Calling all MS3 Owners with smoking Turbos...

[zoom-zoomhatch]

I have a '07 with about 17k on the clock and full tbe w/ high flow cat and I only get smoke if it sits and idles for awhile after being driven hard. Like if I get off the highway and sit at a long light it will smoke and then when I go it will stop.

 

[AutoXRacer]

I have a '07 with about 17k on the clock and full tbe w/ high flow cat and I only get smoke if it sits and idles for awhile after being driven hard. Like if I get off the highway and sit at a long light it will smoke and then when I go it will stop.

Have you tried to get it fixed by the dealer?

 

[AutoXRacer]

So far we have 5 members with smoking turbos. All are 2007 models at this point in the 8K-20K mileage range; they are all equipped with DPs (Cork Sport and CP-E; half with high flow cats).

Anyone else?

 

[SuperStretch18]

Just FYI, the MS6 guys had the same problems (search "smoking exhaust" on the 6 boards and you will see a ton of threads). The smoke you are seeing are not a result of the exhaust. The problem had to have been existing and the removal of the cats just lets the smoke out. There are probably many, many more folks with stock exhausts that are smoking pre-cats and will never know it. Dreading the day that my CX-7 has the same issues.

Craig, mods or not, you shouldn't be losing 1qt every 1k miles! If Wayne Mazda doesn't help you (27 years in Jersey and two dealers that I would avoid like the plague are Wayne Mazda and Bob Ciassuli; they both suck), you should try another local dealer like Ramsey. That's a time-bomb you got there! Hope all works out!

 

[Craighjr]

Craig, mods or not, you shouldn't be losing 1qt every 1k miles! If Wayne Mazda doesn't help you (27 years in Jersey and two dealers that I would avoid like the plague are Wayne Mazda and Bob Ciassuli; they both suck), you should try another local dealer like Ramsey. That's a time-bomb you got there! Hope all works out!

Thanks I will keep my eye on the oil level at this point I don't want them tearing my stuff apart when its so new. I'll burn up the turbo a bit and have them replace it towards the warranty end. Then I'll upgrade to a Garrett and hope anything that would break (lines, bolts, and such) they would have broken when they did it under warranty.

 

[cosmic_spd3]

My feeling is once u remove the cats or put any open exhaust ur taking away the back pressure from the engine and lil back pressure = blown seals especially on turbo cars and then here comes the smoking issue..

 

[funkyman]

Heheheh i`m glad i haven`t messed around with my exhaust system,i don`t think i will either after reading this lol thanx

 

[AutoXRacer]

Don't mean to jack the thread, but to answer your question. I found the issue why the car had strong burnt fuel fumes...... And the blonde reason is............................ Gasket was put on incorrectly. I'm happy yet irritated all at the sametime.

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f230/Staples187/IMGP0102.jpg

^ That's the picture of the gasket being put on incorrectly as you can see the white sticking out. I'm pissed at Agile Performance in Maryland for putting it on incorrectly.

(omg)NO WAY!!!! I guess its a good thing you found out what it was...
Will you have that shop fix the problem?

My feeling is once u remove the cats or put any open exhaust ur taking away the back pressure from the engine and lil back pressure = blown seals especially on turbo cars and then here comes the smoking issue..

I don't think thats a normal condition for seals to blow out. I had an old 1984 Turbo Coupe with a straight thru exhaust and it never smoked or leaked oil!!! And all the other turbo cars I've seen with open exhausts never smoked either... Can someone confirm or negate this comment?

 

[AutoXRacer]

Heheheh i`m glad i haven`t messed around with my exhaust system,i don`t think i will either after reading this lol thanx

Don't get discouraged!! Better to know if your turbo is leaking than ignoring it... Obviously, this is not a normal condition and if more people keep showing up at dealers with this problem, maybe Mazda will make it a recall item....????

 

[cosmic_spd3]

Dude its a known fact..i've yet to see a heavily modded turbo car that doesnt smoke..especially going to a 3" pipe..
i had a 89 supra turbo modded with 3" exhaust from turbo back and this wasnt stock turbo either..i had a turbonetics t66 on their..and just kept blowing the seals..dont get me wrong the engine breathes better but also didnt have any back pressure..once u start slowing or gearing down thats when u see it all...a puff of light blue smoke..
these care are still fairly new and shouldnt be smoking but like i said taking away back pressure would do that..

 

[Craighjr]

Don't get discouraged!! Better to know if your turbo is leaking than ignoring it... Obviously, this is not a normal condition and if more people keep showing up at dealers with this problem, maybe Mazda will make it a recall item....????

Don't hold your breath for a recall on this. They will never replace every turbo under warranty unless its making the cars burst into flames.

 

[SuperStretch18]

My feeling is once u remove the cats or put any open exhaust ur taking away the back pressure from the engine and lil back pressure = blown seals especially on turbo cars and then here comes the smoking issue..

There are some that put the stock exhaust back on and the smoking stops...

http://www.mazdas247.com/forum/showpost.php?p=3011093&postcount=56

 

[AutoXRacer]

I don't know guys... We need to get an expert in here...or at least someone with experience with turbos.

To me. looking at it through the eyes of an engineer, I don't think its normal. Seals should seal regardless of back pressure. I doubt when turbos are bench tested, they (the engineers) create an artificial back pressure so the seals don't blow out...

Like I said before, I had an 84 Turbo Coupe and it never smoked...

And there are other members on the forum (Laloosh for example) that have free flowing exhausts with no smoke.

I am really stressing on this... I've got this pipe coming and now I am hesitant to install it...I'm almost tempted to call PG and cancel the order!!

 

[Sierra117]

Its not a vehicle wide issue, its a hit or miss sort of thing. Like something didn't get nailed coming out of QC because of the fact that most people aren't going to disassemble the exhaust and check the seals. If you notice, there are those with stock exhausts getting smoke. It just is less prevalent because the cats/resonator/muffler will catch most of it. I see it as the same thing as the motor mount recall, just a little less disasterous when it fails. And because, like fourthmeal said, its not causing cars to blow up or such, chances of a recall are minimal.

 

[fourthmeal]

LOL...wish I were wrong though. I'd love to have updated seals so I could modify without fear. Plus, how in the hell are we going to pass emissions with particulate soot and oil vapors in our exhaust?!

Oh wait,...they've got this figured out because the car itself doesn't show anything at fault, which is how the emissions are tested for a car of this age. If someone stuck a sniffer on the tailpipe, I bet the story would be different altogether.

Also, to expound on this issue: If a seal like this was failing on a stock car (which is possible), one could easily get it handled under the emissions law requirements currently in place. A new turbo could be installed for a simple a reason as failing smog. Something to think about.

 

[User Name]

I had a turbo Miata before the MS3 with a very free flowing 2.5" exhaust, it did have a high flow cat, with zero smoking issues. I ran it for a little while without a cat and didn't even have black smoke out the back, it did smell like hell for anyone following behind me though.

There is no reason for a brand new car with a brand new turbo to be smoking with or without cats to burn off any signs of an oil leak. This seems to be a case of Mazda typically going with the cheapest supplier and then saying there is no problem.

 

[tru-boost]

My feeling is once u remove the cats or put any open exhaust ur taking away the back pressure from the engine and lil back pressure = blown seals especially on turbo cars and then here comes the smoking issue..

if the seals actually have "blown" the problem would not go away when the stock stuff goes back on. several people, including myself have put stock exhaust back on to bring it in for a warranty repair. once the stock first cat goes back in....no more smoke.

 

[PLM_Man]

if the seals actually have "blown" the problem would not go away when the stock stuff goes back on. several people, including myself have put stock exhaust back on to bring it in for a warranty repair. once the stock first cat goes back in....no more smoke.

^^ Interesting.
You might have posted this already, but have you had to add oil between oil changes? If so, has it....stopped burning oil when the stock exhaust is put back on? This topic just gets more and more puzzling. Maybe, probably not, but maybe the seals are designed to actually "seal" only when back-pressure is available from the first cat. Removing that cat decreases back pressure, which maybe litterally weakens the "seal" that can be made in the turbo, almost like a leaking safety valve on an air compressor can't fully close or something.

I can only speculate because I have limited experience with turbos. I don't truely believe that less restrictive exhausts are causing turbo seal failures. If that were the case, then why wouldn't these aftermarket companies be offering exhausts with 2 high flow cats to try and prevent seal failure. I'm kind of sold on "hit or miss" or "driving/maintenance habits" or even "cheap materials" to allow such a great MSRP price.

Just my opinion. Like a-holes, we've all gottem.

 

[Natedog_37]

have a 1989 conquest with 73K on her. 3" exhuast no cats, race muffler, and a big 16G and she dosn't smoke. Have but 2,000 miles on her since the new turbo. These cars should not smoke, and I pray my new ones dosn't.

 

[Craighjr]

It is the design of the turbo seal on the car. Stop posting about your old car that didn't smoke. We know its unusual and most other cars don't smoke (my WRX included) but the current Mazda design is flawed once modified thats basically it.