Wash. Post's Warren Brown bashes the 5!

[jandree22]

this section needs a dedicated moderator if it already does not have one.

I think maybe Perfecto is already the Moderator, but I don't remember the last time I saw him around?

 

[AIMWO4]

I have a manual with some Zoom-Zoom... If he drove the auto, I could see where he's coming from.

From his Real Wheels Discussion on Jan 25th:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/discussion/2008/01/18/DI2008011802070.html

Driver's Seat, Md.: Hi -- love your columns, and I read your minivan review with great interest. We're in need of a new car but don't need to herd huge numbers, so we're looking at the Mazda5 (now dubbed a "microvan"). Item of concern: lack of government crash tests, reflecting either poor sales or no complaints about its safety. Otherwise, it seems like a pretty good vehicle. Your thoughts, or should we be looking for something else?

Warren Brown: Look at something else for reasons that have nothing to do with intrinsic vehicle quality or safety.

The trouble with the Mazda5, despite Mazda's marketing boasts to the contrary, is that the Mazda5 lacks that inherent thing that makes a Mazda a Mazda. It somehow came off the computer assisted design screen and out of the factory into the market without a single ounce of Zoom-Zoom. In short, it's boring, uninteresting, woefully uninspired--which means, I suppose, that Mazda will not use these quotes in an advertisement.

But, perhaps, the company will use these:

Buy the Mazda CX7. It's small enough to suit your psyche and big enough to suit your needs. It's excellently styled, has ample utility, and it's fun to drive. But most of all, it has Zoom-Zoom and lots of it.

Caveat: The CX7 drives and feels like a sports car. Drivers love it. But some soft-bottomed passengers don't.

I disagree with his assessment and thought he didn't answer the question. Your thoughts/comments?

 

[starlightmica]

I'd take Warren Brown with a grain of salt, but that's just my opinion after having read his column weekly for about 7 or so years. There's hardly a car he writes a bad review about, not uncommon to the bunch of journalists who get handed a couple of new press cars weekly.

What happens if he writes a bad review? No more cares to review, advertisements from the car manufacturer and dealers get dropped, and a good chance his job goes, too. Interesting to see what he said about the Mz5 when he got a press car, contrasted to what he really thought.

In contrast, there's the LA Times' Dan Neil, who wrote a bad review of the Pontiac G6 with GM pulling $10 million in advertising over the next few months.
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Columns/articleId=105386

 

[slvrsleeper]

^^Which took some Metro bus sized cajones on his part I'm sure! I think car reviewers have their impartiality questioned about as often as the legitimacy of their lineage, especially by us rabid forum dwellers....

 

[perfecto]

I'm here - and while this thread was off-topic it has settled down just fine. I would prefer that people sort out their arguments themselves rather than resorting to locking threads just for the sake of it!

 

[rweatherford]

Good job Perfecto!

 

[brightwhite]

For another perspective (I know this was a CX-7 vs 5 thread, BUT), we just traded our 5 on a 2008 CX-9. It hurt to do, we loved the 5. It was a great car for four people, but the second you introduce a fifth person (even if that person is an infant), the 5 becomes virtually useless. While it sucked to give up a five speed, what we gained in utility for our family was well worth it.

Once you need to use that back row for actual passenger seating, you've lost the ability to carry so much as a few bags of groceries, let alone a stroller or anything bigger than 6" deep. Carrying three kids and a big dog meant not bringing ANYTHING at all. Kind of pointless for us.

I'll still recommend the 5 heartily for families under 4 people, but for us, it was no longer a useful vehicle.

 

[jandree22]

I'm here - and while this thread was off-topic it has settled down just fine. I would prefer that people sort out their arguments themselves rather than resorting to locking threads just for the sake of it!

ha, uh, hey there buddy ol' pal... (hi) o) Point taken.

 

[bulwnkl]

For another perspective (I know this was a CX-7 vs 5 thread, BUT), we just traded our 5 on a 2008 CX-9. It hurt to do, we loved the 5. It was a great car for four people, but the second you introduce a fifth person (even if that person is an infant), the 5 becomes virtually useless. While it sucked to give up a five speed, what we gained in utility for our family was well worth it.

Once you need to use that back row for actual passenger seating, you've lost the ability to carry so much as a few bags of groceries, let alone a stroller or anything bigger than 6" deep. Carrying three kids and a big dog meant not bringing ANYTHING at all. Kind of pointless for us.

I'll still recommend the 5 heartily for families under 4 people, but for us, it was no longer a useful vehicle.

This is an interesting post. We had family here for Christmas and had 7 people in our American-market 5 (5 adults; no comments about # of seatbelts vs. # of passengers, please) and still had room for all the Christmas dinner shopping. Not saying I'd want to drive cross-country that way, but we found it extremely useful. Oh, and it was also in the middle of a blizzard and we didn't have any trouble going up and down driveways or anything in the nearly knee-deep snow, either.

 

[brightwhite]

This is an interesting post. We had family here for Christmas and had 7 people in our American-market 5 (5 adults; no comments about # of seatbelts vs. # of passengers, please) and still had room for all the Christmas dinner shopping. Not saying I'd want to drive cross-country that way, but we found it extremely useful. Oh, and it was also in the middle of a blizzard and we didn't have any trouble going up and down driveways or anything in the nearly knee-deep snow, either.

Oh don't get me wrong, in a pinch I think you could get a boatload of people in there, but you wouldn't want to go on vacation that way, or even regularly get groceries that way. It's just not practical or fun to try to store a dozen grocery bags behind the third row seat.

I also don't doubt the 5's winter driving prowess. With Conti winters, ours was pretty much invincible. We put the Contis on my 3 now, and are going to run the CX-9 with the stock 20s until next winter since there's only another month or so of really bad weather and we don't *need* to get anywhere since my wife is currently on maternity leave.

 

[Hambino]

Mini-vans, regardless of make or model, are lame. Get a wagon, unless you really need to pack 100000 cu-ft of boxes in your vehicle daily.

 

[rweatherford]

I've already posted somewhere that my Mazda5 will be used for 2 adults and 3 kids and a baby. For extended trips I plan on getting a carrier to mount on a hitch. We are light packers. With 2 adults and 3 kids we put 1.5 Walmart sized carts of groceries inside with one back seat folded down and drove home 45 minutes. Everyone was happy.

In the future my wife plans on making shopping trips while the kids are in school.

 

[coolmazda5]

Mini-vans, regardless of make or model, are lame. Get a wagon, unless you really need to pack 100000 cu-ft of boxes in your vehicle daily.

No worries, I think the Mazda MPV is already discontinued, so I guess the mini-van discussion is off topic here.

Wagon, right? Mazda has come-up with a concept called Mazda5, which is a space wagon, something like a wagon but with more cargo space. It even has slide doors, so it is an awesome choice (easy get-in and get-out even in very tight places, like my garage with a toddler during Winter, not possible to do otherwise). Don't worry, it will eventually catch-up in this huge ass mini-van centric market.

Some information about this wagon, I like the comments of the 2nd article by the way:
http://media.ford.com/newsroom/feature_display.cfm?release=18884
http://www.autoblog.com/2004/08/25/mazda5-its-a-bird-its-a-plane-no-its-a-space-wagon/

 

[starlightmica]

Mini-vans, regardless of make or model, are lame. Get a wagon, unless you really need to pack 100000 cu-ft of boxes in your vehicle daily.

Minivan dad here - nothing beats a van for hauling the little kiddies. The power door on the Sienna is invaluable for dropoff/pickups, the lightweight Mazda5 slider is almost as good as the kids can manage by themselves.

Wagons are incapable (impotent, lame, whatever synonym you want to use) of holding 3 car seats while doing what I need to do with my family.

 

[jandree22]

Mini-vans, regardless of make or model, are lame. Get a wagon, unless you really need to pack 100000 cu-ft of boxes in your vehicle daily.

Yeah, gonna have to disagree as well Mini-van sliding doors are a Godsend. You cant appreciate them until youve owned them. Also on Vacation, 1 Toyota Sienna rental fit 5 adults, infant in car seat, 6 full sized suitcases, full sized stroller and pack-n-play crib comfortably. Good luck with that in a Wagon

Then again its clich to think minivans are lame, so if you dont have kids or a lot of people to haul, then maybe you wouldnt understand their value. Before the days of the WRX and P5, Ill have you remember there was a stigma against wagons, too

 

[skyhawk]

A friend moved from Years of MIniVan use to small SUV RAV4. He said nothing beats the Minivan. One reason why they wanted SUV is they wanted to try owning one.. and 'the snow sometimes get too deep in the driveway'.

 

[Captain KRM P5]

A friend moved from Years of MIniVan use to small SUV RAV4. He said nothing beats the Minivan. One reason why they wanted SUV is they wanted to try owning one.. and 'the snow sometimes get too deep in the driveway'.

shovels and snowblowers are cheaper than SUVs

 

[CX-7owner]

as many owners have stated here, the vehicle pulls just fine loaded up. and yes, as has been my argument all along, the 5 offers more features and utility for the price. i never said it offered more performance. but then again, if all i wanted was performance, the cx-7 would be a lousy choice anyways.

Such a lousy choice right? Because in a sport sedan you can carry SO much right?


this is such a fanboy level of reasoning devoid of any logic, evidence, intelligence its barely worth going after. but hey i like picking fights with fanboys on the internet so here goes. i can make it up a steep driveway layered in 4 inches of snow in my v8 mustang without snow tires, without all wheel drive, on Z rated summer tires. if you require all wheel drive to make it up a driveway in any condition in a vehicle that weighs as much as a 5, then you don't know how to drive, period. ground clearance in the rain - man i laughed at that one.

Right, if you can make it up an inclined driveway, 15 degrees in summer tires, link to a video. It has little to do with weight and a lot to do with traction, you aren't getting any traction up a driveway in a RWD mustang on summer tires. You're no more of a fanboy than me. (lol)


Rain that causes flooding, yeah you don't need any ground clearance in that.


did i mention that, for any amount of money, the cx-7 can't tow more than my 1996 dodge neon? now thats what i call utility!

What I call utility is a car that can only seat 4 if you need to carry anything more than a purse, THAT'S!!!!!!!!!!!! Utility!


which has been my entire arugment all along, thank you for actually sticking to the topic





you will never get a new CX-7 for 20k. if we're talking used cars, there are even better options than a CX-7

HAHA, get your fact's straight, ask someone that has bought a FWD Sport CX-7, stripper with no options, it can be had for $19,995+TTL! Why not get some of the hard fact's before writing s*** off?

you are the first and really only person coming in this thread acting like a cock. or a male with a small cock. perhaps this is why you bought the superb performing cx-7 (silly)? you can't expect people to be nice to you when you jump in on a conversation running your mouth like a schoolyard punk. get over yourself, you invited this on yourself. regardless, its well known by now that jump in on any thread where people remotely criticize the cx-7 or trade thier cx-7 or don't worship the cx-7. we get it, you love your cx-7. if other people don't love it, it shouldn't matter unless you're so blatantly insecure that you require affirmation from internet forum peers to prove you made a good purchase. in which case, that's terribly sad.

Nice, you insulted me, never did I insult you, but you felt the need to insult me, congratulations, you went on a level lower than mine, FYI personally insulting me shows your insecurity.

This thread was replied to by many that could not believe that someone did not like the 5. That say's a lot on it's own.

If you're questioning the CUV concept, WTF is a space wagon, seriously!

 

[Hambino]

I like huge conversion vans. It's one of those things I guess, if you have to get a van, go big and ridiculous.

3 car seats, yikes.

 

[Captain KRM P5]

Nice, you insulted me, never did I insult you, but you felt the need to insult me, congratulations, you went on a level lower than mine, FYI personally insulting me shows your insecurity.

This thread was replied to by many that could not believe that someone did not like the 5. That say's a lot on it's own.

If you're questioning the CUV concept, WTF is a space wagon, seriously!

oh look who's back for more? what took you so long? we missed you! so many more people picked apart your logic and you even forgot to quote them! i'm sure they'll feel awfully left out. i'm so flattered by your insecurity in that you just can't let me have the last word.

1) sticker to sticker, 5 starts at 18, cx7 starts at 24. special rebates, dealers that dump old stock, employee pricing. doesn't count, sorry, get over it.
2) i don't care what you do or don't believe what a competent driver can do with any vehicle on any given sunday. when you live in midwestern winters for 26+ years you learn to adapt. you live where, summerlin? as in nevada near vegas? if thats the case/same place exactly how much actual 'flooding' and 'snow' do you see up there with your cx-7?
3) you acted like a dick, thats my opinion and that of many others. you expressed your opinion regardless of whether or not we liked it. difference is, you backed my opinion up with your behavior. thanks for saving me the effort, yet again!