Engine Ticking noise

[Fakhelek]

Ok, I was just reading along looking for some info because I heard from someone the newer FS series motors had solid lifters. Which it's obvious now that I'm reading this post that they are not. I've owned a 96 Probe SE for 3 years and have read up on this "ticking". It is the lifters which are Hydraulic adjustable that make the noise. Here's an interesting post on my home board by the GT guys who have the mazda 2.5L KL series motor. They also have the ticking.

HLA, what are they, why do they tick, how to clean them, dissassemly/reassembly.....

This is what makes the noise. Reason why is the oil pumps in these mazda engines are fairly week and that combination with the HLA's makes for what you hear. It's quite annoying as the car gets older it will get louder as well. I'm looking for ways to bump the pressure up on my probe's oil pump. I know of a few people who have shimmed the oil pressure relieve valve up and that has seemed to fix the problem. There's a write up about that on our board too if anyone is interested.

Thanks! I have a '95 Probe that has ticked for years and I could never figure it out (or get it diagnosed even). I thought that maybe the valves were damaged or something.

 

[lowerdfool]

thats correct our lifters are solid, with shims.

Anybody got 16 lifters they wanna get rid of?

 

[MikeBlueP5]

nah but if they are the same size and all for a probe and are all interchangeable i might be able to scoop some up from my work if you are serious about getting some. I rebuild cylinder heads, also what size probe engine is it, 2.0 or the 2.5 v6?
edit: just thought about it and you will have to have the shims too, if they are interchangeable, to get the lash right.

 

[Dark Ringleader]

its the valves. have you heard dsm's they do it bad!

yup I know mine does

 

[lowerdfool]

nah but if they are the same size and all for a probe and are all interchangeable i might be able to scoop some up from my work if you are serious about getting some. I rebuild cylinder heads, also what size probe engine is it, 2.0 or the 2.5 v6?
edit: just thought about it and you will have to have the shims too, if they are interchangeable, to get the lash right.

I have a 2.0l also. It's the same in the series as yours. I'm interested in at least trying these. I can mic mine tonight when I get off work and give you a diameter and length but mine are hydraulic and it'll be hard to give a length dimension since they move. It's worth a shot though. I've got a spare motor sittin in my garage at the moment that's stripped down for rebuilding so It won't be any problem to try and if they don't work give them back or just sell them off. :shrug: Thanks for the help...

 

[lowerdfool]

OK, here's the dimensions I came up with for my lifters. (Height=distance between the top of the valve to the cam) the height is .746 I'm guessing when it's running it's closer towards .75. and the diameter of the lifter is 1.180. you can check and find out if they are the same. I'd imagine they're close. If the protege lifters are taller in height I can probably get them machined down to make them work.

 

[Wild_MSP]

On this website that lists a bunch of a Mazda Tech Support Bulletin's (http://web2.airmail.net/emann/protegefaq/tsb/) they say it's normal, here's the text:

hmmm.. I just checked on this website and here's what they say:
http://web2.airmail.net/emann/protegefaq/tsb/01-004-03.html
________________________
APPLICABLE MODEL(S)/VINS
2001-2003 Protege (2.0L FS only)
2002-2003 Protege5
(...)
There is a counter-measure to help reduce the noise in order to improve customer satisfaction.
Customers having this concern should have their vehicle repaired using one of the following procedures:
(...)
Reprogram the PCM using WDS (Version B22 or later), verify the correct calibration from the table below
(...)
________________________

So if I understand correctly, we can get this fixed under warranty!

 

[MikeBlueP5]

lowered aight i will check tomorrow morning about them, if i can scrounge up a few, i think i should be able to since they were used in different engines, i know the FS2 mazda has them, they are almost if not the same design as the FS9 which the p5 has. also the other dimension that i was looking for was the top of the "bucket" to the bottom. I know the gap between the top of the valve and the cam lobe will differ, hence why i said that you will need shims to get the right clearance, since it isnt hydraulic and cant close up the gap on its own you have to do it manually. Speaking of which i think the manual for our cars recommend doing it every 75k miles or so. But i will check the dimensions tomorrow at work, the main one is the diameter.

 

[lowerdfool]

top to bottom of bucket is .937

 

[MikeBlueP5]

aight, i checked at work and the only lifters we had are from the FS2 head, i thought they were adjustable but they are not. they are hydraulic too. the dimensions are pretty close to what you gave me, i got diameter=1.1815/1.182, and they are .948 tall from the top of the bucket to the bottom. I also looked for the KL series heads out of the v6 millenia and i couldnt find any heads and all the parts we had from them are the cams and the caps and bolts that hold the cams in, no lifters i was like damn. Unless i can find another head with the same dimension lifters that are solid i guess the FS9 head, which is whats on our 2.0L p5s then it would be a dealer only item.

 

[lowerdfool]

I've heard of my engine being considered the fs2 before but so many people ruled that as not the name of the motor that we just call it the fs series. Is fs2 marked on the head and what car was that out of? I'd be willing to bet it's identical to what I have now.

also I believe the size differences are probably within their tolenerences from the factory. .0015 isn't much of a difference on anything. That can change with the temperature. Or with defferent types of measureing tools. I used micrometers.

 

[perfworks]

the fs block hasnt changed.
the head has.
the head without going to the pics think was a fs9
and your right .0015 isnt bad although it should be the same all around

 

[MikeBlueP5]

yeah the head will be marked, usually on this series of engines on the front where the exhaust manifold bolts up to. The newer 2.0 proteges have the FS9 cast, the older 2.0s, were a cast FS2, but other than them being hydraulic, or adjustable everything is the same pretty much. also i took my measurements with a digital caliper

 

[TheMAN]

the block has revised 5 times already

93-97 FS-DE's have HLAs, disty, crank, and a different set of cams
98+ FS-DE's have solid lifters, no disty, solid lifter cams

the lifters are interchangable between the engines, just like it is on the 90-97 BP and 99-00 BP

there is a TSB on the 93-97 MX-6/626 about HLA ticking

the fs block hasnt changed.
the head has.
the head without going to the pics think was a fs9
and your right .0015 isnt bad although it should be the same all around

 

[lowerdfool]

This thread is great for info thanks a lot with all your help.

 

[Kooldino]

One different idea for the clicking..I forget where it leads, but there is a little thing on a metal bracket (with stuff on it) that would normally go on the 90* rubber elbow to your TB on a stock car. Mine clicks...I can hear & feel it click...check that out.

 

[MikeBlueP5]

yes i have read of what you are talking about and it is some type of supposed purge solenoid, but im not sure what it is, i havent researched it enough, i have however felt it and listened to it while at idle last week, and its not loud enough to be what we are talking about.

 

[perfworks]

the block has revised 5 times already

93-97 FS-DE's have HLAs, disty, crank, and a different set of cams
98+ FS-DE's have solid lifters, no disty, solid lifter cams

the lifters are interchangable between the engines, just like it is on the 90-97 BP and 99-00 BP

there is a TSB on the 93-97 MX-6/626 about HLA ticking

thanks for the update

 

[TheMAN]

my car makes none of those ticking noises at all (quieter than a honda 4 banger)... it runs quiet as hell... even AFTER the I changed the cams

yes, the engine see redline daily... but it also gets treated with Red Line oil

 

[MikeBlueP5]

the best way to explain it would be to search for wshade, the member on here who was the prototype for BEGI, he has a few videos on his webpage and in one of them you can hear the ticking quite clearly. I use mobil 1 synthetic, i couldnt imagine that redline would be much much better, but im not saying its not as i havent tried it. the only thing i can think of is that it has something to do with a aftermarket intake, as mine didnt do it when the car was new, but the intake went on before i broke the 1k mile mark, and shortly there after i noticed it, also TheMan what year is your car, mine is a 02 but i think it was produced in 01 i bought it in late january of 02, im not sure when they started making the p5s so it might have something to do with the run that my car was in, i dunno, only time will tell i guess.
Michael
EDIT:I just checked wshades video page and it no longer is working, but i have it on my hard drive so if anyone wants them just lemme know. I will email them to you.