Wash. Post's Warren Brown bashes the 5!

[coolmazda5]

I like huge conversion vans. It's one of those things I guess, if you have to get a van, go big and ridiculous

That I understand, but if it is your daily commuter as well why waste gas when all the "big and ridiculous" is not needed (like 85% of the time), cannot park/load it in your garage, cannot get manual tranny and cannot drive like a car (boom02).

I'm just trying to figure out the logic of this thread responses after all. Coming to a Mazda5 forum owners area and say "you car sucks", "Why did you say my car sucks?" or "my car is better than yours". It is like going to a Mazda3, CX-7, CX-9, Miata or Protege forum area and tell them that Mazda5 is better and they need to see the light. Does it have any effect on what car they drive? No. Does that alienate the different car communities for free? Yes. Does everyone have different car tastes and family needs? Yes. Do I give a damn on what they drive? No, and I'm not paying for it anyway (except if you drive a Hummer, that hurts )

 

[jandree22]

Watch out guys, Im convinced CX-7's=LOVE is gonna win teh argument this time around!

Seriously pal, YOURE the one trying to make yourself tough by comparing the CX-7 to the more conservative 5 why dont you also tell us about how your bad ass self just got home from beating up a little 3rd grader. Instead of comparing apples to oranges (flawed approach just like the original reviewer), compare apples to apples. Why did you choose the inferior CX-7 when compared to the WRX Wagon, which albeit has slightly less cargo room(well, more with seats folded down), but also comes with AWD, lower center of gravity, better fuel economy, better straight-line AND handling performance, the seemingly endless availability of aftermarket performance upgrades, and the option of a MT instead of a slushbox? Oh thats right, you clearly NEEDED the marginal extra cubic feet of storage thats it, right? (lol2)

If youre not the poster boy of someone with a serious inferiority complex issue

 

[Captain KRM P5]

every single one of his points and arguments has been soundly defeated by numbers, facts and reality. it took him a week between responses to come back with the witless nonsense that is his trademark. its not even a debate anymore, its him merely changing up his argument with opinions and loopholes to try and hold ground.

i'm more interested in going at it with this smear campaign fanboy because it frankly entertains me to see how virulent and aggressive he gets over his car's superiority. not just here, but everywhere. anytime someone makes fun of the cupholders in the cx-7 hes on it like a PR rep with a nose full of coke. i love it when people say they are trading the car in for something like an RDX, guy pops blood vessels in thier threads. god forbid people don't agree, god forbid people don't like the car.

but hey cx-7 facts remain cx-7 facts - it doesn't have as much utility, it doesn't have as much cargo room, it doesn't carry as many people, it isn't as inexpensive, it doesn't and physically cannot do what other trucks/suvs in the same price segment does, it doesn't have a manual transmission, it requires more expensive fuel, its detuned compared to its actual sporty cousins, and there are more powerful better optioned better handling and more useful crossoverutilitytruckquasihalfassallwheeldrivecarthings available for the same dollar.

if he loves his cx-7, all power to him. but hating, unjustifiably so, and trying to win people over is making him look more and more like the moron he is every time he clicks "post"

 

[mazdadude]

LOL, What a fun read.

Can we just start a new thread titled "CX-7=Love Bashes the Mazda5"?(doughpoke

Or is Warren Brown the poster CX-7=Love? (sssh)

Seriously though, this is what I love about Mazda's, they invoke passion, and emotion. I have never seen anyone argue the virtues of their Ford Explorer, and how much better it is then the other persons Ford Aerostar. (fight)

 

[Captain KRM P5]

i've actually owned an Aerostar what a total POS

but it still had more cargo room, a larger engine, more seating capacity, more towing capacity than a CX-7. sorry, it comes naturally at this point.

 

[SuperStretch18]

You guys are making me think I should have bought a 5 instead!

And holy crap mazdadude, that is an impressive list of previous cars in your sig! Mazda should send you an RX-8! or a cookie or something, jeez!

 

[Captain KRM P5]

You guys are making me think I should have bought a 5 instead!

cx7s=love will hang you for even daring speak of such blasphemy! repent sinner!

seriously, if you like your car there is nothing wrong with that. i know people with Aveos, Calibers, and Accents who think they are the greatest cars ever. but trying to prove its superiority and going ape feces on people when they don't agree just smacks of being at best arrogant and at worst totally insecure. especially when you fight arguments that you have no chance of winning. its not even that I have an issue with the cx7 at this point, its pretty much just me enjoying the confrontational aspect that this lunatic provides hell i don't think i had a real issue with the cx7 until this guy came along.

 

[WhiteStar III]

compared to the CX-7 It's missing available AWD,

While it normally operates as de facto front-drive, the Mazda can only can route up to 50 percent of its available motive force rearward
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/suv/112_0610_crossover_comparison/specs_pricing.html

ground clearance, it's not dynamically the same, it's down on cargo space compared to the CX-7(with the second row folded down the CX-7 offers 58 cubic feet of space, the 5 has 44 cubes)

NO!

Cargo capacity is meager with six aboard, with maybe 15 cubic feet of space, but ditch a couple of passengers, fold the third-row seats and that grows to 44.4 cubic-feet. (Because the EPA classifies the 5 as a station wagon, the third row isnt counted, and cargo room is measured behind the first two rows.) Kicking out a couple more passengers and stowing all the rear seats creates a space deep enough to swallow anything up to 63 inches long (89 cubic-feet).

http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060605/FREE/60526002

I've said that before, it DOES handles better, and offers far more power for a more fun to drive experience. There isn't really much zoom zoom for the 5, the MT option is great, but it needs way more power. 0-60 in 10 seconds is boring and lacks Zoom Zoom.

it propelled our 3908-pound tester to 60 mph in a respectable 8.0 seconds en route to a 16.0-second/84.6-mph quarter mile.

According to ItelliChoice MZ5 manual is 8.53s (9.4s for the auto according to http://www1.jacksonville.com/autos/stories/012806.shtml ) & 16.59 @ 84.53mph
http://www.intellichoice.com/report...149/section/specs/type/used/2006/Mazda/Mazda5

CX-7 MAZDA5
Lateral Accel .79 .78

http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070119/FREE/70111008/1007/FREE

Psst, DISLIKES Cheap interior materials & check out the Curb weight/GVWR (lbs): 3929/4780


Which likely only surprises you but youve got more weight with a higher center of gravity.

The only thing the CX-7 lacks compared to the 5 is sliding doors, and a third row.

You dont have children do you?

AWD is not meaningless, it's something that can be of assistance over FWD, like going up steep driveways, something FWD can't do in snowy climates, and ground clearance matters in the snow,

Psst 95% of the time your FWD too & if that was such a worry, you should have chosen a more performance oriented SUV that offers full time 4WD, locking diffs and traction aids like hill ascent/decent and offer same or better 0-60 & skidpad #s (4Runner, Pathfinder, etc.)

and in the rain. Rain that causes flooding, yeah you don't need any ground clearance in that.

Do you also pack dyes or floats to measure the currents?

 

[skyhawk]

regarding the TCS or traction control which the MZ5 does not have and i guess the CX7 does have, I drove my friends ford escape to experience the traction control. It's cool. But what it actually does is to 'take over control of the gas' when the roads become slippery. In short, it effectively 'slows down the vehicle'. I can do the same with the MZ5. I can feel when the tire starts to slip and I ease up on the gas.. And with winter tires, I can fine tune my gas pedaling to walk the fine line between slipping and gripping...
or I can stay conservative and simply slow down like the CX7 beside me.

 

[Captain KRM P5]

traction control on mazdas is pretty much the brakes applying themselves when the wheels spin. its really not needed on front wheel drive cars (cadillac was the first to have this option in the 80s and it took a while to catch on). i find it easier to drive with the TCS off in my wifes car in bad weather than with it on.

you can put all the gadgets and gizmos in a car of any price and a bad driver will still be a bad driver. knowing the elements and how to drive will always trump technology.

 

[jandree22]

you can put all the gadgets and gizmos in a car of any price and a bad driver will still be a bad driver. knowing the elements and how to drive will always trump technology.

well said... (stupid)

 

[SuperStretch18]

traction control on mazdas is pretty much the brakes applying themselves when the wheels spin. its really not needed on front wheel drive cars (cadillac was the first to have this option in the 80s and it took a while to catch on). i find it easier to drive with the TCS off in my wifes car in bad weather than with it on.

you can put all the gadgets and gizmos in a car of any price and a bad driver will still be a bad driver. knowing the elements and how to drive will always trump technology.

Yah, honestly, I wish I could permanently turn TCS off!

I actually couldn't agree with you more. I lived in NJ for 26 years, until I moved to FL. Never owned a set of snow tires, chains or whatever. Drove a dodge neon for four years, a festiva before that (don't ask) and never had any issues in a little snow or even a lot of snow, unless it was deep enough to actually catch the bumper...

 

[WhiteStar III]

traction control on mazdas is pretty much the brakes applying themselves when the wheels spin. its really not needed on front wheel drive cars (cadillac was the first to have this option in the 80s and it took a while to catch on). i find it easier to drive with the TCS off in my wifes car in bad weather than with it on.

you can put all the gadgets and gizmos in a car of any price and a bad driver will still be a bad driver. knowing the elements and how to drive will always trump technology.

As you mention it depends on the vehicle and depends on the traction control system. For RWD Id like to have it in the absence of a LSD and it is more common now as it is cheaper to produce (open diffs with the ABS acting as an electronic LSD) for 4WD vehicles its also the addition of the yaw sensor (skid control) to reduce rollover where it makes the most sense. FWD with good tires and ABS is adequate in most situations.

Now I agree that all of that is no substitute for common sense, know the conditions of the road, your tires, your speed, etc. but it my opinion if you are truly a good driver it causes no harm and will be imperceptible, if youre a bad driver with it youll likely be worse without it.

 

[dbthompson]

Warren is back on the Mazda5 bandwagon now

I think that Warren had a temporary slip when he dissed the 5 a few weeks back. I've read him for probably more than 10+ years, and I find him one of the most entertaining auto writers. We disagree on many things (he's a lot shorter than I), but I trust his judgment in many ways. He also makes interesting cultural observations. And he's always fighting for what he thinks is right

Here's two quotes from today's chat:

"Washington, D.C.: Hi Warren, on your advice we bought a Mazda3 in 2005 and love the car. It is fun to drive and perfect for living in the city. We now have a baby on the way and are thinking about something a little bigger, but still a good city car. We're considering the Mazda6 and Toyota Matrix. Any thoughts on these and any other suggestions for cars we should check out? Thanks.

Warren Brown: Good morning, everybody. Good morning to everybody, except you folks at AOL. You are driving me nuts! D.C. Here's the deal, D.C. It's not hip. But it works as well as your Mazda 3. Go with the Mazda5. You won't be sorry. "

"Arlington, Va.: We are expecting our first child and want to get a new car. I have narrowed the choices down to the Outback wagon (base model) and the Mazda5 (touring.) This is how I see it:
Outback Positives: AWD, 170hp engine, solid
Outback Negative: Room for only 5
Mazda5 Positives: Room for 6, economical, sliding doors, good size
Mazda5 Negatives: Small engine -- reviews say it struggles when loaded
Which would you pick? The AWD is not a deal breaker. I am concerned about the small Mazda5 engine. Many reviews mention it struggles when loaded and on the highway.

Warren Brown: Congrats on your expected New Arrival. Forget the buff book criticisms that the Mazda5 struggles when loaded. Many small-engine cars struggle when loaded, which is why it's best not to overload them. The Mazda5 provides adequate acceleration in most driving environments, loaded and unloaded. It's no racer. It's not supposed to be. It's a family hauler, and that is what it does quite efficiently."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/discussion/2008/02/01/DI2008020101900.html

 

[coolmazda5]

^^ (lol2) Look at all the trouble he made us go through. We already alienated 0.03% of the CX-7 owners because of that old bashing.

Forget it, he won't be on my Season's Greetings friend's card list this year (but the CX-7 owners in this forum will)

 

[mrbwa1]

I actually couldn't agree with you more. I lived in NJ for 26 years, until I moved to FL. Never owned a set of snow tires, chains or whatever. Drove a dodge neon for four years, a festiva before that (don't ask) and never had any issues in a little snow or even a lot of snow, unless it was deep enough to actually catch the bumper...

I agree that FWD cars seem to do quite well in the snow. I had an old '77 Volvo RWD that required snow tires for the winter, and even then just rears got it about everywhere. Moving to FWD cars, I went years without snows. I'm glad I went back though, as it can get pretty icy here for the evening commute in winter and the good quality modern snows help a bit with the stopping.

I have a hard time with people who discount a car without TCS/ESP. We drove for years without ABS, and now it's a sin to not have it. Well, my '01 Toyota ECHO doesn't have ABS and I'm more confident in it's feel than the 5. For a panic stop, I'd prefer the ABS though; I just have to get used to the ABS "feel". TCS would be a wasted extra on the 5. Both the Manual and Automatic trannies can be started from 2nd gear to limit wheel spin. If you can't get it going from a stop in 2nd, then you probably shouldn't be driving in the snow (It's either that bad, or you need some practice).

I can see some merit in having ESP (skid control), but then again, I was taught to abuse the limits in an open, icy parking lot so that I wasn't scared if it happened in real life. I've driving a couple cars with ESP and I'm already reacting to a skid when it does, and that feeling of the car coming to a quick halt to straighten out is a weird feeling to me. Again, I could probably adapt to it, but I know I would hate it, as I have enough testosterone to still like to "refresh" myself with open parking lot antics.

And while some may think that parking lot snow slides and brodies are stupid, the feelings I have found from that have saved me from a few accidents. Ironically, the few times I really have needed those skills, I was pushing the limits harder than I should have anyway. I will add though that I would never do that kind of showboating on the streets, as I nearly wrecked a few cars in my early driving days doing just those stupid things!

 

[jandree22]

I don't understand how the guy can have SO much hatred for the car one day, then such a proponent a week later? Must've either had an off day or read through this thread? (lol2)

Weird, whatever. Just glad he's talking sense again... no it's not a race car, yes, it's a completely competent family hauler.

 

[slvrsleeper]

The anti-5 Warren Brown was actually a poster known on these boards as CX7=love. When the REAL Warren Brown saw what a ruckus his impersonator had caused he began a blitz of 5 owner ass-kissing to save face. Oh and he gave CX7=love a melvin for getting him in hot water.

 

[schokie]

I originally posted Warren Brown's comments and thought it might get a few comments. Never did I imagine it would turn into a 7 page thread! I did send Warren Brown my email (from the 1st page in this thread) and he never directly responded. Whatever happened, Brown's tune does seem to change in last week's article with his first two responses. At least the 5 is back in his head on a good note. With the improvements for 08, I really do think it is a nice automobile at an excellent (for US) price point.

 

[jandree22]

With the improvements for 08, I really do think it is a nice automobile at an excellent (for US) price point.

So you're saying 06-07 5's are junk, huh? So we're idiots for not getting an 08, is that it?! You smug bastard...






...I KEEED, I keed! I know what you're saying, just bustin your chops (lol2)