What have you done to your MSP today?
- Thread starter baconbitz
- Start date
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- MSP 1145
i do have a lightweight cp.. it's the unorthodox one.. but, it's not for sale fellas.. sorry.
If you find the right dealership they will outperform any rinky dink side shop everytime
Mazdaspeed2oo35
600whp - 600wtq at 30 PSI
That's an Uderdrive. i want a oem diameter pulley.
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- MSP 1145
yeah. well i don't have issues.. there's nothing wrong with it..
Mazdaspeed2oo35
600whp - 600wtq at 30 PSI
Just getting different size belts makes it hard.. specially here that you don't find s*** about this car..
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- MSP 1145
what different sized belts?? i used the same ones.. just tightened them...
Ok guys found it. This is based from an rx7 forum (original quote from Icemark) so you will see some references there but otherwise it all transfers over to the protege trans:
Lets talk a little about tranny/gear lubes, and (I will cover rear end lubes later) about that GL rating and how it works.
API (American Petroleum Institute) service classifications range from GL-1 through GL-5, with the number indicating level of service severity. GL-1 is the least severe, and its requirements are normally satisfied with motor oil. GL-2 requirements are met with rust and oxidation inhibited oils. GL-3 through GL-5 require the addition of extreme pressure (EP) additives, with higher GL numbers indicating a higher level of EP additive. That is the only difference.
GL-4 gear lubes have half the extreme pressure additives of GL-5 lubes... it does not change anything with how slippery a gear oil is.
According to the API: GL-4 is spec'd for Manual transmissions, spiral bevel and hypoid gears in moderate service, while GL-5 is spec'd for moderate and severe service on hypoid and other types of gears and may also be used in manual transmissions.
EP additives work by forming wear-resistant compounds with the metal of the gear tooth surface. As the gears mesh, these compounds shield the gear teeth from direct metal-to-metal contact that would cause wear and damage to the gears. If too little of the active additive is present, proper protection would be compromised. Too much of this additive could cause excessive chemical corrosion of the gear surface. If an API GL-5 gear oil is used in a application where API GL-4 gear oil is called for, chemical corrosion of "yellow metal" components may occur, such as bronze synchronizers, brass bushings, etc. This may lead to shifting difficulties or shortened equipment life.
Now where that hits us, is that the both the Mazda M type (most non turbo RX-7's from SA through FC models) and the R type (RX-3,REPU, and all Turbos) transmissions have brass or bronze syncro's. So using a GL-5 in our transmissions will result in chemical corrosion of those syncros. Also toss in that gear oil that overheats (such as 250F+) most of the gear lubes start breaking down, creating high amounts of sulfuric acid entwined in the lube- a GL-5 oil and overheated gear lube means a tranny that won't shift without grinding in short order.
So now lets look at brands and how they hold up. Because the trannies and rear ends have metal to metal contact, it is important that the gear lube has sufficient shear strength through out its life. This is the thin film that protects the metal from actually rubbing on a microscopic level. A poor film shear strength and the gear lube does not protect anything.
What this shows:
Ideally a good quality gear oil will be in the gray area before and after the test. Lucas 75/90 Synthetic, at 22.35 cSt, and Royal Purple Max-Gear 75W-90, at 19.32 cSt, both exceed the maximum 18.49 cSt initial viscosity (red), failing the SAE J306 requirements for SAE 90 gear lubricants. All other gear lubricants were within the required high-temperature viscosity range prior to the KRL Shear Stability Test.
Viscosity measurements following the KRL Shear Stability Test revealed that seven gear lubes sheared down below the minimum viscosity requirements (orange), failing the shear stability requirements of the SAE J306. The two gear lubes with the largest viscosity loss, as reflected in the following graph, were Royal Purple, losing 40.6% of its viscosity, and Torco SGO Synthetic, losing 35.2% of its viscosity. Royal Purple was the only gear lube to fail both the initial viscosity requirements and the shear stability requirements. It started out too thick and ended up too thin.
So in other words, after 20 hours the royal purple and Lucas failed miserably and the Pennsoil, Mobil1, Mopar and GM oils, and Torco all lost so much viscosity that they really were not even the same weight oil anymore.
Full test here: http://www.amsoil.com/lit/g2457.pdf
So for a RX-7 tranny, I am looking at either Redline MT-90, Amsoil Severe for synthetics and for a non synthetic Castrol Hypoly (since the Valvoline are GL-5).
Anyway, a few things to remember:
All better quality gear lubes need a break in period (usually 50 to 150 miles-depending on driving conditions). It take a bit to squeeze the old oil surfaces out and to impregnate the new oil surface in.
It is not like engine oil that is constantly being forced to circulate, gear lube must be lifted into the gears by other gears that are typically submerged.
That is why I am always skeptical about people that claim Brand X oil solved all their shifting issues or rear end noise issues as soon as the changed it and just drove around the block
Lets talk a little about tranny/gear lubes, and (I will cover rear end lubes later) about that GL rating and how it works.
API (American Petroleum Institute) service classifications range from GL-1 through GL-5, with the number indicating level of service severity. GL-1 is the least severe, and its requirements are normally satisfied with motor oil. GL-2 requirements are met with rust and oxidation inhibited oils. GL-3 through GL-5 require the addition of extreme pressure (EP) additives, with higher GL numbers indicating a higher level of EP additive. That is the only difference.
GL-4 gear lubes have half the extreme pressure additives of GL-5 lubes... it does not change anything with how slippery a gear oil is.
According to the API: GL-4 is spec'd for Manual transmissions, spiral bevel and hypoid gears in moderate service, while GL-5 is spec'd for moderate and severe service on hypoid and other types of gears and may also be used in manual transmissions.
EP additives work by forming wear-resistant compounds with the metal of the gear tooth surface. As the gears mesh, these compounds shield the gear teeth from direct metal-to-metal contact that would cause wear and damage to the gears. If too little of the active additive is present, proper protection would be compromised. Too much of this additive could cause excessive chemical corrosion of the gear surface. If an API GL-5 gear oil is used in a application where API GL-4 gear oil is called for, chemical corrosion of "yellow metal" components may occur, such as bronze synchronizers, brass bushings, etc. This may lead to shifting difficulties or shortened equipment life.
Now where that hits us, is that the both the Mazda M type (most non turbo RX-7's from SA through FC models) and the R type (RX-3,REPU, and all Turbos) transmissions have brass or bronze syncro's. So using a GL-5 in our transmissions will result in chemical corrosion of those syncros. Also toss in that gear oil that overheats (such as 250F+) most of the gear lubes start breaking down, creating high amounts of sulfuric acid entwined in the lube- a GL-5 oil and overheated gear lube means a tranny that won't shift without grinding in short order.
So now lets look at brands and how they hold up. Because the trannies and rear ends have metal to metal contact, it is important that the gear lube has sufficient shear strength through out its life. This is the thin film that protects the metal from actually rubbing on a microscopic level. A poor film shear strength and the gear lube does not protect anything.
What this shows:
Ideally a good quality gear oil will be in the gray area before and after the test. Lucas 75/90 Synthetic, at 22.35 cSt, and Royal Purple Max-Gear 75W-90, at 19.32 cSt, both exceed the maximum 18.49 cSt initial viscosity (red), failing the SAE J306 requirements for SAE 90 gear lubricants. All other gear lubricants were within the required high-temperature viscosity range prior to the KRL Shear Stability Test.
Viscosity measurements following the KRL Shear Stability Test revealed that seven gear lubes sheared down below the minimum viscosity requirements (orange), failing the shear stability requirements of the SAE J306. The two gear lubes with the largest viscosity loss, as reflected in the following graph, were Royal Purple, losing 40.6% of its viscosity, and Torco SGO Synthetic, losing 35.2% of its viscosity. Royal Purple was the only gear lube to fail both the initial viscosity requirements and the shear stability requirements. It started out too thick and ended up too thin.
So in other words, after 20 hours the royal purple and Lucas failed miserably and the Pennsoil, Mobil1, Mopar and GM oils, and Torco all lost so much viscosity that they really were not even the same weight oil anymore.
Full test here: http://www.amsoil.com/lit/g2457.pdf
So for a RX-7 tranny, I am looking at either Redline MT-90, Amsoil Severe for synthetics and for a non synthetic Castrol Hypoly (since the Valvoline are GL-5).
Anyway, a few things to remember:
All better quality gear lubes need a break in period (usually 50 to 150 miles-depending on driving conditions). It take a bit to squeeze the old oil surfaces out and to impregnate the new oil surface in.
It is not like engine oil that is constantly being forced to circulate, gear lube must be lifted into the gears by other gears that are typically submerged.
That is why I am always skeptical about people that claim Brand X oil solved all their shifting issues or rear end noise issues as soon as the changed it and just drove around the block
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That's supposed to stress the belts more and not be safe.. But whatever works.
? The UD pulley will tell you the proper size belts you need to get. And you can get whatever brand belt you want, jsut make sure its the proper size. Nothing to do with "s*** for this car". I'm leaning towards getting the OBX UD this summer sometime.
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- MSP 1145
i wouldnt worry about stressing. i had it on my car for 2 years..no issues
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- MSP 1145
i dont know the size you need. but. it's written ON the belt.. very easy.. and belts are cheap, it's kinda not worth it NOT to replace them.... but you don't HAVE to if you dont have the cash.. but PLAN on doing it at some point in the near future..
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- MSP 1145
all you would need to do is take the size to the parts place.. and get like.. 5 mm or w/e the length is measured in smaller..
for instance.. if you needed a 405, get a 400.. or something along those lines.
