XEDE Engine Management System Available Soon!

[quiet desperado]

it controls a variety of factors - most notably fuel, timing and boost. the mazdaspeed3 and 6 have been found to run very conservative, rich maps which rob them of potential power. much of this is done for emissions control. by making adjustments to the fuel maps and spark timing, as well as increasing boost, you can generate more power per psi of boost at both stock and increased levels.

Running rich is for emissions control? Usually the opposite, ain't it? Lean is clean? I read in a number of comments that they run rich "to protect the turbo," though I have no idea what that is based on.

 

[turbofever]

it controls a variety of factors - most notably fuel, timing and boost. the mazdaspeed3 and 6 have been found to run very conservative, rich maps which rob them of potential power. much of this is done for emissions control. by making adjustments to the fuel maps and spark timing, as well as increasing boost, you can generate more power per psi of boost at both stock and increased levels.

During that 290whp dyno session, what was the boost pressure, total timing, and AFR?

 

[StephanieT]

Mazda typically runs it ECU maps VERY rich. They call it the built in "safety feature" (like the boost / fuel cut is also) and i have heard it referred to as emissions control too. It is not so much to protect the turbo as it is to protect the engine. Sometimes there is just no explaining what Mazda does. I have seen a speed car fail CARB inspection because it does not run the stock AFR. Instead of running 10:1 it was 12.5:1. Perfect - but not factory setting.

Tuning was done at 14 psi. And the AFR was left around 11.0 to 11.5. A little on the rich side. But powerful and safe at the same time.

When you wire something in - just take the time to do it properly and it will last a long time. I promise, it is not hard. Until recently, new injectors got wired in. Butt connectors, heatshink (solder if you are so inclined) and you're good to go. The same method is used for O2 sensor replacements and stuff like that. Chances are the clutch will start to slip before the wiring goes bad.
Stephanie

 

[Refonbass]

So again, not sound like a broken record but, this unit sometime in the relatively near future WILL be plug and play? Just not the initial units?

 

[Nutari]

So again, not sound like a broken record but, this unit sometime in the relatively near future WILL be plug and play? Just not the initial units?

yes. Later, around mid to end of january they are hoping to have the harnesess to make the XEDE plung and play. as of right now, its hardwired.

 

[II-Savy]

Man this sounds better by the minute...it makes me think bagging the MS CAI, Cat back and upgraded IC is a better idea and getting this unit instead.

 

[redms3gt]

So tuning was a 14psi, does that mean stock is lower than that or are u making more power at the same level. The most I get on a boost gauge in any gear is 13psi max holding. Spikes are higher,15-17 depending of gear. I have tested the gauge and it is spot on. Its measures at the BOV after the intercooler though. It just doesent seem like this car runs the 15.7psi number that the mags have been throwing around. I also noticed that 3rd gear always has a lower boost pressure that 4th,5th,6th. Usually 10-11psi. Will EXED be controlling or upping the boost in 2nd and up, or all gears. I think a nice function would factory boost levels with the DSC on and a full 14psi or whatever is max safe with it off in all gears. That way we could maintain good drivability for rain snow etc city driving, and have a monster on the track

 

[quiet desperado]

So tuning was a 14psi, does that mean stock is lower than that or are u making more power at the same level. The most I get on a boost gauge in any gear is 13psi max holding. Spikes are higher,15-17 depending of gear. I have tested the gauge and it is spot on. Its measures at the BOV after the intercooler though. It just doesent seem like this car runs the 15.7psi number that the mags have been throwing around. ....

From what I've read about the stock vs. ETS TMIC, the turbo could be putting out 15-16 psi and the charge is down to 13-14 by the time it exits the IC. That's how the ETS adds another 10-15 hp.

 

[redms3gt]

Mines is always 13 or less not counting spikes. Just wondering how EXED is effecting/contolling the boost per gear vs factory. I have hear the factory intercooler is pretty good and also not so good. One would think as short as the air has to travel pressure loss would be like .5psi or so..

 

[benzo]

it controls a variety of factors - most notably fuel, timing and boost. the mazdaspeed3 and 6 have been found to run very conservative, rich maps which rob them of potential power. much of this is done for emissions control. by making adjustments to the fuel maps and spark timing, as well as increasing boost, you can generate more power per psi of boost at both stock and increased levels.

Hey Cap, if I have done my home work on the turbo right (using compressor map)....the turbo is pretty close to being peaked out. So this unit will lean it out a little bit, change timing and possible boost levels. My main concern is software and longevity. Will this simply plug in and go? Can I change the timing, fuel and boost if needed at a performance shop. I basicly want my motor to be as reliable as the srt-4 stage upgrades. Thanks!

 

[shark77]

Hey Cap, if I have done my home work on the turbo right (using compressor map)....the turbo is pretty close to being peaked out. So this unit will lean it out a little bit, change timing and possible boost levels. My main concern is software and longevity. Will this simply plug in and go? Can I change the timing, fuel and boost if needed at a performance shop. I basicly want my motor to be as reliable as the srt-4 stage upgrades. Thanks!

Make sure it's a K04-22 map. As there are many variations of the K04 turbo.

The k04-01 series were putting down ~220-230whp on the 1.8T, but the k04-20 series turbo's were able to run ~265-285whp on the same motor.

So being that the k04 has a pretty wide range of ability, the k04-22 may not be as close to being maxed out as it would appear, when looking at perhaps the k04-01 series map.

 

[benzo]

Make sure it's a K04-22 map. As there are many variations of the K04 turbo.

The k04-01 series were putting down ~220-230whp on the 1.8T, but the k04-20 series turbo's were able to run ~265-285whp on the same motor.

So being that the k04 has a pretty wide range of ability, the k04-22 may not be as close to being maxed out as it would appear, when looking at perhaps the k04-01 series map.

I was looking at a k04-25 compressor map which is a slightly bigger turbo and with the motor we are running it looks like it runs out of power at about the same rpm range. So the slightly smaller turbo (22) is going to be maxed out for sure. As most reviews/dyno charts show, the power falls drasticly at about 6k rpm, which to me seems like the turbo is out of gas. Maybe I am retarded but I dont understand how we can get more power out of this motor (turbo) without changing the turbo out for a slightly bigger one. I dont know everything about this subject, I am just trying to learn more.

 

[shark77]

I was looking at a k04-25 compressor map which is a slightly bigger turbo and with the motor we are running it looks like it runs out of power at about the same rpm range. So the slightly smaller turbo (22) is going to be maxed out for sure. As most reviews/dyno charts show, the power falls drasticly at about 6k rpm, which to me seems like the turbo is out of gas. Maybe I am retarded but I dont understand how we can get more power out of this motor (turbo) without changing the turbo out for a slightly bigger one. I dont know everything about this subject, I am just trying to learn more.

I believe all k04-2X series use the same housing, the only difference is the trim.

It will be interesting with an ECU to see if the stock maps are creating the massive drop in power above 6k, or if it is strictly the turbo.

If you look at Cobb's AFR plot, you can see that the a/f ratio go really rich after 5700rpm's. Is this ECU related or hardware related is the question.

http://www.cobbforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32452

 

[Anon Y Mous]

I'll have a 3" catless ATP downpipe next week so we'll see how it affects the turbo's ability to breath up top. I have a feeling it'll be greatly improved.

 

[Captain KRM P5]

I believe all k04-2X series use the same housing, the only difference is the trim.

It will be interesting with an ECU to see if the stock maps are creating the massive drop in power above 6k, or if it is strictly the turbo.

If you look at Cobb's AFR plot, you can see that the a/f ratio go really rich after 5700rpm's. Is this ECU related or hardware related is the question.

http://www.cobbforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32452

we have dynoed a mazdaspeed6 with and without modifications and will say with the utmost confidence that extreme rich conditions under high rpm load are ECU/tuning related.

 

[Anon Y Mous]

we have dynoed a mazdaspeed6 with and without modifications and will say with the utmost confidence that extreme rich conditions under high rpm load are ECU/tuning related.

from the people I've spoken with at mazda QC that was done in an effort to keep detonation down but it doesn't make any sense.

The whole point of DISI is to lower combustion temps, atomize the fuel mixture better, dissipate more heat and leave less fuel in the combustion chamber before it's needed.

All you do with making it rich up top is stress the injectors and ruin your mileage.

The stock injectors have PLENTY of room for growth if you maintain reasonable AFR's.

 

[tsunami]

excellent discussion going on here guys keep up the good work...

would it be possible to post an image of the K04-22 map for the rest of us to see or a link? and i don't know how to do the math if it is changed for DI over a normal injection motor your still putting out the same cfm per displacement but its more efficient so does that mean the cfm changes or should it still be the same?

 

[quiet desperado]

Mines is always 13 or less not counting spikes. Just wondering how EXED is effecting/contolling the boost per gear vs factory. I have hear the factory intercooler is pretty good and also not so good. One would think as short as the air has to travel pressure loss would be like .5psi or so..

Cobb said that it does a good job of cooling. CPE in testing their FMIC confirms this but notes that the stock TMIC loses as much as 3 psi.
They also say 1-2 psi pressure loss is normal.

If anyone is interested, there is a ton of very interesting information from CPE about cooling, pressure loss, and the relationship b/t them on Mazda 6 Club in post #251 of "CPE product updates, Front mount intercooler and tuning package -- 10/11/06" thread in the Mazdaspeed6 > Speed6 Engine/Drivetrain section.

 

[ZoomVT]

im subbing cause this is a very good discussion.

 

[Captain KRM P5]

an XEDE has been on the mazdaspeed3 now for month. The car throws no CEL codes, idles and drives perfectly and makes excellent power through the RPM range. the XEDE also reads and controls MAP sensor signals as well. pics will be posted soon.