MBC install

kwiktsi

Member
:
05 Pontiac GTO
OK guys, I told you I would post instruction on my MBC install. I didn't have time to get pics, but I can take some "after" pics if needed. It was a piece of cake, just a b!tch to get to one of the hoses- still only about a 5 minute job. I'll start by saying I had 5 psi stock according to the Autometer gauge, I am now running 10 and it drops to about 8.5 by redline- may be the tiny turbo can't keep up or it may be the BOV leaking, have to look into it. All I can say is- I can't believe that I keep forgetting how impressed I am with ANY turbo car I ever turn the boost up on. It is the best bang for the buck, screw the K&N, screw the CAI- wait until you get the MBC in :).. If I jump on it in first, it just spins to the rev limiter and then I hit second and it will spin through a good part of second with ease now :).. Of course, you can control it with the throttle, but I am just saying how much more power the car is making. I think at 10 psi, it is more than the 15 hp that we were guessing at. I would say we are closer to the 8-10 hp per psi than the 6-8 that I was using as a reference!!! Now I at least think the car has a fighting chance at being called quick :). Can't wait until we do exhaust and such!!!

Hehe, had to show some moron in a Golf VR6 with exhaust and such the he didn't have anything :)..

Anyway- If you follow the hose from the BOV, you will see that it goes to a Tee. The "back" hose on the tee goes to the intake, the "bottom" one goes to the wastegate. The hoses are glued to the tee, but I used a small flathead screwdriver and worked the hose off with ease. You have to reach underneath and re-reoute this hose so you can have a little more to work with, kind of a b**** but you will see what I am talking about when you get to it. This hose goes to the "outlet" of the MBC (see the instructions when you get it) and then you need about 8" (if that) of 3/16" hose to run from the inlet of the MBC to the Tee. I just rolled the Tee and hoses so it faced up and towards the engine and routed the hose from there to the MBC. It was simple and you will be very impressed :).. Also, before I installed the MBC, I opened the valve and blew through it while turning the screw back in *just* to the point where I couldn't easily blow through it anymore. That was my 10 psi on the dot!!

Let me know if you guys have any questions. Thanks.
Joe

PS- I have to say this- I am not recommending that you all go out and run 10 psi and blow your cars up tomorrow and blame me :).. I am just saying that is what I am running and I am having no problems. I will know more once the A/F gauge goes in next week.. Also, I do not recommend holding the car wot down the highway with questionably high boost without monitoring everything very closely :).
 
Last edited:
Wow! Joe: so; you're thinking over 15hp with nothing else?! You feel 10psi is safe for us? Sounds mighty sweet! Where did you mount the MBC?

And yes; photos are what we all want, I'm sure. Always a help.
 
Last edited:
I am saying I doin't know if 10 psi is safe :).. I have done several 1st and 2nd gear pulls, but didn't get too many highway pulls yet :(.. I want to wait until I can monitor my AF ratio anyway before really pushing it down the highway at that boost level. A 9:1 motor should be able to handle at least 12-13 psi on pump gas, but I don't know about the timing and fuel control of the car or even what the fuel supply is. I will have more answers as time goes on. It is the first nice day since I have gotten the car, so as the weather clears up, I will be spending more time tweaking and tuning :).

And yes, much more than a 15 hp increase :).. Not to mention the faster spool up of a ball and spring MBC :).. My fiancee had a huge grin after taking it for a ride today :)..
 
Excellent! I think many here have mentioned; it is safe to 10psi, but I think, I would be happy to keep it around 9.5psi for a cushion. Sounds like this is all going to be very exciting. (thumb)
 
One thing to keep in mind is even though it hits 10 psi, byt the end of second, it drops to about 8.5-9, so you would be safe anyway :).. I haven't gotten to hold until the top of 3rd though to see if it gets the same drop off..

I have taken some pics and will put them here in a few minutes- www.joepmbc.com/msp.htm .. Just give me time to get the pics on my computer and make the page up real quick.
Joe
 
One of the key questions I have, and one that many others will have as well is; Are we going to be able to do this (as apparently you have), without making A/F adjustments, remapping, etc...? I sure as hell hope so; otherwise, this cat is lost! :cool:
 
If you had to make mapping changes just to increase the boost a few PSI, that would make this the worst tuner car I have ever laid hands on :).. The ECU should cover for a slight increase such as this with no problems. Plus the fuel pressure regulator is a rising-rate, so it will increase fuel pressure with boost regardless of what the ECU will do. My only concern was timing maps and how effective the knock control system is, but I haven't seen any signs of detonation on the plugs and there is no audible detonation. I'm sure the timing curves are kind of conservative to make up for people putting cheap gas and such in the car..

The pics are up on my page aty the link I gave you- www.joepmbc.com/msp.htm .. I will also post a link to it under the pic of my MSP on my main page in a few. I may even just put the instructions from above there too. Thanks.
Joe
 
Pics and instructions are now up on my site. The link is above and also I have it on my main page www.joepmbc.com below the pic of my MSP.

I have an electronic controller that is adapted to my MBC to make all adjustments from inside the car instead of popping the hood and turning the knob. Nice because it can be done on the fly. Downside is I am honestly not 100% happy with the looks/size of the control box. I am at the mercy of my electronics guy though until I have the $$$ for a redesign.. In all honesty though, it works awesome and allows for extremely fine boost adjustment- which is what I wanted :).. Thanks.
Joe
 
I'll let you know if the turbo can hold it to redline when I get mine, I can adjust my BOV to handle extra boost. I want that thing NOW Joe!!! =) I'll have my A/F gauge finished tonight, just needed to extend a wire on it.

Not sure if I hookup to PIN #94 or #60. I'm guessing #60 since it's the shielded wire (Pink/Blue). 94 is (LG/R).
 
turboge said:
I'll let you know if the turbo can hold it to redline when I get mine, I can adjust my BOV to handle extra boost. I want that thing NOW Joe!!! =) I'll have my A/F gauge finished tonight, just needed to extend a wire on it.

Not sure if I hookup to PIN #94 or #60. I'm guessing #60 since it's the shielded wire (Pink/Blue). 94 is (LG/R).

Another thread I read said pin 60 is the O2 wire. Someone also mentioned that the rear O2 would give you a more stable reading- DO NOT use the rear O2 to monitor your A/F!!! That is an after cat reading, it is more stable because the cat is doing it's job. The one before the cat shows the AF ratio of the gasses leaving the motor- therefore, that is the one you NEED to use to monitor things :).
Joe
PS- Oh yeah- keep me posted on the boost to redline thing :).. Also, what kind of BOV are you using and what did you use for an adaptor?
 
you really don't NEED an a/f guage. you only need an egt guage. if your good you can tell if your rich or lean by looking at the egts.
 
Cost effectiveness at our level of mods, an EGT is overkill... I tuned my Talon by the "butt dyno" and my AF gauge and it was 464 hp first pull on the dyno, after some dyno tuning we got 487 by the end of the day.. I think I got it pretty damn close for just an AF gauge :).
Joe
 
Not unless you are using a standalone or something to highly modify the fuel and timing curves. An EGT won't tell you much unless the car is tuned right. I've seen them read all kinds of crazy numbers in the wrong situations. It is a good tuning tool, but un-necessary for actual tuning.

The main thing you need to know is the engine and its limits. From there you can adjust the A/F on a wideband, and begin playing with timing. The fun part is tuning on a steady state load giving dyno..... like a Mustang dyno, can't beat realtime ;)

Joe: I am using a TurboXS H25 recirc valve. No adapters. Not quite a simple bolt on unless you have access to some good rubber bending equipment.
 
It is nice on highly modded cars. These guys are not going nuts.. As for it being a necessity, tuning on the street to within 23 hp of my max hp without the car ever seeing an EGT gauge (except for the dyno tune) says something :)..

I agree, they are very nice tuning tools and they can save you from disaster, but not everyone needs one. Most people here will never push their cars that hard, so why recommend a $200+ gauge when a $60 gauge will suit them just fine? Maybe it is just because I came into the turbo thing by tuning with a volt meter to monitor O2's and still went faster than most at the time :).

Joe
 
turboge said:
Not unless you are using a standalone or something to highly modify the fuel and timing curves. An EGT won't tell you much unless the car is tuned right. I've seen them read all kinds of crazy numbers in the wrong situations. It is a good tuning tool, but un-necessary for actual tuning.

The main thing you need to know is the engine and its limits. From there you can adjust the A/F on a wideband, and begin playing with timing. The fun part is tuning on a steady state load giving dyno..... like a Mustang dyno, can't beat realtime ;)

Joe: I am using a TurboXS H25 recirc valve. No adapters. Not quite a simple bolt on unless you have access to some good rubber bending equipment.

Well put, thanks..

Do you have any pics you can email me of the BOV install?
Joe
 
Back