car goes boom(pics)
- Thread starter blackmica08
- Start date
well that wouldnt make much sense for someone that earns his money selling modifications for mazda vehicles. I think he is just trying to say that there are probably better platforms out there if youre looking to build that 500 HP monster.
Don't worry about Vw's, before a vw is lemon law, they buy it back from the customer, that's why you don't see vw with problems, back is the early 2000 they had electrical problems and honda's their engine will hold a bigger turbo without blowing up is because they do not have any torque, mazda engines start making power from 2500 rpm, honda you gotta hit VTEC at 5500 before you pull any kinda power, and the gear ratio in a mazds is higher so you redline faster, also tell your brother Mazda is the only Japanese car company to ever win at Le Mans 24hr race.
lol yeah because VW's are the definition of reliable?(rofl)
ThreeEdgedSword
Member
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- 07 Mazdaspeed 3 GT Cosmic Blue
My coworker's GLI is reliable - it regularly has problems with it's high-pressure fuel pump (No start and/or loss of power while driving).
kickniteasy
Member
wow....a thread about someone putting a much bigger turbo on there car, having it blow up, and then calling the car a complete piece of crap....what an original post for a car forum. If you mess with something from the factory and bad things happen you've only got yourself to blame, it's part of the car modding game. Good luck finding a car where you can't find a thousand threads just like this one related to it.
I also find it odd that people are having trouble getting warranty work done with things as small as a CAI but you're getting a whole new engine covered with the mods you had on the car.
I also find it odd that people are having trouble getting warranty work done with things as small as a CAI but you're getting a whole new engine covered with the mods you had on the car.
oaklandopen
Member
i think maybe the main thing to realize is that the ms3 really is fine the way it is. and im guilty of wanting more power just like a lot of ppl, but im slowly realizing it's just kinda dumb.
the reason why is because this is a FWD car. it will never have good take off, it will never be better around a track, and it will never be a large displacement (2.3 liters is just not enough to get any high hp safely while keeping longevity, without bringing lots of money to the table)
this car has plenty of power already. so much so that mazda found it neccessary to prevent all that power from reaching the wheels in first and second gear. so in a way, they were nice enough to help you save a little bit on tires
the reason why is because this is a FWD car. it will never have good take off, it will never be better around a track, and it will never be a large displacement (2.3 liters is just not enough to get any high hp safely while keeping longevity, without bringing lots of money to the table)
this car has plenty of power already. so much so that mazda found it neccessary to prevent all that power from reaching the wheels in first and second gear. so in a way, they were nice enough to help you save a little bit on tires
jam_asian85
Member
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- Mazdaspeed 3
(nana) I call dibs !!!
SPEEDYHANS
Member
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- speed 3 (mS3)
and what r u going to do with it have it parked lol
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- 2002 BJFW, 2007 BK3P, 1979 SA22C, 2005 BK3P
thank you. people who want 500 whp out of a FWD car boggle the mind anyways.
read what i said. i never said they were underengineered. i said they are not overengineered. a scion tc 2.4 can easily push over 400whp on a dyno with a supercharger and not break a sweat - stock bottom end. thats one of many, and thats not even what most would consider a "tuner engine." people have already posted in here how weak the MSP engine was. a Mazdaspeed Miata engine hasn't been much better than 250 with a good tune either. i just covered all the mazdaspeed vehicles. if you want to look at non-speed vehicles in terms of what they'll take and compare it side by side to other four bangers out there, the evidence will bear itself out.
sounds made up? how long have you been working on mazdas, selling mazdas, owning mazdas, tuning mazdas? probably not as long as i have, no offense.
FDs can make alot of horsepower. so can FCs. i've owned three different rx7s, so you might say i have some clue there. not on factory apex seals. not without aggressive tuning. not without far better cooling, air and water, in place. not without dumping the twin turbos. you want word, just go over to rx7club or nopistons forums and see how much money people dump into a 13B. see how much people spend to buy a 20B swap. and then read why people continue to blow up their 2 rotor engines and then commit ultimate automotive adultery and go to a Chevy small block. people aren't making reliable 500 rwhp on a stock setup. the rx7 is no more a tuner wunderkind than the money you want to spend into it, period. buy it or don't buy it, but be informed before calling me someone a liar.
look, i'm the biggest mazdaknut out there, and everyone knows that. but i've worked with them long enough, put parts on them long enough, seen them blow up and blow off doors, sold them, serviced them log enough with cylinders or triangles to be a realist. if you read what i said, you'd understand that. i love the car, love the brand, love the way the cars drive. but i also know the strengths and weaknesses, and so do many other people, which is why you see alot more cars from other brands getting the aftermarket attention that they do. it makes it more challenging for our crowd, and frankly i like that. it makes it all that more rewarding when real breakthroughs are made and real big numbers are reliably achieved.
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787B FTW!
shane02pro5
25ish_psi
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- New Caney TX
It won't be long before we start seeing 400whp+ MS3's and MS6's as commonly as 300whp+ proteges are around here. Just have to get over a few humps or casualties to figure out its limits and time to upgrade...$$$$$!
Young Roids
Member
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- The pennies have been saved the MS3 is mine!
Well mine will stay stock at any rate. I guess I should get a honda for my next car then and push some real power.(dunno)
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- 2002 BJFW, 2007 BK3P, 1979 SA22C, 2005 BK3P
there are ways to tune the car, definitely some ways better than others. and if its done right from day one, thats really essential. its not as easy as it is on other platforms and the results aren't always comparable to what you might see with the same part on another car. but there is potential for reliable power for people who want to take the time, the right approach and be willing to spend the appropriate amount for quality reliable results.
if i came across extremely pissed off, its nothing personal, believe me.
I was just about to say this.. word for word. I think a lot of people are forgetting that the car has only been out for a couple years now. Sooner than later.. big things will happen for the car just like they did for the Protege and Protege 5! Getting frustrated and trading the car in cause youve hit a few snags along the way is just that... frustrating!
BillTheCat
Member
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- 2009 Mazdaspeed3 Sport
I had a 400+whp Supra (MKIII/7MGTE) back in the day, and I kinda got that out of my system. Cost a lot of money, replacing several head gaskets & fully building the motor from the crank up after all was said & done. I have no delusions that all of my power mods didn't contribute to the head gasket failures & eventual need for a rebuild. (There was a definite problem with head/gasket design from Toyota, but that's another story)
You gotta pay to play. Period.
My last car was a stock 170hp (crank hp) MINI Cooper S. I spent a number of thousands modding it, eventually ran about 190whp, probably 220-230 crank. Was a lot of fun to drive. But one of the reasons I traded it in was that I knew I was pushing the engine a bit compared to what it was designed for. Reliability was going to suffer.
So I chose the MS3 partially because, even though it is heavier than the MCS, it also has an unmodded power to weight ratio similar to my modded MCS. Am I still tempted to mod the MS3? Somewhat, but I also paid good money for an extended warranty (100k/7 years), so I have motivation to leave it stock.
I absolutely believe that any engine should be overbuilt at stock specs, and therfore able to handle some modification. And I don't knock anyone for modding a car, especially if it is a car already built for power/speed. But when you get into serious mods like bigger turbos, you are rolling the dice.
From the minute you start overboosting the engine on stock internals, every second you spend in high boost/high load situations is weakening the crank, rods, bearings, etc. After enough abuse, you can throw a rod at idle. I've seen it happen, firsthand.
So the OP has now encountered a situation that should drive this lesson home. Is the MS3 engine a POS? I haven't done tons of research, but I did a good bit before I purchased mine and I feel cofortable saying that it is likely a fairly reliable powerplant.
I think the OP is very fortunate if the dealer replaces his engine under warranty, and more power to him if that's the case. On the other hand, if Mazda sends some sort of inspector out & decides that the mods went too far, I don't think there's much room to cry foul, either. It'd be a shame to see anyone suffer that kind of loss, though, and I don't wish this on him.
Just everyone remember... you gotta pay to play. Take shortcuts or cut corners, and they will come back to haunt you eventually. Have fun with your rides, but plan your mods carefully and remember that no engine is unbreakable if you drive it hard enough.
You gotta pay to play. Period.
My last car was a stock 170hp (crank hp) MINI Cooper S. I spent a number of thousands modding it, eventually ran about 190whp, probably 220-230 crank. Was a lot of fun to drive. But one of the reasons I traded it in was that I knew I was pushing the engine a bit compared to what it was designed for. Reliability was going to suffer.
So I chose the MS3 partially because, even though it is heavier than the MCS, it also has an unmodded power to weight ratio similar to my modded MCS. Am I still tempted to mod the MS3? Somewhat, but I also paid good money for an extended warranty (100k/7 years), so I have motivation to leave it stock.
I absolutely believe that any engine should be overbuilt at stock specs, and therfore able to handle some modification. And I don't knock anyone for modding a car, especially if it is a car already built for power/speed. But when you get into serious mods like bigger turbos, you are rolling the dice.
From the minute you start overboosting the engine on stock internals, every second you spend in high boost/high load situations is weakening the crank, rods, bearings, etc. After enough abuse, you can throw a rod at idle. I've seen it happen, firsthand.
So the OP has now encountered a situation that should drive this lesson home. Is the MS3 engine a POS? I haven't done tons of research, but I did a good bit before I purchased mine and I feel cofortable saying that it is likely a fairly reliable powerplant.
I think the OP is very fortunate if the dealer replaces his engine under warranty, and more power to him if that's the case. On the other hand, if Mazda sends some sort of inspector out & decides that the mods went too far, I don't think there's much room to cry foul, either. It'd be a shame to see anyone suffer that kind of loss, though, and I don't wish this on him.
Just everyone remember... you gotta pay to play. Take shortcuts or cut corners, and they will come back to haunt you eventually. Have fun with your rides, but plan your mods carefully and remember that no engine is unbreakable if you drive it hard enough.
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- -- 03 P5 / 23 CX-5 --
^^^^ Let's see who attempts an argument with this.........that should be rich.
FrequentFlyer
Member
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- 2008 CWP Mazdaspeed3
This really isn't good for any turbocharged motor. This causes a lot of pressure on the rods since you're in an overdrive gear with the weight of the car pushing up on the bottom end of the rods and high cylinder pressures pushing down on the top end at 15+ psi boost. There should be no reason to be WOT in 6th gear unless you're doing 140+ mph. In an N/A car, not such a big deal. This is like riding a 10 speed bike in 10th gear at a slow speed. Try to accelerate and where are you going? Nowhere. What's burning? You're legs! The rods are equivalent to your legs. I know this car accelerates pretty damn well in 6th gear, but that doesn't mean it's good for the car. I always downshift, at least to 5th if I'm going to go WOT. I'm not afraid of RPM. My previous two cars were Hondas, S2000 and an RSX Type S. Short stroke motors that loved RPM. Being at 2k RPM going WOT in the MS3 is putting more stress on this motor than being at 4k and going WOT. This turbo will make boost at 1.5-2k RPM. Not 15psi, but it will make boost and trying to accelerate from such a low RPM in the wrong gear is not good. Honda's rods are not necessarily made stronger, but they're at an advantage with a shorter stroke. Although I do believe Honda's new 2.3 turbo in the RDX has a longer stroke than our DISI's do.
The margin for error with a turbocharged engine is a lot more narrow. If you think about the amount of power these little motors are making, it's pretty impressive. 10-15 years ago we were lucky to see turbocharged V6's making near 300hp at the crank from factory and now we're doing it with a 2.3L and an SRI. This is why I'm not going any further than my SRI, ETS topmount and inlet. I'd much rather work on the suspension from now on. This car is plenty fast in the straight line for me.
Does anyone think the possibility of wheelhop putting stress on the rods?
I think we need a howto guide on driving this car fast. You get magazine reviews bragging about how it has so much low end torque you don't even need to downshift to exit a corner sometimes. Then you have people on forums bragging about how awesome a "6th gear pull" is even at 50MPH.
Now I'm reading those things are absolutely terrible for the engine. On the highway, if I'm cruising at 50+ in 6th and i get an opportunity to open it up, I usually drop to 5th and give it hell. Should I be going 6th to 4th? Would that be better for the engine?
I also get confused about cruising gears. If I'm in a long stretch of cop-infested 35MPH speed limit road (like I encounter every day on the way home from work), should I keep it in 5th for the low speed cruise or 6th?
Sorry I've strayed off topic, but this car seems to have a set of different rules as far as how to handle driving it, and everyone has their different methods.
I usually shift at around 3 to 3.5k when I want to save some gas... even under hard acceleration to the speed limit. I guess I need to bump that up to 4 or 4.5k for hard acceleration to make it easier on the engine.
Now I'm reading those things are absolutely terrible for the engine. On the highway, if I'm cruising at 50+ in 6th and i get an opportunity to open it up, I usually drop to 5th and give it hell. Should I be going 6th to 4th? Would that be better for the engine?
I also get confused about cruising gears. If I'm in a long stretch of cop-infested 35MPH speed limit road (like I encounter every day on the way home from work), should I keep it in 5th for the low speed cruise or 6th?
Sorry I've strayed off topic, but this car seems to have a set of different rules as far as how to handle driving it, and everyone has their different methods.
I usually shift at around 3 to 3.5k when I want to save some gas... even under hard acceleration to the speed limit. I guess I need to bump that up to 4 or 4.5k for hard acceleration to make it easier on the engine.
