Best suspension upgrade for auto-xing

[jmv]

So i did my second auto-x event yesterday, and i've decided that i really love doing that and want to do it more. Currently i'm in (N)DSP, because of my intercooler and stuff. Although i'm not going to build my car completely around auto-x classing, i was wondering what the best suspension upgrade for a stock MSP setup would be to try and remain in the same class and improve my handling??

One thing i had thought about was the megan racing springs, they've got really stiff rates and they're only $100, but i dunno if real stiff springs with the stock tocikos would cause any problems. Or maybe some GTSpec something or other would be a better alternative??

Any suggestions welcome!!

 

[crazyGJ]

I always thought best mod for auto-x was tires. it does seem to make the biggest difference for most people.

 

[apexlater]

I always thought best mod for auto-x was tires. it does seem to make the biggest difference for most people.

+1, get dedicated wheels and tires. Your times will be around 2 seconds faster over a 60 second course...YMMV.

After that, I would think getting a RSB would help with some more roll-resistance, and I would think that getting springs would need new struts as well. I think the Tokicos are valved really well to the RB springs as it is.

 

[low_psi]

Dedicated wheels and tires.

 

[aMaff]

no disagreement here.

 

[FunkyBuddha]

tires, wider wheels, swaybars.

 

[Vanimaniac]

Learn on your stock tires or at least some good street tires first before getting R-comps. I went to R-comps after my second autocross and masked a lot of bad habits that were revealed to me when I went to a street tire class this year.

Get suspension with adjustability. That's key. Adjustable shocks. Adjustable camber, even adjustable sways if you want.

Being able to change your setup due to surface/conditions/temps, etc is a plus.

Van

 

[low_psi]

The last thing he needs to worry about right now is tweaking the suspension IMO. Get some RT615s and do a few events to get used to the dynamics of the car.

Adjustability comes later, but before rcomps

 

[jmv]

hmmmm


i dunno if i can afford dedicated rims. I may go with RT615s on the stockers after talking to one of the experienced guys at the auto-x... he said he went to 1 or 2 autocrosses every month, and they lasted him for a year and a half. That seems good to me.....



And when it comes to struts/springs, would you guys reccomend going for a separate strut and spring setup (like.... illuminas and megan racing springs) or actual coilovers (like k-sports)?? I dunno what that does to classing, but i was curious what you guys think just from handling perspectives.

 

[mazdaspeed777]

Yah, tires are definately the first thing to get. They make a 100% difference in cornering. I just got a free set from mazda since I have the free tires for life on my P5. Here is a pic of my newby's, they are orgazmic!

 

[Foolish]

There's a guy in the FS section selling a set of 13lb wheels for $200. Get those, slap some Falken Azenis tires on them, and go racing. They're 15" wheels too, so tires are cheaper and acceleration is better. I was going to buy them but an even better deal came up locally. Plus if you do more than a few autocrosses a summer, you're going to destroy your current tires anyway, so you're actually saving money buying dedicated tires/wheels.

 

[Vanimaniac]

I have Tokico Blues and Eibachs on the Protege5. If I was more into autocrossing the car I would get something else.

I don't know specific MSP setups but anything is good for ?SP as long as it doesn't change suspension geometry. So you should be fine with whatever choices you have. I still say adjustability is key. You may not need it now but once you get to the point where you will, you'll have it.

That's my short response to suspension question by jmv.

JMV, if you can get tires, then at least good tires like the azenis would be a great benefit.

When you can save up in time, then a dedicated wheel/r-comp tire setup will help you (not necessarily make you) more competitive.

Van

 

[dmitrik4]

tires, tires, tires. your best bang/$$ is tires.

if you're on a budget, a good suspension upgrade would be the 21.5mm rear sway bar. don't waste your money on GT spec braces and whatnot. if you're going to go with coilovers, save up your money and spring for the AWR/Konis. the KSports, etc are nice blingy pieces, but not serious hardware.

 

[Coolhand]

I always thought best mod for auto-x was tires. it does seem to make the biggest difference for most people.

Great advice!!! Best bang for the buck.

 

[jmv]

There's a guy in the FS section selling a set of 13lb wheels for $200. Get those, slap some Falken Azenis tires on them, and go racing. They're 15" wheels too, so tires are cheaper and acceleration is better. I was going to buy them but an even better deal came up locally. Plus if you do more than a few autocrosses a summer, you're going to destroy your current tires anyway, so you're actually saving money buying dedicated tires/wheels.

i saw those and am considering (not sure if i have the $$$ right now). Only thing is, they're only 6" wide.... should i be looking at something else for that reason?? Or for the price, is that hard to go wrong??

 

[FlyinMSP]

Dave from Delsing used KW coilovers and Azenis (and camber plates) and said he could even beat modded BMW M3's (in autocross of course)

 

[apexlater]

Dave from Delsing used KW coilovers and Azenis (and camber plates) and said he could even beat modded BMW M3's (in autocross of course)

He shouldn't be....given the same driver.

 

[122 Vega]

Well, tires are a good choice, but I would suggest a harness, CG lock or a good seat as well. It's amazing what happens when you only have to use your arms to turn the car (not to also help keep you in place.)

The best spring IMO available for the MSp in a "stock" configuration is the Espelir. It gives the same F/R bias and is a linear rate spring (rear might be progressive, but I don't know for sure), match those with a set of Tokico Illuminas.

But the stiffer you make your suspension, the harder the tires have to work to grip, as in it puts more stress on them and you will decrease slip angle and you will overdrive the tires. I would stay with the stock springs and struts and go with a set of R-comps you will never come close to the pack in DSP if you aren't on R-comps.


Britt
Britt

 

[Tom03es]

Slide around on crappy tires for awhile until you get reasonably good at that. Then upgrade to what the Street Touring cars are using for increased grip but still not so sticky that they mask poor driving. Once you get good on the ST tires, then step up to R compounds. This is what I tell new guys that are looking to get into autoxing. I believe that the longer you stay on slippery tires, the better driver you will become when you finally get sticky tires. I've been autoxing and lapping for 4 seasons now and this weekend will be the first time I've driven on race tires- and they are just Toyo RA1 tires at that (sticky but not really sticky).

Experience from my Saturn (in order of modification):
poly bushings:
no real improvement. Might have increased steering response time some.
H&R springs:
decreased body roll. I seemed to be able to corner faster but tires would give out with little warning
front STB:
steering response was quickened by a bunch
Falken Azenis RT-215:
WOW! Grip! Tires were amazing but quickly overheated- need to spray with water between runs.
Larger, adjustable rear sway bar:
hellooooo rotation! Braking now had to be done in a straight line or else the back end would step out
Sparco Clubman harness:
no longer had to use my legs to hold me in place behind the wheel
Falken Azenis RT-615:
similar to the RT-215 tires but with better heat tolerance. Overall grip seemed to be improved as well
Corbeau Forza seat:
best mod yet. Finally a way to communicate what the chassis is doing immediately to my butt instead of having to catch it after it's gotten out of hand.
Toyo RA1 tires:
these are used Spec Miata tires I picked up at the Run Offs. They have been shaved and used but still have some decent rubber left. Only time will tell.

I have added other mods here and there as well, but these have been the biggest. I've also played with alignment settings throughout the seasons and have had good results. I run -2.5* of neg camber in the front and don't have any wear issues on the street.

 

[Lt. Dan]

Are you legal in DSP with a FMIC and wastegate actuator? I gotta start bringing my rulebook to work with me... lol