MP3 in GS Auto-X

[apexlater]

I think nationally I'd get my butt handed to me by the new Mini-S, and obviously the Celica. But I'm wondering/curious as to why the MP3 isn't competetive in GS? It certainly doesn't have the power or weight advantages, but the suspension geometry is dialed in nice.

I am disappointed in the tire choices I have for next season though. 225-45-17s rub from what I've read about the MSP. So no Hoosiers, so I'll probably run the 205-40-17 V700s. I wish there was a 215-40, but alas.

Just want to get some opinions.

 

[Matthew]

what do you mean you wish there was a 215/40? thats what i run on my car...

 

[RyanJayG]

I trhink he means in the V700s

 

[Matthew]

(hand)

 

[apexlater]

yeah, basically any R-compound that will heat up enough for Auto-x.

 

[dolphin]

apexlater,
If you do a search for autocoss and my user name, there are a lot of threads from a few years ago about autocrossing the MP3. We have been running it in a local PAXed street tire class mostly. The MP3 is very course dependent. If it is a twisty course that will let you maintain your momentum, then the MP3 does very well. At the first course that my daughter ran in over a year, she was just bearly beaten (less than half a second) by a DS SRT-4 both on street tires.

I did run 225/50-15 in FSP once or twice. I have not really looked for "R" tires for either it or the MSP. I think if you look in the MSP thread one of the "R" tires will just bearly fit with a light rub. I can't find it right now.

Here a few threads on autocrossing the MP3.
http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5784&highlight=autocross
http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9467&highlight=autocross
http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=11097&highlight=autocross
http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1334&highlight=autocross

Hope something here helps you.

 

[scapamouche]

The Kumho R-tires fit fine in 225/45-17. The Hoosiers rub badly with a +50 Offset, but might not rub at all with a +52 or +53 offset...

I'll be going back to Victo V700s when my current set of Hoosiers die, I think.

 

[apexlater]

Dolphin -- thanks for the threads, I'll have to check them out.

scap--do the Hoosiers rub the fender lip because they are too wide with a 50mm offset? I figured that they would have been rubbing the strut housing. I am trying to find a 17x7 50mm offset or even a 48mm offset and machine up to a 49mm offset so that it would be legal.

I just don't want the tires to drag on anything, and since we can't modify the fender or offset beyond 1/4inch (6mm) I'm looking at the 205-40s. Although if the 225-45-17s with a 50mm offset won't rub the lip or strut then I think they would be worth it over the gearing and weight savings of the 205-40-17 V700s.

 

[dmitrik4]

i think the MP3's main problem is that it's too heavy compared to cars like the Celica, and not powerful enough (and traction limited) compared to the MCS.

i also think it may be time to petition the Board to get the MP3 moved to HS.

 

[dolphin]

Yes, SCCA has a time machine that is importing their drugs from the 70's to the present. The SEB has a lot of things to consider and I would not want their job. Having said that, this one was obviously done before they came down from their high.

I still don't understand, how a car that is lighter and smaller with roughly the same power as my MazdaSpeed Protege belongs in GS. Thanks to the SEB's clever planning, now the Cooper S competes with my MP3. The MP3 is heavier, larger, camber challanged and has a raging 140 HP on Premium fuel. Yep that is real equal.

I am glad that I got my innoculation against SCCA National competition 20+ years ago.

 

[rustychops41]

Definetly the MP3 should be moved to HS. The Celicas with 145 HP, the Focus 145HP (2.3L) are all in HS. The new Cooper S w/ LSD will clean up in GS. I'm hoping they don't move some of the more competitive GS cars (Celica GTS, etc) to HS.

 

[apexlater]

I can see that HS can become a faster class, and who knows, once the new Mini makes its showing they may move it for 2006 to DS. They probably wouldn't move the MP3 to HS since no one has really proven it to be uncompetetive nationally. That's the reason the RSX Type-S got moved down to GS from DS because it wasn't competetive nationally. So until then I suppose the MP3 will just have to get it's ass handed until some of us can go National with it and see what it does.

 

[scapamouche]

The hoosiers rubbed because they stuck out too far with a 50 offset. I expect they will rub the strut housing with a 55 offset, but they MIGHT clear both with a 52 0r 53. In all honesty, I don't know and I doubt I'll spend to money to find out...

Why was the RSX moved but not the Celica GT-S??? It's no more competitive in DS than the RSX, and no more people tried to run one... On top of that, the Celica GT is FASTER on most autox courses!!!!!

 

[dmitrik4]

i didn't get that one either.

the MP3 isn't competitive REGIONALLY in GS, let alone nationally. why would someone bring a car to Nats that gets rocked in the local mall parking lot? (doh)

 

[TXMazdaSpeeder]

<TABLE cellSpacing=5 cellPadding=0 align=center border=0><TBODY><TR class=rowlow><TH class=titlehead noWrap align=left colSpan=5>Class: 'gs-G Stock' - Total Entries: 2 Trophies: 1</TH><TH class=titlehead noWrap></TH><TH class=titlehead noWrap></TH><TH class=titlehead noWrap></TH><TH class=titlehead noWrap></TH><TH class=titlehead noWrap></TH></TR><TR class=rowhigh><TD>1T</TD><TD></TD><TD>71</TD><TD noWrap>Chris Ketter</TD><TD noWrap>'03 Celica GT</TD><TD>55.909+dnf</TD><TD>48.150+2</TD><TD>47.664</TD><TD>47.732</TD><TD align=right>47.664</TD></TR><TR class=rowlow><TD>2 </TD><TD></TD><TD>842</TD><TD noWrap>Jeff Boyd</TD><TD noWrap>'01 Mazda MP3</TD><TD>57.272</TD><TD>54.666</TD><TD>54.052+1</TD><TD>58.030</TD><TD align=right>54.666</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=5 cellPadding=0 align=center border=0><TBODY><TR class=rowlow><TH class=titlehead noWrap align=left colSpan=5>Class: 'ds-D Stock' - Total Entries: 5 Trophies: 0</TH><TH class=titlehead noWrap></TH><TH class=titlehead noWrap></TH><TH class=titlehead noWrap></TH><TH class=titlehead noWrap></TH><TH class=titlehead noWrap></TH></TR><TR class=rowhigh><TD>1 </TD><TD></TD><TD>4</TD><TD noWrap>Christopher Mills</TD><TD noWrap>'01 Honda Prelude Type SH</TD><TD>51.044</TD><TD>50.651</TD><TD>49.687</TD><TD>51.108</TD><TD align=right>49.687</TD></TR><TR class=rowlow><TD>2 </TD><TD></TD><TD>55</TD><TD noWrap>Erik Moe</TD><TD noWrap>'02 Subaru WRX</TD><TD>51.310+dnf</TD><TD>52.050+1</TD><TD>50.718</TD><TD>50.644</TD><TD align=right>50.644</TD></TR><TR class=rowhigh><TD>3 </TD><TD></TD><TD>65</TD><TD noWrap>Chris Ward</TD><TD noWrap>'98 BMW 328i</TD><TD>52.375+dnf</TD><TD>52.669</TD><TD>51.671</TD><TD>52.531+1</TD><TD align=right>51.671</TD></TR><TR class=rowlow><TD>4 </TD><TD></TD><TD>171</TD><TD noWrap>Todd Leister</TD><TD noWrap>'03 Subaru WRX</TD><TD>54.702</TD><TD>54.904</TD><TD>54.638</TD><TD>53.874</TD><TD align=right>53.874</TD></TR><TR class=rowhigh><TD>5 </TD><TD></TD><TD>8</TD><TD noWrap>Eric Marusa</TD><TD noWrap>'03 Subaru Impreza</TD><TD>55.897</TD><TD>55.255</TD><TD>54.200</TD><TD>54.904</TD><TD align=right>54.200</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>





theres some comparitive times from the last auto-x i went to, not to mention as far as auto-x goes im a pretty bad driver (im anxious and get on the gas to early coming out of corners and i tend to go into corners to hot) and i was running 215/45/17 bridgestone fuzion ZRi's front/215/45/17 Cooper Avenger ZHP's in rear.

 

[dolphin]

Here is a link to the results from one of my events in running the MP3 in 2002. I finished 1st and my daughter 4th in the Daily Driver street tire class. This was on the stock 205/45-17 SP9K tires.

http://www.azbrscca.org/Results/2002/feb02.html

The course favored the MP3 since you could mantain your momentum also the surface was sort of slick so you could not get a lot of power down.

 

[TXMazdaSpeeder]

Here is a link to the results from one of my events in running the MP3 in 2002. I finished 1st and my daughter 4th in the Daily Driver street tire class. This was on the stock 205/45-17 SP9K tires.

http://www.azbrscca.org/Results/2002/feb02.html

The course favored the MP3 since you could mantain your momentum also the surface was sort of slick so you could not get a lot of power down.

dunflops lol, i hated those tires

 

[dolphin]

Lots of people hate the SP9K but is was good enough for first in class and I would have won the soft STX class. The one good thing about the SP9K is that it is consistant. It doesn't change from run to run in the heat like the Azenis especially after the second run. It does take lots of air pressure to get them to stay off the sidewalls.

The MP3 can not compete with a well driven 05 Cooper S but it is fun to drive and a good learner's car. The biggest reason I went back to the Miata was because the tires are cheaper.

 

[TXMazdaSpeeder]

the dunflops were horrible on the street, never got a chance to auto-x on them, im going victoracers next

 

[dolphin]

Never had a problem with the SP9K except there was one that was hard to balance. Of course, it doesn't get that cold or wet down here.

If you mean the Victoracer V700, you will like them. I have had them on several cars and they work well, lasted nicely and for an "R" tire are easy to drive. On my MX-6 LS the 225/50-15 lasted for > 15 months but I was only running 1 or 2 events a month.