AuburnMSPfreak
Member
- :
- 2003.5 Laser Blue Mica MSP
Just wondering if dropping my MSP would kill the handling or not? Thanks
Springs, good for handling or bad?
- Thread starter AuburnMSPfreak
- Start date
Stiffer spring rates = less body roll, better handling, rougher ride
Linear springs = equal coil separation throughout the spring (look at coilover pictures to see good examples of linear springs). Good for handling and ride because you get the same spring rate througout the spring.
Progressive springs = Decreasing gap in coils from top to bottom. Bad for handling, good for ride. The ride in a straight line is softer because you are using the top of the spring, which has a lower spring rate. When you turn, the top of the spring compresses and you get down to the lower part of the spring, which gives you a higher spring rate. Bad in my opinion because like toucci said above, they are unpredictable.
If you look at most of the lowered cars driving around, you'll notice a single, slight bounce in them when they go over bumps in the road. This is the result of progressive springs. A car with linear springs won't tend to bounce.
Check out this thread for a listing of most springs, rates, drops, etc.
http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=123617848&page=3&pp=10
Linear springs = equal coil separation throughout the spring (look at coilover pictures to see good examples of linear springs). Good for handling and ride because you get the same spring rate througout the spring.
Progressive springs = Decreasing gap in coils from top to bottom. Bad for handling, good for ride. The ride in a straight line is softer because you are using the top of the spring, which has a lower spring rate. When you turn, the top of the spring compresses and you get down to the lower part of the spring, which gives you a higher spring rate. Bad in my opinion because like toucci said above, they are unpredictable.
If you look at most of the lowered cars driving around, you'll notice a single, slight bounce in them when they go over bumps in the road. This is the result of progressive springs. A car with linear springs won't tend to bounce.
Check out this thread for a listing of most springs, rates, drops, etc.
http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=123617848&page=3&pp=10
I'd argue that dropping the MSP would decrease the handling in most cases. The handling is already very top notch from the factory with some really nice parts.. The springs and struts on there are already well matched. If you lower the car (and increase the spring rate), you will not be optimally using the strut's dampening ability.
The only way I'd drop the car is to go with a high quality (JIC when I eventually do it) coilover, and I would likely leave the ride height about the same, maybe 1/2" lower. If there is some aspect of the handling that you don't like, it's likely more effective to make other changes than mess with the ride height - try adjusting pressures in the tires (can make a HUGE difference to changing the turn-in / understeer / oversteer), or change the rear sway bar size... If it's looks you're going for over handling, then pick your spring and lower away.
The only way I'd drop the car is to go with a high quality (JIC when I eventually do it) coilover, and I would likely leave the ride height about the same, maybe 1/2" lower. If there is some aspect of the handling that you don't like, it's likely more effective to make other changes than mess with the ride height - try adjusting pressures in the tires (can make a HUGE difference to changing the turn-in / understeer / oversteer), or change the rear sway bar size... If it's looks you're going for over handling, then pick your spring and lower away.
tiwing, have you measured overall strut travel on the protege? I wouldn't claim decreasing ride height by .5" decreases strut travel by too much until you have. You may be right, but you have no data to prove it, so measure it and share the info 
Plus, a few people here, myself included, feel the OEM MSP Tokico struts are a tad overdampened for the OEM springs, so increasing spring rate a little isn't such a bad change. There is a good selection of springs that will increase handling on the MSP, I'm not sure why you'd say different(other than the concern with limited strut travel).
Plus, a few people here, myself included, feel the OEM MSP Tokico struts are a tad overdampened for the OEM springs, so increasing spring rate a little isn't such a bad change. There is a good selection of springs that will increase handling on the MSP, I'm not sure why you'd say different(other than the concern with limited strut travel).
spacemonkey
Member
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- Mazdaslow
http://www.msprotege.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=64773
why is the Mazda Motorsport coilovers so weird. A lower 275 up front and a stiffer 325 in the back? It should be stiffer up front.
Thanks for the info guys. im going to buy some ground control. I did not know about progressive or variable spring rates. I always thought they were the best since top notch coilovers use them for rear springs...i.e. KW and certain Tannabe models.
why is the Mazda Motorsport coilovers so weird. A lower 275 up front and a stiffer 325 in the back? It should be stiffer up front.
Thanks for the info guys. im going to buy some ground control. I did not know about progressive or variable spring rates. I always thought they were the best since top notch coilovers use them for rear springs...i.e. KW and certain Tannabe models.
UnNaturalinc
Formerly"HorsepowerFreak"
- :
- '03.5 MSP, '87 RX-7 TII, '80 Chevy Luv, '05 Honda CRF230
To add to what has been already said....
Some companies make springs just to drop it. Intrax isn't really known for a performance oriented spring, more of a big drop.
Tanabe also makes a few different grades of springs (not for the Protege, but in general) for looks, street performance, and racing.
Most off the shelf springs are going to be aimed at a street driven application with around 30% increase with a mildly lowered stance (usually 1.5").
Some companies make springs just to drop it. Intrax isn't really known for a performance oriented spring, more of a big drop.
Tanabe also makes a few different grades of springs (not for the Protege, but in general) for looks, street performance, and racing.
Most off the shelf springs are going to be aimed at a street driven application with around 30% increase with a mildly lowered stance (usually 1.5").
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I've been resarching about differrent suspension setups for awhile as I've considered lowering it and so on... At the end, I've been finding that suspension is a very complicated matter and by putting stiffer springs and lowering the car it doesn't automatically translate into better handling.
It would probably be so if you always drive on very nice roads but where I live that's only a dream. One of the job of the suspension is to keep the tires always into contact with the road with as little distortion as possible. On bad roads, if you have springs to stiff you'll be bouncing off bumps and bottoming in potholes, therefore losing handling. That's why rally cars have lots of suspension travel for gravel roads (look at their wheel gap!!). Sure, a set of fully adjustable coilovers let you dial in the right specs for the road contitions: type and state of the surface and you'll also have to think about dry/wet/snow-ice...
The stock suspension is already a very good compromise, I think it's hard to do better unless you live in an area that is ok for a stiffer setup. Unfortunatly, I don't.
It would probably be so if you always drive on very nice roads but where I live that's only a dream. One of the job of the suspension is to keep the tires always into contact with the road with as little distortion as possible. On bad roads, if you have springs to stiff you'll be bouncing off bumps and bottoming in potholes, therefore losing handling. That's why rally cars have lots of suspension travel for gravel roads (look at their wheel gap!!). Sure, a set of fully adjustable coilovers let you dial in the right specs for the road contitions: type and state of the surface and you'll also have to think about dry/wet/snow-ice...
The stock suspension is already a very good compromise, I think it's hard to do better unless you live in an area that is ok for a stiffer setup. Unfortunatly, I don't.
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