AWD or FWD, one better than the other?

[MikeM.]

Tires are more important to road grip than AWD and AWD will not help you stop any better than FWD or no-wheel-drive.

This cannot be over-emphasized!

The system in the CX-5, AFAIK, is constantly variable and reactive / on-demand system, which uses multi-plate clutch for the rear axle. It is not only when wheels slip, but also when the computer decides to transfer some of the power to the back. It does feel better in the first few feet when accelerating from a standstill, it will help you climb an icy driveway and get-out of snowed-in parking lot. From what I understand, it can send up to 50% of the power to the rear.

True. It's very good in snow and ice. It's not designed for rock crawling but, on snow and ice, it will outperform "real" 4WD systems by a large margin. On the otherhand, with good winter tires the FWD is excellent as long as there are not steep, icy, un-sanded hills or unplowed roads involved.

Last winter I tested my AWD CX-5 in 8" of unplowed wet coastal snow from hell with a crusty ice/snow layer underneath. I call it "snow from hell" because snow can only get better compared to this kind of wet, coastal snow that packs into an ice layer. The CX-5 plowed right through it like a happy puppy, even when making tight turns from a standstill up a slight grade. This demonstrated to my satisfaction that it was good at transferring power to the wheels that needed it. And on downhill, icy hairpins I could downshift the auto manually into the corner and the electronic systems would kick in to maintain as much traction as possible while keeping the car pointed in the desired direction.

But if I didn't spend most of the winter travelling to the snowiest ski area in the world, I would have preferred the FWD for it's performance, lighter weight, economy and lower cost.

 

[dad of jon]

for me I looked at it this way:

1700 pounds difference between FWD & AWD divided by the number of times I think i'd need it over my estimated 5 years of ownership. Lets say 2 days a year it would be of benefit. 2 x 5 = 10. so 1700 divided by 10 = 170 pounds for each day I need AWD. this doesn't include the higher fuel consumption. I think on those 2 days a year I'd work from home or take the day off. After all, I could be hit by someone in an out of control FWD vehicle anyway (eek2). So for me AWD doesn't make sense.

 

[xtrailman]

I recently copied all the whatcar road tests of the CX5 diesel, which covered the FWD 150, 175 AWD manual, and 175 AWD auto.

Of them all the 175 AWD auto was the quickest, economy figures were not given for all the models which is annoying, but I would assume the 150 FWD would be the most economical.

Having said that the Co2 emissions for the 150 AWD and 175 AWD are exactly the same at 136.

http://carleasingmadesimple.com/personal-car-leasing/mazda/cx-5-estate/

 

[costermonger]

...giving people with AWD a free pass to use all season radials (or, God forbid, summer tires).

Terrifying!

A buddy of mine used to sell Jeeps and he told me that about three out of four customers would get confused when he recommended snow/ice tires for the winter. Every fall there's talk of making snow tires required to drive on Ontario roads in the winter. Can't wait.

 

[Dr_Watson]

I drive around 20 days a year on snow covered roads. They are not cleared as the resources are used to keep major routes open. I was looking for FWD as with winter tyres FWD is perfectly adequate for snow driving. Winter tyres perform much better in cold weather that you are far better worrying about your tyres than getting AWD, especially with braking performance on cold roads.

In the uk, there are not that many days where AWD will Really help unless you are that idiot with bald summer tyres driving across the moor in the blizzard thinking the weather forecast can't possibly be correct. Buy a set of winter tyres or just stay at home on those days.

Then again, the uk is terrible at keeping the roads clear, even with a like flurry of snow.

 

[xtrailman]

I have to ask why buy a CX-5 with out AWD, if you want economy and performance, along with handling, then you are looking at the wrong car.

There are many "normal" cars that are quicker, cheaper, with lower Co2, ved. With far superior handling.

So cheaper to buy, cheaper to run.

I'm buying one because I'm not a boy racer, but need a vehicle to get me down a rough gravel road to my fishing venues, because the high ground clearance helps with towing off road in grass fields (CL's)

My route to a SUV has been a progressive one, having previously ran Saloons with RWD, hatchbacks with FWD, an estate with permanent 4WD,
then to a SUV with high ground clearance with the cargo space of an estate, but with part time AWD for economy, pulled by a strong economical engine.

 

[Dr_Watson]

Why even sell it with FWD or petrol then ? People want different things and can only afford certain models. Nobody really drives around the perfect car for their needs. There are plenty of people who want the higher driving position and need the ground clearance but don't need to go all out with AWD.

 

[Chas]

Thanks to all for the informative answers to my question. We ended up getting AWD because they just did not have many FWD in what my wife wanted. I guess at a certain point, they figure if you want the GT model, you are going to go all out and pay a little extra for the AWD...anyway, inventory, colors, etc dictated AWD. I guess it is also something you may be glad to have if the conditions warrant.

 

[jdbrian]

I'm late in on this one. I've just had my AWD CX5 for 2 weeks now. I came from a an 06 Subaru Forester 5speed manual. I live on a dirt road that ices up in winter. I have found that AWD is the only way to get up the icy hills. I use good winter tires without fail. I did some research on the system in the CX5 and it seems to be more sophisticated than the basic systems used by many companies until recently. I don't want to or need to go off roading in my CX5 so I'm pretty confident that it will meet my needs for winter driving. The 06 Forester did not have traction control and was very happy to swing the rear end out if you got too aggressive with the gas pedal on snow covered roads. Although it had great traction it was not as stable as a FWD car because of that trait. You needed to be careful. I'm hoping the CX5 will be less likely to do this with traction control and stability control. I do wonder how these safety systems and the transmission will work to maintain stability in slippery conditions. This is the first automatic trans. car I've ever owned so the loss of control over when and how much power goes to the wheels is going to take some getting used to in winter driving situations. FWD or AWD it's a personal decision based on need and preference. In my case after having AWD I wouldn't want to be without it. Either way the CX 5 is a sweet ride and one reason I chose it over the new Forester and RAV 4 is that the handling and overall driving feel is much more direct and it's just plain fun to drive!

 

[jginnane]

When I went to shop for a CX-5, most of the dealers in NJ were stocking/pushing AWD. "Why?" I asked. "It's more expensive, there's more maintenance expense, worse gas mileage, somewhat worse performance in 98% of driving conditions because of the weight." And besides, we already had two AWD cars -- a 2013 Acura TL SHAWD/Advance, for the wife, and a 2009 Honda Element, for domestic chores.

Besides, I grew up learning how to drive in Rochester NY, one of the snowiest places in the Western hemisphere (because of the winter "lake effect" from Lake Ontario). We're talking genuine bias-ply tires here, ladies. None of that fancy radial stuff!

They pushed, they pulled. They offered to sell me an AWD for $500 more than FWD. I said to them "You should be paying me money to take an AWD." Eventually they located an FWD and transferred it in. (Note -- this isn't the bottom CX-5 model; this is GT + tech pack.)

I'm happy as a clam. The FWD is much more responsive than I expected. I drive freely, without the sense that I'm dragging a boat anchor around.

If, when, we ever get another snow day? That 8.5" ground clearance is good enough.

(As of this Memorial Day weekend, 2500 miles.)

 

[costermonger]

I have to ask why buy a CX-5 with out AWD, if you want economy and performance, along with handling, then you are looking at the wrong car.

On the weekend I need space for a wife, a kid, two dogs and any assortment of gear. AWD doesn't make the cabin bigger.

On weekdays I need to drive to work. Cheaply, if possible. AWD makes the car more expensive to operate, even if it's a minor effect.

From November to March, I need a car that is capable on slush, snow or ice covered conditions. Snow tires and ground clearance matter, AWD does not. Maybe it would be more fun to have an AWD to thrash about in an empty, snow covered parking lot, but I can't justify the added cost for something I might do once or twice.

Now, would I be better served by three role specific cars? I'm sure there are three vehicles that would do each of those things better than the CX-5 can, but if we're gonna day dream, I'd like a lovely Ferrari too. In reality, I need one car to do those things, and the CX-5 is the best driving vehicle that fits the description and budget.

On the flip side, I have no idea why anybody would look at the CX-5 and think "that's a perfect towing vehicle!" but I'm going to assume the diesel makes a difference on that front, rather than just assume you've picked the wrong car, as you did with every FWD driver here.

 

[Dr_Watson]

So did you test drive an AWD model and reject it because it felt like you we're dragging an anchor around? With the diesel, you could tow a tank all day without feeling it!

I tested both and there was hardly any difference. The main one being the AWD had better turn in on faster corners, something mentioned by many testers.

 

[TreyP]

A) The AWD in no way feels like it is towing an anchor

B) Anyone that thinks AWD does not make any difference in snowy conditions is either an idiot or fooling themselves. My household has both AWDs and FWDs, all with good all season tires. Three guesses who made it to work on time and who was pissed off shoveling every inch of the driveway because the plow hadn't gone through yet.

 

[jabba]

B) Anyone that thinks AWD does not make any difference in snowy conditions is either an idiot or fooling themselves. My household has both AWDs and FWDs, all with good all season tires. Three guesses who made it to work on time and who was pissed off shoveling every inch of the driveway because the plow hadn't gone through yet.

Depends on your definition of "good all season tires". Winter tires are considered past their prime once you have a tread depth of 6/32". So if all season tires are below that depth, I could see how a good AWD system might help get up a snowy driveway since it can somewhat make up for a worn tire, up to a point. In my case with my FWD car, replacing my all season tires that were at 3/32 with winter tires allowed me to get out of my driveway with no issues, since I was spinning all over the place with the worn all seasons.

This is the big problem with all seasons, they are "legal" down to 2/32", but at that depth they no longer function as a winter tire. That's probably why Quebec passed that winter tire law, tabarnak!

 

[TreyP]

By good all season tires, I am referring to a FWD with quality all season tires that were bought in December and were stuck in the driveway in February, tabarnak.

 

[vroom]

Where I live, we get loads of snow. I mean, 10 feet+ during the winter. I can't count the number of times my good old Protege 5 got stuck in a snowed in parking lot after a day at work, or times I could not get out of the driveway because the plow has just pushed a foot of thick heavy white stuff at the back. So for me, AWD made all the sense in the world. I got mine late in the winter, so I haven't tested it out that much, but the times I did it made huge difference. And my CX-5 handles great at all times, NO towing an anchor feeling, and near 30 mpg with my 2.5L to boot.

I do agree though with much of what was said: AWD won't give you more control (stops, turns), good winter tires will. AWD or not, I would never drive during the winter on all seasons. Besides, it is illegal here in Quebec to do so, as mentionned by jabba, tabarnak! . There is no such thing as a good all seasons for winter. The rubber on these gets hard like plastic when it gets cold, so threads mean nothing.

In the end, it's a personal decision based mostly on where you live and your driving habits. If you get very little snow, AWD makes no sense. For me, it did. And if you think AWD would be useful, but winter tires would not, you're just fooling youreself.

 

[TreyP]

For getting moving in snowy conditions:

• AWD > FWD > RWD
• Studded snow tires > Snow tires > All season

For stopping in snowy/icy conditions:

• Studded snow tires > Snow tires > All season
• AWD = FWD = RWD

 

[costermonger]

So did you test drive an AWD model and reject it because it felt like you we're dragging an anchor around? With the diesel, you could tow a tank all day without feeling it!

I tested both and there was hardly any difference. The main one being the AWD had better turn in on faster corners, something mentioned by many testers.

No diesels in Canada yet. I found there wasn't a major handling difference between them.

B) Anyone that thinks AWD does not make any difference in snowy conditions is either an idiot or fooling themselves. My household has both AWDs and FWDs, all with good all season tires. Three guesses who made it to work on time and who was pissed off shoveling every inch of the driveway because the plow hadn't gone through yet.

I believe AWD probably does make a difference if you're going to run all seasons, but even the best all-seasons make pretty poor snow tires. My experience with snow tires on FWD cars has basically been that if the underside of the car will clear the snow, you won't get stuck (and this is definitely NOT the case with all seasons - I once got stuck in <2" of snow with Michelin pilots). AWD isn't going to help you if the front bumper is now playing snow plow (regardless of tires), so I don't see the situation where AWD is essential.

Last winter there was a storm where I was able to get my FWD, snow tire-equipped Mazda6 out of my driveway and up the street, while my neighbor's AWD, all-season equipped Imprezza got stuck.

You can definitely accelerate faster with AWD in snow, but that's a 'fun' thing (and it leads to lots of problems for people who don't understand AWD's limitations), not a safety thing.

 

[vroom]

For getting moving in snowy conditions:

• AWD > FWD > RWD
• Studded snow tires > Snow tires > All season

For stopping in snowy/icy conditions:

• Studded snow tires > Snow tires > All season
• AWD = FWD = RWD

Mostly agree with that TreyP. I would add a few things. I would argue that AWD might even be slightly worse at stopping because of the added weight. Also, studded tires are good on ice, don't do much on snow (threads are useful here), and might hamper traction on dry roads since metal has a lower friction coefficient.

 

[jdbrian]

All I can add is that IME, living on a dirt road that ices up every winter, FWD will get stuck on hills where AWD will climb them without spinning a wheel. It makes a huge difference once you reach the limits of FWD traction. How often that happens depends a lot on the conditions on any given day. I have a long driveway with a hill that I plow using a 4WD tractor. When I get stuck in 2wd it makes a huge difference to add the other 2 wheels into the mix. I guess the reason is that the added traction allows the car to keep moving and keep all the wheels pulling. The big variable is conditions. I've found that no 2 storms are ever the same in terms of the snows' consistency and the traction available. It will take some time to determine the true capabilities of any car/tire setup. As far as the AWD feeling heavy, the reason we got the CX5 instead of our second choice the Subaru Outback was that the Outback really felt like you describe. Heavy and it indeed felt like you were dragging a big weight with you. The CX5 is a much better handling, quicker responding car than the 06 forester I traded in. A joy to drive and it is putting the fun back into driving again.