SELL MSP or UPGRADE

Nolimits said:
Ok? Are you saying you should buy a bad product, tune it yourself and risk blowing your motor and/or other stuff then fix it and find out what the problem is?

Ok, i promise that this is it but what the hell are you talking about? bad product? YOU DRIVE A GOD DAMN NEON!!!!!! i paid 17k for my car brand ******* new. best srt = 23k. with $6k i could walk all over your NEON! new motor, clutch, exhaust, fmic, ems, new turbo, and some looks for 6k. bottom line is, you pussied out because you knew it would be work to make an MSP more badass. so you went with the rest of the ******* lemmings and fell right off the goddamn cliff! Leave..... just leave you lazy piece of s***... btw i just cleaned the horse up off the screet... it was smelly....
 
The topic that you wish to debate is one that no one cares about. You don't have a stage 3 car. Your best time was a 13.8, many MSP's do that and lower with mods. Look at the drag racing thread to see the times. Most MSP's have not even seen a track as their drives don't care one way or another about such a frivolous statistic.

Its a MAZDA Forum. Talk about your MX-6 or just STFU and go away. I am sure that the kind of boasting and debate that you are seeking is widely available on the SRT-4 forum. As it must be filled with other people with clear inadequacies looking to compensate for them by constantly harping on Mopar upgrades and how great the SRT-4 platform is.

The original topic was to sell or upgrade the MSP to make it faster. Well that can be done, but it will cost perhaps more than its worth in the long run. Thats a choice the thread starter will have to make. Its a well balanced car that responds well to the right mods. While we don't have the simplicity of factory support, there are plenty of aftermarket suppliers that provide good mods for the MSP.
 
Yea know there's alot of 03.5 owners that got there's around 17k I paid 16 and some change for mine considering that they werent moving as fast as they thought. The 03 guys had to pay sticker thats why I didnt buy one when they first came out.
 
Nolimits said:
I do own a Mazda, see user title. ;)

If your car already has a performance exhaust, short throw kit, and suspension, then why does the aftermarket make all that stuff and people buy it? Ohh yeah, cause apparently the stuff Mazda put in stock isnt good enough. With the Mopar upgrades, you can have a car that does high 11's, pulls almost .95g on the skidpad, all for less than 8k, but I guess Mazda made the MSP run 11's from the factory.

So IF they could have had 220whp out of it, why didnt they? BECAUSE Mazda thought that 220whp couldnt hold up in that engine so they needed to dial it back, Thank you for supporting my claim.


And Tubi still makes an exhaust for an Enzo Ferrari... which i'm pretty sure was a fairly nice exhaust to begin with. Whats your point, aftermarket is aftermarket. Whether you get your upgrades from Mopar, or we get ours through various aftermarket outlets makes no difference. If you think mazda wanted to make a car that ran 11's from the factory your ******* nuts. I dont think you really get it. And its why no one really wants to hear this debate one more ******* time. So for the last time... The MSP wasnt made to drag race... its about all around performance, primarily handling. Why is the SRT-4 quick in a straight line? Because it was made by an american mullet-shaved faggot that isnt aware that some roads have curves in them, and that some people like to drive quickly through curves instead of flooring a car in a straight line. What did you expect from Mopar?

The only debate here is when your going to leave because no one wants to here more of "well i CAN get a stage 3" but i'm still to ******* broke to do it. Go post on your SRT-4 forum about how cool your staged upgrades are on your soon-to-be-rusted SRT-4.
 
Paid 17 for mine brand new, lots of people paid less.

But, that aside, you're still a douchebag.

Nolimits said:
LOL, so you quote 17k which means either you sucked off the salesman to get a below invoice price on it or you bought it used. I quoted a SRT-4 ACR with its MSRP price. Funny how you compare the two like they are the same. You suck at arguing, just give up. If you want to argue, throw out EQUAL factors, but since you dont, you obviously have no knowledge of how to debate. So what was a MSRP of a fully loaded 2003.5 MSP? Cause that would be a good comparison for a fully loaded 23k 2005 SRT-4 ACR.

All I want is an equal debate so people can read this and decided either "this guy has a good point, Ill go with his choice" or "this guy makes more sense to me". By flaming and cursing your not helping your side at all.

I bet to differ about the MSP's handling, the SRT-4 ACR handles just as good as it (Adjustable Tokico suspension, BBS Wheels, 24mm front swaybar, 19mm rear swaybar) Its a great suspension package to the otherwise "poor handling" base SRT-4 which only clocked in a .86g skidpad.
 
icespeed said:
that's alot of animosity!!!!! so, let the shoosting begin. Have you ever sat in a RSX-s or a Mini Cooper S?? Are you 5'2"? b/c at 6'2" I bashed my head everytime I tried to sit in the RSX-s. And the tach/speed in the center of the Mini is FUGLY. And I absoltuely LOVE how ferarri and lambo have leather to cover their dash, a custom dash of the liking is planned for the (my) msp with yellow stitching to match. Have you ever looked at the interior of your car, other than the boost guage that sticks out more than your wenker at a strip club? I mean, c'mon!!!! I maybe biased, I have owned two neons in the past ten years, and while they didn't have the "punch" you love to show off in a MSP thread, after 40,000 miles each, heads were popped off, electrical malfunctions and tranny's blowing (ok, the tranny thing was my fault) plagued me from EVER buying another NEON. The STI, on the other hand, has a very decent brushed radio bezel, not a bad touch, I like the comfort of the seats, but the rest of the interior is garbage. So the dash cluster says STI it still isn't the most appealing, neither are the contours of the dash and the way they form (or are supposed to form) into the doors. Have you ever looked at the guage cluster of the EVO? ******* FORGET ABOUT IT!!!! I got dizzy and wanted to throw up from the orange/black wonderful combo. Where the E-brake is? There is a small nook to TRY and keep my cigarettes in place. Those three cars have all their money devoted to under the hood!!!! I like the conservative approach Mazda took with the MSP. It's a car that doesnt need or want the attention (other than the orange and yellow colors). Other than the wing, very few people would recognize the msp from the regular protege. THAT WAS THE POINT. With a few minor modifications, I am very content with the interior (other than leather), more so than when I last sat in my boss' M3.

13.4 is very do-able with another 13k to put into the car (16,500 for the car, 500 in PERFORMANCE upgrades so far) for relatively the same price as an STI or EVO or UGLY ASS SRT-4 with it's ass hanging in the air higher than a jumbo jet flying at 30k feet. Do you really think 13k in mods is not enough to reach 13.4 in the 1/4??? That still puts me within 30k overall and I won't have bitches in SRT-4s, or M3's for that matter, even suspecting that this car can "hang". If an SRT-4 pulls up next to an STI or Evo, unless the guy (srt-4) is an idiot, he won't even attempt to race. But, if that same SRT-4 pulled up to a mazda protege with a wing, He would want to "show" off. He would be mistaken for doing so. RE read the post. I don't win all the time, But it definately makes them think twice about racing a MSP again. I will give you the decency of saying that most probably don't know how to drive their SRT-4's and can be attributed to the wins, But, I could also complement myself, saying that I DO know how to drive my car.

And, you have actually proven my point by referencing the Porsche to Ferrari to Viper to Vette. The Ferrari and Porsche don't HAVE to brag about anything. They don't have to talk down to the viper or the vette for that matter either. They accept them as lower cars with muscle. The same way I approach your SRT-4, a bad car with some power.

So keep talking about your best SRT-4. I'll be at home ******* the prom queen.


P.S. When I bought this car, it was upgrading from a 99lx protege. I didn't even know it had a turbo. It was quicker than the 99 (obviously) and its interior was WAY better than the 99. One of the MAIN selling points. Only after I bought it did I find out about its following and therefore the plethora of info to be learned on these forums. Looking back, especially after your attmept of an arrogant post, I have DEFINATELY MADE THE RIGHT DECISION WITH MY CAR.


Why would you put 13 k into a slow car to get it to 13.4. Just buy a evo or sti would be easier running the same times. Sorry but I have both an sti and an msp and the sti interior is FAR superior to the msp interior. Furthermore the msp and evo/aren't even comparable mazda was alot more liberal with the credit when the 3 cars dropped. I'd take a wrx over a msp to be real it still has more potential.
 
Nolimits said:
The SRT-4 has a COMPLETELY different powertrain then a regular neon! The only things you can brag about breaking the same stuff are interior/exterior panels and the chassis. Meanwhile the MSP shares the same trans as a Protege except with a LSD, and has the same motor.

2003 SRT-4's started out at 19,995 and the top of the line ACR model only costs 23k, when did the SRT-4 become a 30k car? Hell the EVO RS costs only 27k. And the "SRT-4 is an idiot for wanting to race an EVO and STi?" LMAO! We have the same WHP as an EVO and stock for stock, SRT-4's pull on EVO's from a roll. SRT-4's trap over 100mph stock.Check out this comparison, the SRT-4 traps 105

Its ok, everyone wants to play with us big boys, but dont try comparing yourself to them.
Whats that? Ohh, your MSP came in last place in a comparison with the SRT-4 in it

I love that last line, you talk about HIGH SCHOOL PROM QUEEN and this guy mentions So high schooler's own MSP's, serious racers own SRT-4's, EVO's, STi's. If I were a MSP, i would get pissed off you even used that comment.

Sorry a stock srt can't touch an evo or sti in the quarter. My sti stock went 13.1. What srt is doing that please clue me in.
(uhm) http://www.msprotege.com/forum/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=2162984#
 
Nolimits said:
It will never win, I will ALWAYS see the MSP in my rearview mirror, either spend an assload on a big turbo kit, or race an SRT-4 in a 30mph auto-x event. But in Drag Racing and in Road Racing, the big 3 (SRT-4, EVO, STi) will always dominate
Just wanted to put in my 2 cents (with an auto-x bias)... dunno what auto-x event you attended... maybe you're talking AVERAGE speed, but 30mph!! So yeah bro, i don't think so... even my barely moded 1992 323 in FSP with about 75whp is never under 40-50mph Avg. on track.... i know its not an auto-x stories thread and not everyone can drive, but i have beaten SRT-4 auto-x run times (hell even beaten a Viper GTS at one event, that guy had no experience at all vs. my 2 1/2 years).
So i don't see when exactly the MSP can be beaten out in corners by an SRT-4 in the real world if a 1.6L 8v non-turbo car with the same suspension setup can toy with it.(uhm) I say upgrade the Mazda!
 
miss_steele_msp said:
Why would you put 13 k into a slow car to get it to 13.4. Just buy a evo or sti would be easier running the same times. Sorry but I have both an sti and an msp and the sti interior is FAR superior to the msp interior. Furthermore the msp and evo/aren't even comparable mazda was alot more liberal with the credit when the 3 cars dropped. I'd take a wrx over a msp to be real it still has more potential.


Yeah, I actually don't have a choice. I did a favor for my brother when I bought this car, I took a 9k hit upside down. While he's SUPPOSED to be paying me, I will never have the financials correct to trade this car in. I will own this car FOREVER!!!!!! The way I saw it I love this car and have to put all the necessary things in it to my liking. Hence the strong favor of modding the car (original post-er) as opposed to just trading it in. Aside from having fun with this srt-4 guy, the truth is that the msp is a fun car to drive and I personally think that the evo and sti are both overated. Ofcourse this thread originally asked for opinions and this is mine: I don't like the evo, sti or srt-4. The trade off for speed is not worth it in my book, when you can mod the msp for a few bucks.
 
My god STFU both of you. And SRT-4 guy...why take the comment so personal? He didnt say specifically about a SRT-4...he stated his opinions. who cares whos faster and whos better. A car is to take you from point A to point B. its how it feels and how it takes you there that matters.

factory numbers dont mean anything and power isnt a bandaid for bad driving skills. POWER IS NOT EVERYTHING! And I will show you 1st hand if you have bittorent.

Wanna see proof? I have Yashio factory 550 hp HKS 2.2L stroker kit + HKS GT3037S S15 silvia vs a 380 hp stock turbine RE Amemyia RX7. Both around 2700 lbs in weight. Pretty evently match as far as FR machines goes.

Guess which one was the faster car? S15 was insanely fast on the straights but the overall better car was the RX7 as rated by Tsuchiya (JCTC, Winston cup and LEmans driver), ORido (JGTC driver) and Irida (LEmans winner). It got 100, 98, 100 on the score card. And the S15 got 96, 95, 90. And the RX7 still got a faster time around the circuit.

if you want to race me on a real race course you can. im always up for a fun run when corners and straights are involved. Im not going to rub it in anyone's face. I love my car and I think the SRT-4 is a good car too. I test drove both of them. But the MSP just clickd better to what I wanted and it also came with $3K off. WEll even choose a better course to fit the powerband of the SRT-4 and MSP. one with faster straights.

I felt the SRT-4 had a softer setting and understeered more in stock form. I did not like the transmission...it felt like a truck tranny...I assume its a T-56 off a dodge ram in FWD form. Perfect for handling power/torque but not smooth or percise in shifting. power and low end torque was there but didnt feel like it had the suspention to handle that power in stock form. Brilliant LSD. Tires were too narrow...breaks were good. Seats were amazing. and yes the interior reminded me of my uncles neon. Boost gauge was nice. I got to push the car in a nice area around here and yes I felt more give in the SRT-4. I didnt feel as confident as I did in the MSP when going from highspeed straightaway to low speed corners. I did a fake ghetto hairpin (uturn after flooring it). and I did a sloam and S-turn on a a street...same feeling. Just didnt feel as confident as I did in the MSP. Probally becasue the MSP was a bit stiffer and a bit more lower with wider tires. The SRT-4 will probalyl do better with stiff springs maybe a little bit of body bracing...thicker sway bars and etc. And most importanly wider tires. WTF is up with putting 205s on a what 16 or 17 inch wheel?

im completely stock except for SMIC and hardpipes...really bad Kuhomo 712s. I will post video of the autox I went to last week.

You can drive my car and tell me what you think and I will drive your car and tell you what I think.

I know your in Jersey im just saying 1st hand experience HP doesnt mean anything. Except for dyno queen, hard launches and unskillful straightaways showcasing who can read a tach and shift. I have chased down cars with more HP and I have been beat by cars with more HP.

Do straightaway deal with under and oversteer? Or drivelines?

What good is power if you can control it or put it down?

BAR honda has the most powerful F1 car in Formula 1 racing. Yet its not the fastest car on F1 :dunno: (besides bad drivers) I can go on with examples upon examples of what it means to be well tuned.
 
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Nolimits said:
It will never win, I will ALWAYS see the MSP in my rearview mirror, either spend an assload on a big turbo kit, or race an SRT-4 in a 30mph auto-x event. But in Drag Racing and in Road Racing, the big 3 (SRT-4, EVO, STi) will always dominate

http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp?section_id=31&article_id=221&page_number=1

I dont see SRT-4 here? Did I miss the Big 3 (EVO, SRT-4 and WRX)? Grip test:

You really begining to sound like a cocky SRT-4 owner so for your own good I would stop. Before you give SRT-4 owners a even worse rep.

Yes I see EVO and STi are out of range for me in stock form. But I do a pretty good job for what I have. I dont even come close. closest I got was probally within 3 seconds. That SRT-4 will have to be a damn good driver becuase on a FWD car you can put power in corners or you will do what they call "UNDERSTEER." AWD underrsteer but FWD understeers even more
 
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Wow there really are some stupid people here. Its a shame that some people cant look outside the world of Mazda. Personal insults and otherwise silly middle school comments really make this place seem like the place to be....
 
Its a shame some people cant look outside in the real world and see there is much more than internet racing.
 
Ok, fine... here are your specs, taken (w/o permission) from edmunds.com:


Quote:
2005 Dodge Neon Srt-4
Performance
Base Number of Cylinders: 4 Base Engine Size: 2.4 liters
Base Engine Type: Inline 4 Horsepower: 220 hp
Max Horsepower: 5100 rpm Torque: 245 ft-lbs.
Max Torque: 2400 rpm Drive Type: FWD
Turning Circle: 41 ft.

Fuel Data

Fuel
Fuel Tank Capacity: 12.5 gal.
EPA Mileage Estimates: (City/Highway)
Manual: 22 mpg / 30 mpg
Range in Miles: (City/Highway)
Manual: 275 mi. / 375 mi.




The Mazda 6s (6cyl) taken (w/o permission) from edmunds.com:


Quote:
Mazda 6s Sedan
Performance
Base Number of Cylinders: 6 Base Engine Size: 3 liters
Base Engine Type: V6 Horsepower: 220 hp
Max Horsepower: 6300 rpm Torque: 192 ft-lbs.
Max Torque: 5000 rpm Drive Type: FWD
Turning Circle: 38.7 ft.

Fuel Data

Fuel
Fuel Tank Capacity: 18 gal.
EPA Mileage Estimates: (City/Highway)
Manual: 19 mpg / 27 mpg Automatic: : 19 mpg / 27 mpg
Range in Miles: (City/Highway)
Automatic: 342 mi. / 486 mi. Manual: 342 mi. / 486 mi.




that mazda 6s did 152hp @6000 and 144ft-lbs @ 4881, STOCK, on a mustang today, If you want to compare your numbers, I will assume you car does the same in the "real world". I can beat the hell out of that car in a race, I do it everytime she tries to race me. Should I assume since your car is rated the same that I can walk all over your car too??? (According to the results, I had 14.5 more horses and 26 more ft-lbs).

Hell, maybe I am a bad driver, because reviewing all these results ON FRIGGIN PAPER, I should be smoking srt-4's all day long!!!!!!!!

get over it, your car sucks...

and p.s. my wenker is still bigger...

You cant be serious? Do you reasearch.
 

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