FM Turbo Protege Dyno!

[Stou]

I run my MP3 at 8 psi with original fuel pump and 2 extras injectors for 4 month now. The only problem I have is that it is runing too rich!!!

My setup is more like the Spoolin setup. I don't run it with an AFPR and maybe that's why the stock fuel pump is enough.

I run it with the stock timing on 94 octane gaz and never get any detonation problem. I read somewhere "the MP3 uses a knock sensor (which the other 2.0l engine's don't)". Can someone have a shop manual to check that? If it's true, that mean the ECU can retard the timing if necessary. That's why I don't have any detonation problem.

 

[TurboDog's Dad]

Stou,
You read wrong. All recent Proteges have knock sensors. Having access to 94 octane fuel is helping you a lot. We need to design our kits to run on the crap that the majority of the country gets, which is now 91 octane. The reason you can get away with stock pump is that you are running additional injectors at stock fuel pressure. Stock pumps put out plenty of volume, but become taxed when asked to make more pressure, as in an FPR based setup like we are running. We just got a Thermal exhaust in, have to get some fuel pressure, then run on the dyno again. We do have the advantage of having a dyno in-house with wideband o2 sensor, so that we can come up with something safe. For the MP3, we may be able to move the crank trigger pick-up, should it become necessary. 'Til someone brings one here, we won't know.

 

[smp3000]

For the MP3, we may be able to move the crank trigger pick-up, should it become necessary. 'Til someone brings one here, we won't know.

Well, I could be that person. It's about a 10-11 hour drive, but I might be willing to sacrafice one for the team.

 

[70]

Stou,
You read wrong. All recent Proteges have knock sensors. Having access to 94 octane fuel is helping you a lot. We need to design our kits to run on the crap that the majority of the country gets, which is now 91 octane. The reason you can get away with stock pump is that you are running additional injectors at stock fuel pressure. Stock pumps put out plenty of volume, but become taxed when asked to make more pressure, as in an FPR based setup like we are running. We just got a Thermal exhaust in, have to get some fuel pressure, then run on the dyno again. We do have the advantage of having a dyno in-house with wideband o2 sensor, so that we can come up with something safe. For the MP3, we may be able to move the crank trigger pick-up, should it become necessary. 'Til someone brings one here, we won't know.

I'm only a four hour drive from you guys...Make it easier on smp3000. Denver to GJ isn't far...

I can make the trip over the mountains Monday morning (08-26-02) on my next day off...Just let me know.

 

[smp3000]

hehe, but I already have the kit

 

[1sty]

I'm sure Keith won't mind doing both installs.

 

[Keith@FP]

We don't have any spare kits sitting around here yet, so you'll have to order one first I think there's one left at the "original 10" price, but Corky can tell you. I'd love to see an MP3 in here.

Keith

 

[smp3000]

Keith,

I'd be willing to drive up possibly late September with my Kit. Stephanie at BEGI informed me hat my kit should arrive in 2 weeks.

All I need to know is how many days I should plan on staying up there while the install and tuning take place.

If you would be interested email me at
webmaster@smp3000.net

 

[spoolinmp3]

WOW!
I am gone for a few days and there are like 200 posts in the F/I Forum along with posts from the turbo gurus Kieth and Bill at dealer alternative...welecome to the forum guys

As far as the mp3 timing is concerened I am unsure if we get detonation as well and if timing needs to be retarded. There are many factors that are also involved such as altitude, average temps fuel octane ect. I just decided to go with the link for saftey reasons since the mp3 has advanced timong over the p5. As for the fuel pump I am currently using an inline that acts like a vacum and sucks fuel from the primary pump and accelerates the flow. I dont think its needed on my current configuration because like Kieth stated earlier I am not taxing the mp3 fuel pump due to my addl injector setup. I would highly reccomend using one on a FMU setup since it increases the burden on the stock pump.

 

[smp3000]

Spoolin,

Where can I get a piggyback link, and how much do they cost?

 

[70]

We don't have any spare kits sitting around here yet, so you'll have to order one first I think there's one left at the "original 10" price, but Corky can tell you. I'd love to see an MP3 in here.

Keith

I knew there would be a catch in there somewhere. I still plan on coming over for stock dyno session, soon.

I'll see about the turbo side of it.

 

[Keith@FP]

Spoolin,

Where can I get a piggyback link, and how much do they cost?

Spoolin got his from us: Flyin' Miata piggyback link

However, that particular item includes a wiring harness that's built for the Miata and will require some adaptation to fit a Proteg. You would also need to find a way to plumb in the extra injectors. On the Miatas, we put them in the the intake manifold runners. Oh, it'll also run electronic boost control if you want.

Just be aware of what you're doing. It's not a plug-in install at the moment. Even the default programming is designed for a Miata engine.

Keith

 

[smp3000]

Hmmmmmm.....

Yikes, doesn't sound like something I want to get myself into

I might just go with the Apexi ITC if it's needed. We're going to talk to Corky today. Also, concerning the fuel issue.

 

[Keith@FP]

Keep in mind that the ITC retards timing purely on rpm. This means that it pulls the same timing whether you're at part throttle or full boost - not the ideal scenario.

Putting in a controller that also uses manifold pressure would be preferable. There are a few of those available, such as the MSD box.

Keith

 

[Stou]

I think that the Greddy e-manage is maybe a better device for tuned the timing and the fuel for a setup like mine, and it can control the 2 extras injectors.

But I don't know anybody who use this device. What do you think about that Keith?

 

[TurboDog's Dad]

If it is supported like the rest of Greddy's stuff it probably wouldn't matter how good it is. I've never seen one, so can't comment on the product itself.

 

[Keith@FP]

We've found on the Miata that running four extra injectors (one per cylinder) makes for much better running than two stuck in the intake tract. I don't know anything about the eManage myself so I don't know if it will handle four.

Keep in mind that simply having the hardware in your car is not guarantee that everything will work properly. It has to be installed and tuned correctly. Take this into consideration...

Keith

 

[Stou]

Actually my 2 extras injectors are controlled by an SDS controller. This controller work fine but I think that my runing rich situation on WOT is cause more by the stock ECU that is runing on the safe mode at WOT. That's why I'm looking for a timing and fuel control device like the e-manage to overide the stock ECU for fine tuning.

I know the Link can do the job, Spoolin prove it but it's a kind of expensive unit and it must be adpated to the MP3. Are you planing to adapte it for the Proteg (plug-in install and base program) ?

But like I wrote earlier, my car is runing great and this is only for a very fine tuning.

 

[Keith@FP]

We may do a Proteg-friendly version of the Link, yes. It's the subject of some discussion around here. We don't have the next year fully mapped out

Keith

 

[Kooldino]

You would also need to find a way to plumb in the extra injectors. On the Miatas, we put them in the the intake manifold runners. Keith

Extra injectors? I don't like the sound of that...why not just BIGGER injectors?