a PDF, I'll find you one on the CX-5 drive system. Sit tight!

www.dropbox.com is a good place to attach entire files; if you just want to attach a screenshot, you can hit "print screen" key, "paste" it into Microsoft paint (or another photo editor) and then simple save it. Then upload it to whatever photo website you use. I like imgur.com.

 

[Anchorman]

Here we go.

Thanks wbw and Chris - I think Ive fathomed it!

 

[4G63T]

Inside the Electronic Control Coupling (AWD Solenoid at the read diff), is it just electronically controlled clutch plates that completely connect/disconnect connection to the rear wheels or is it an open differential with clutch plates that are electronically controlled? So that when the clutches are slipping/loose its just an open center differential type setup...

 

[Anchorman]

View attachment 212838View attachment 212839

Inside the Electronic Control Coupling (AWD Solenoid at the read diff), is it just electronically controlled clutch plates that completely connect/disconnect connection to the rear wheels or is it an open differential with clutch plates that are electronically controlled? So that when the clutches are slipping/loose its just an open center differential type setup...

What a good question - the sign of an analytical and inquisitive mind. You shall be rewarded with more pdf’s and photos!

The nice thing about this arrangement is that it is so simple. It uses a straight forward diff - nothing fancy at all and has the clutch arrangement just positioned on the input where the propellor shaft bolts on. The actual multi-plate clutch is controlled by a variable plunger (computer controlled) which turns a rotating collar. There are ball bearings that rise up the collar and engage the clutch in a 100% variable and stepless manner. Make no mistake, this thing is going like a fiddlers elbow all the time the car is in motion.

Just to give a clear indication of what it looks like, here is the drive unit on my CX-3 which is identical to the CX-5.

and this is the diff viewed from the back. The CX-5 has a beefed up arrangement but works in the same way.

You can see two wires. One goes to the actuating collar and one goes to a temperature sensor that would postpone service if it got really hot and you would get a dash light warning for this. They rarely get hot enough to shut down. You would have to be really trying to fight your way out of a snowdrift or swamp for that to happen.

 

[Kedis82ZE8]

Functionally the same but different parts? or are you saying they are literally the same hardware?

A few here have heated it up and system went to fail-safe in heavy snow.

I've also see some state that some markets actually include a mechanical LSD. It was stated New Zealand and Australia get this model.

I get that CX-3 has the new system but still not entirely convinced that '16 CX-5's system has all the same features. Feed me a '16 FSM

EDIT: Some of the supposed new sensors already showed up as there on the '15 CX-5 in my FSM.

View attachment 212838View attachment 212839





You can see two wires. One goes to the actuating collar and one goes to a temperature sensor that would postpone service if it got really hot and you would get a dash light warning for this. They rarely get hot enough to shut down. You would have to be really trying to fight your way out of a snowdrift or swamp for that to happen.

 

[Anchorman]

Got to to work now but I'll check the part numbers tomorrow. Like I said, the diff may be different and certainly a different ratio but I suspect the drive unit is not only the same in operation but part number too.

Sit tight.

 

[MikeM.]

Functionally the same but different parts? or are you saying they are literally the same hardware?

It would surprise me if the entire system was 100% identical (due to the fact that the CX-5 is a heavier vehicle with a longer wheelbase) but from a functional perspective they work the same way.

A few here have heated it up and system went to fail-safe in heavy snow.

Has yours ever gone into fail-safe mode? I'm sure you've had it in some challenging conditions getting to your mountain cabin. I've driven through deep/wet snow a couple of inches deeper than the ground clearance with
an ice layer underneath. The CX-5 was shockingly capable, even able to drive up gentle rises under these most challenging conditions. As soon as I took my foot off the accelerator the car would grind to a stop instantly and as I
stepped on it, it would lurch forward. I've never seen the over-heat fail-safe light go on, even when driving icy hairpins winter rally style. I'm sure if I continued this long enough it would eventually over-tax the system but that is not typical real world usage. I'm sure the most likely over-heat situation is deep, dry beach sand in summertime temperatures. But, IMO, only idiots drive a car they care about in deep, dry beach sand. Still, it's nice to know it can do it in an emergency. But don't plan on doing it for miles! In my Nissan Patrol 4x4 I've been in dry sand and it took around 80 hp just to maintain forward motion on level ground at 5 mph! But it was dug in nearly to the axles.

Having put the 2013 CX-5 AWD through the paces on/off road, summer/winter, I can say there is far too much skepticism on these forums about it's capabilities. Yes, every system has it's limits if you push it hard enough but those limits are a lot higher than many people (mostly non-owners) allude to.

Here is a short video showing my CX-5 climbing a wet, cold and slippery steep lip with half worn out Geolanders on it. This hill is much steeper than it looks in the photos. I high-centered on the first failed attempt but succeeded the second time with a slight adjustment to my line to avoid high-centering. Note that the hill was so steep and slippery I slid backwards about 6 feet with all four wheels locked up on the first failed attempt:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bZCROYEK1DM